Author Topic: AA and FS  (Read 64309 times)

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Offline Annie

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #285 on: December 13, 2004, 01:52:05 PM »
Thank you for the report, that sounds so interesting! When they showed Carl Maucher, did they say anything about him being maternally related?

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #286 on: December 13, 2004, 02:23:59 PM »
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Thank you for the report, that sounds so interesting! When they showed Carl Maucher, did they say anything about him being maternally related?

They said that this was FS's maternal nephew and explained how this would be relevant to the results...

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #287 on: December 13, 2004, 06:28:31 PM »
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I just received an email from a researcher who claims that Gertrude made the comment about being FS's half sister in her deposition during the AA trial. I've got to get a hold of her testimony to see whether that's true or not....  


Any luck locating Carl Maucher, Jeremy?

Offline Annie

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #288 on: December 15, 2004, 06:44:48 AM »
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They said that this was FS's maternal nephew and explained how this would be relevant to the results...


That's what I was thinking, WHY would they even bother with someone who wasn't? I'm sure they checked it out before they wasted any time and money testing him.

Offline AGRBear

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #289 on: December 15, 2004, 11:53:18 AM »
But he wasn't, if  Gertrude and FS had different mothers, who were not related to each other  [sisters, first cousins....].

AGRBear
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Offline Annie

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #290 on: December 15, 2004, 11:59:40 AM »
But we don't know that he wasn't. I am more likely to believe he is, since the scientists and researchers said he was, and the DNA was a good match.

Offline Forum Admin

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #291 on: December 15, 2004, 12:08:09 PM »
whether or not Carl M. was maternally or paternally related is not really of as major a consequence as Agr seems to think. Why?
Because their mtDNA matched EXACTLY. Thus, they were at least related maternally at some point within the last ten-fifteen generations. Without question, there IS some relationship between AA (whoever she was) and the FS FAMILY even if she wasn't FS herself.
AND, don't forget, the likelihood that she WAS FS is 96%. So we are only even talking about a 4% probabilty otherwise.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #292 on: December 15, 2004, 12:11:55 PM »
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But he wasn't, if  Gertrude and FS had different mothers, who were not related to each other  [sisters, first cousins....].

AGRBear


We really don't know this for a fact - it has been speculated that they weren't full sisters, but until we can get factual information and not hearsay about that, we have to assume that they were full sisters - as I am sure that the scientists must have done at least some inquiries about that before they chose Carl Maucher for this test and none of the other relatives. Hopefully Jeremy can get hold of Carl Maucher who can hopefully shed some light on this one way or the other.

I also forgot to mention that in the documentary, they did a computerized comparison between several points on the faces of FS and AA, and they matched perfectly. They also did computerized comparison of the ears between AA and AN and they matched best out of five other people that they used as control. That was very interesting.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by helenazar »

Offline Annie

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #293 on: December 15, 2004, 03:30:28 PM »
Did they have any other pictures of FS besides the one we've seen?

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #294 on: December 15, 2004, 04:11:11 PM »
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Did they have any other pictures of FS besides the one we've seen?


I think that the one they used was the same one we always see, but they weren't exactly comparing the features, but more the distance between the features:  between the eyes and the nose and the nose and the mouth, and between the two eyes, etc. So even if the FS picture had been "doctored" it shouldn't have mattered because all the distances matched up. Then they superimposed the two pictures and they fused together exactly! There was no mistaking that the pictures were of the same person. I don't know why they didn't try to do the same with AA and AN pictures, just to see what would happen.  They also used the same technique for the ears of AA and AN and that matched too. But the face was a lot more convincing than the ears, at least to me...

Offline stepan

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #295 on: December 15, 2004, 04:26:39 PM »
According to authors Klier and Mingay in The Quest for Anastasia it was the filmmaker Julian Nott who arranged the bloodtest from Carl Maucher and then gave it to Peter Gill in Britain. Another filmmaker and TV producer in Germany Maurice Philip Remy was also involved in these tests and got a sample from Margarete Ellerik,the daughter of Gertrude Schanzkowska. Margarete Ellerik is the mother of Carl Maucher if I´m not mistaken. So apparently both Mother and son were tested by competeting filmmakers in 1994. They did television programs at the time on Anna Anderson which were shown in Britain and Germany.

Offline Michelle

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #296 on: December 15, 2004, 08:29:49 PM »
From what Helen's saying, I'm tending to think that this show was somewhat biased.  I mean, why wouldn't they have done that whole computer thing on AA and AN as well as FS?  They should've at least done it for the sake of curiosity to see what would've happened.  But they didn't.  To me that sounds rather suspicious.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #297 on: December 15, 2004, 08:48:53 PM »
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From what Helen's saying, I'm tending to think that this show was somewhat biased.  I mean, why wouldn't they have done that whole computer thing on AA and AN as well as FS?  They should've at least done it for the sake of curiosity to see what would've happened.  But they didn't.  To me that sounds rather suspicious.



Well, to be fair, this show was done with complete cooperation of the Botkins and Peter Kurth who are probably the biggest supporters of AA being AN. And the show did try to present a balanced view of the case by showing the ear comparison and making a point that it matched, maybe they figured that this was the equivalent of doing the facial comparison between AA and AN, I don't know...  And they also had interviewed  many AA supporters like the Botkins and Peter Kurth and one of the cousins whom AA lived with. So they seemed to give equal weight to both sides. But basically what everything came down to in the show, it wasn't the facial comparison or the ear comparison or the  testimonies, but the DNA results. Both sides agreed that they would accept the results of DNA, before the tests were done, no matter what they turned out to be. In fact, the Botkins were the ones who initiated the whole thing, from what I understand, by obtaining the intestine sample from the hospital. Everyone involved in the show seemed to accept the DNA results that AA wasn't AN, but they had a very hard time accepting that she was FS.
You guys should really try to get this show and watch it as it is very helpful in terms of clarifying a lot of things in this case. I bet they have a copy at the library.

Offline Alexa

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #298 on: December 19, 2004, 04:17:48 PM »
For what it's worth, I remember seeing this episode of Nova years ago when it was first broadcast, and have been looking for a copy to buy ever since.  It was very well done, and a good additition to anyone's video library.

Alexa

rskkiya

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Re: AA and FS
« Reply #299 on: December 19, 2004, 05:14:27 PM »
Hello Alexa

Contact PBS station WGBH in Boston --you can find the site on the internet -- and you can order Anastasia Dead or Alive on VHS for about twenty u.s. dollars. It's quite good, (as you know) but not yet on DVD.
love
rskkiya
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by rskkiya »