Author Topic: Who is the rightful heir?  (Read 340564 times)

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aleksandr pavlovich

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #585 on: June 25, 2010, 06:02:51 AM »
Ah, "richard 1990" and your Reply # 584:  Your comments about the "erratic" succession to the Russian throne, reminds me of a quote (author unknown to me, at least at present):  "The Russian throne is neither hereditary, nor elective.....it is usurperatory."   Regards,  AP.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2010, 06:06:53 AM by aleksandr pavlovich »

toscany

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #586 on: June 25, 2010, 09:40:08 AM »
Ah, "richard 1990" and your Reply # 584:  Your comments about the "erratic" succession to the Russian throne, reminds me of a quote (author unknown to me, at least at present):  "The Russian throne is neither hereditary, nor elective.....it is usurperatory."   Regards,  AP.

Pretty much in agreement here, Aleksandr Pavlovich. However, what of this word, usurperatory?  Would you be so kind as to elaborate on this definition?

When you look at the 'big picture', I am not so sure that Putin would wish for a monarch to live in the restored Alexander Palace.  Further, I am not so sure that a monarch would choose to live there either.

I have made many trips to the UK and Ireland, on spiritual tours, that have taken me through many castles.  The hiers of these homes find it extremely expensive to maintain.  Many of them simply renovate a condominium style of living in a portion of the castle, and allow tourists to come through, as part of The National Trust.  This way they can keep their properties as part of their inheritance. We know that there would be funds to maintain Alexander Palace.

I am inclined to agree with Lisa Davidson's outlook on the young Prince Rostislav Rostislavovich Romanov. He represents the line of Alexander III, through his great grandmother Xenia Alexandrovna Romanova. He is in good standing with all of the Romanov relations, and attends royal gatherings by invitation. People know of him.

There are others out there, however, that may not be recognized or wish to have nothing to do with the turmoil of the family. I will step out on a limb here, because I am a believer, and mention that there was the daughter of Prince Nicolas Dolgoruky and Cecile Czapska (aka Grand Duchess Maria Nikolaevna), Olga-Béata (b.1927). Her son, Alexis d'Anjou Romanov-Dolgorouki, Duke of Durazzo (1946-1995), has a son living in Europe. I am aware that he does not even know he is a Romanov, though many of you would say that he is not. I have read Alexis' book, and find it both with credence and authenticity. There are still many supporters of Alex. When he was living, he occupied the position as a Russian, for the Soveriegn Order for Saint John of Jerusalem.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceclava_Czapska

http://www.elpais.com/articulo/internacional/UNIoN_SOVIeTICA/zarina/hijas/sobrevivieron/matanza/familia/imperial/rusa/elpepiint/19800210elpepiint_1/Tes/

http://www.orderofsaintjohn.info/

I am one that believes there are descendants in the world today, under alias names they were given at birth with their parents.  After learning about all the victims of the Stalin era, and how he sent his KGB around the world to silence exiled Russians that were not supportive of him, there is room for other theory and considerations. Due to the fact that the Romanoff Family Association does not entertain claimants, one can imagine the costs of going public, and having the support to do so.

The old laws regarding the succession should also be left up to interpretation.  This has been stated by the current president, Nikolai Romanovich
 of the RFA, for there is no Tsar to approve or deny marriages or divorces, and there are not enough royals to marry! In the interim, it is up to the people of Russia to make the overture of a return. They may never decide to do so.

aleksandr pavlovich

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #587 on: June 25, 2010, 09:56:05 AM »
Re Reply # 586:   Hello!  Not having the printed quote in front of me, the CORRECT/CORRECTED spelling is "usurpatory."  Obviously, it comes from the verb " usurp" ("to seize or hold with force an office, position, etc., without legal right"). That's what results I get for typing so early in the morning!  Nice to hear from you again!  Regards,  AP.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2010, 10:12:53 AM by aleksandr pavlovich »

toscany

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #588 on: June 25, 2010, 10:10:30 AM »
Re Reply # 586:   Hello!  Not having the quote in front of me, the CORRECT/CORRECTED spelling is "usurpatory."  Obviously, it comes from the verb " usurp" ("to seize or hold with force an office, position, etc., without legal right"). That's what results I get for typing so early in the morning!  Nice to hear from you again!  Regards,  AP.

Thank you for the clarification, AP.  I like the "without legal right" part.

Offline richard_1990

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #589 on: June 25, 2010, 11:20:27 AM »
Is this ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexis_Brimeyer ) the person you're talking about SirJohnGaines? An imposter? Btw, a very appropriate quote AP.

toscany

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #590 on: June 25, 2010, 11:26:43 AM »
Is this ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexis_Brimeyer ) the person you're talking about SirJohnGaines? An imposter? Btw, a very appropriate quote AP.

Yes, I speak of him.

Offline JonC

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #591 on: June 26, 2010, 12:03:00 PM »
" that there are no direct descendants of the Anointed line of Nicholas 2nd himself which makes the Pauline laws null and void. Of course , again, I'm NOT one who holds such a conviction. JonC.  "

Share your thoughts with us JonC.
Which child survived to give us direct descendants?


Well, discussions of ' Joseph LoPresti's ' claims have been prohibited on this forum for years but I think I can give you a link to his web page which will clue you in on what he claims.

' www.home.earthlink.net/~alexofdenmark '

Presently, to update, a ' Y Chromosome ' analysis is in the works on the male descendants from who he has claimed to be Alexie, who are still alive or else he has to exhume his grandmother, Josephine, who he claims to be ' Anastasia '. I'm sure that will put an end of sorts. Either that his claim is true or that it is false because if the analysis proves a match it has to be true, grouped with his other documentation and photographs. Also how likely would it be that Tsar Nicholas 2nd would have children other than OTMA running around the world. JonC.

Offline richard_1990

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #592 on: June 27, 2010, 12:11:21 AM »
I've noticed lately that those people who refuse to accept the DNA analysis done by the Russian/British scientists as legitimate point to some conspiracy conducted by the Russian government. Look at the bottom of that website JonC where the webhost says "[...] so that everyone who has a voice can express their outrage on the Russian government for continuing to hide the truth." Why would they need to hide the truth? The Russian government has no problem meeting with Maria Vladimirovna and her family, or Nicholas Romanov and his family.

This particular case strikes me as being absurd than most others. Claiming that the Empress herself survived is rather absurd - why didn't she contact her family? Why didn't she contact the other surviving Romanov's?

Also, could anyone explain the conspiracy theorist line that the Russian government has something to hide?

edit: JonC that site is ridiculous. Check this photo ( http://home.earthlink.net/~alexofdenmark/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/kaiserandemanuele.jpg ), the website claims that this is a photo of his grandfather "Emanuele" with Kaiser Wilhelm II... that's laughable. That man is not kaiser wilhelm.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2010, 12:16:40 AM by richard_1990 »

Offline JonC

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #593 on: June 27, 2010, 07:06:13 PM »
You are
I've noticed lately that those people who refuse to accept the DNA analysis done by the Russian/British scientists as legitimate point to some conspiracy conducted by the Russian government. Look at the bottom of that website JonC where the webhost says "[...] so that everyone who has a voice can express their outrage on the Russian government for continuing to hide the truth." Why would they need to hide the truth? The Russian government has no problem meeting with Maria Vladimirovna and her family, or Nicholas Romanov and his family.

This particular case strikes me as being absurd than most others. Claiming that the Empress herself survived is rather absurd - why didn't she contact her family? Why didn't she contact the other surviving Romanov's?

Also, could anyone explain the conspiracy theorist line that the Russian government has something to hide?

edit: JonC that site is ridiculous. Check this photo ( http://home.earthlink.net/~alexofdenmark/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/kaiserandemanuele.jpg ), the website claims that this is a photo of his grandfather "Emanuele" with Kaiser Wilhelm II... that's laughable. That man is not kaiser wilhelm.


As I said, discussions are not allowed about Mr. LoPresti. You make unqualified statements about how ' ridiculous ' his site is. So I'm compelled to reply. First of all the Russian govt., ingratiates Maria because she isn't of Nicholas 2nd's line or of any Pauline legitimate line. Eliminating the legitimate line with bones collected in an unscientific, contaminated way which no court on earth could or would consider valid IF it were ever taken to court was the only way the Russian, American and British govts., could collude together in order to establish democracy in Russia...my opinion of course....These governments needed to have Russia to grow and move on with freedom and democracy. Eliminating the Romanov issue from the minds of the Russian people was a valiant effort in order to free Russians from their historical capacity to be subservient to totalitarianism, and also, on the other hand, to rebuild the palaces and Romanov imagery so that Russians could be proud of their history, creating a foundation for a new world and a new hope for the future.

All this, though, doesn't take away the reality that the Royal Family could still have survived as Mr. LoPresti is trying to prove even now with his ' Y Chromosome ' analysis. Sorry if this offends anyone but I have an open mind about this and am eagerly awaiting the results. JonC.

Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #594 on: June 27, 2010, 08:17:52 PM »
The vast majority  have not interest whatsover in the Romanovs, so it would take  very little effort to get their minds off them. I am sure they do not sit around debating who the "rightful heir" is.
Life may not be the party we expected, but while we are here, might as well dance..

Do you want the truth, or my side of the story ?- Hank Ketchum.

Offline richard_1990

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #595 on: June 27, 2010, 11:45:06 PM »
Thanks for the reply JonC. But, just look at the photographs on his website. None of them are the people he says they are.

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #596 on: June 28, 2010, 12:42:06 AM »
I feel like a hostess whose guests have abused her hospitality. We have been clear about why we don't allow imposter discussions any more. It's no big secret - the owner of this site, Bob Atchison, the Forum Administrator, and all of us who have worked over the years with Bob, all agree that the results of the testing on the 2007 remains as well as those excavated in 1991 conclusively prove that none of the Imperial Family imprisoned at the Ipatiev House survived.

In spite of this, discussion about impostors continues on legitimate threads such as this one. It's a big wide web out there, folks, so you are welcome to take your faux Romanov beliefs out there. Just not here. This is my first and only warning - all faux Romanov advocacy will be deleted and perps reported to the FA.

To the rest of our well behaved members and guests, I apologize for the misbehavior of some of the others.

Offline JonC

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #597 on: June 28, 2010, 08:59:38 AM »
Dear Lisa, the question of just who the imposter(s) are is still arguable in my mind. In all fairness to me I did warn Richard and others NOT to talk about this topic on this forum because of the policy you mention. JonC.

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #598 on: July 16, 2010, 01:28:47 AM »
Indeed, you did Jon C. So, let's get back to the topic.

Offline Vecchiolarry

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Re: Who is the rightful heir?
« Reply #599 on: July 16, 2010, 08:20:13 AM »
Hi,

BTW, what is the topic anyway??
Oh yes, "Who is the Rightful Heir?" - -

ME !!!
For the one and only reason that I've been to Russia 6 times and
I'd love to live in the Winter Palace, if only to run up & down The Jordan Staircase (my favourite place on Earth!!).....

Sorry Lisa - now back on topic.
And, you can spank me the next time we meet;  and I'm sure you will!!!

Larry