Author Topic: Romanov lineage, what would you need?  (Read 17432 times)

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Offline Valmont

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2007, 03:47:22 PM »
Yes, I think I read it when I was a child...
Arturo Vega-Llausás

Offline charley

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2007, 04:32:20 PM »
Okay, maybe if I reworded this scenario a bit, someone may have an interesting idea. It is 2007 and you are sitting as a juror on the biggest case of the year. A lawyer has been hired by an aristocratic gentleman to prove that he is a Romanov descendant. Another lawyer has been hired to discount the man. The DNA evidence has been thrown out of court on both sides. The man has many family photos. His lawyer calls in 5 seperate photo identification experts who identify the members in the family as being Romanov's. The man may have other items as well that he says came from the family. You have seen some of the items in old photographs. You are the juror. Would this evidence or any other cause you to side with the man? I really want to know what people think.  If DNA is thrown out of court, including the man's, (who's extensive DNA testing said he was actually a descendant) then what?

Offline Greenowl

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2007, 09:31:13 AM »
I think this is a bit vague! There were many Romanovs, thus a descendent of who exactly?? I mean, if he claimed to be a direct descendent of say, any of the children of the last Tsar, I would find it almost impossible to believe...in other words, he would have to prove to me that the one from whom he claims to be descended was not murdered in that cellar and I think that would be extremely difficult.

What is the point of the question anyway? I don't get it!

Offline charley

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2007, 10:40:07 AM »
Yes, I was refering to a descendant from Tsar Nicholas. I have no agenda in asking this question. No one knows what the future holds and so I just wondered if one day someone came forward, is it possible to prove other than DNA. So for you, you feel that there is no proof that would sway you? Thank you for your response. So one person said that only DNA would be proof enough and you think there is no proof.
What if the British Royal family came out and said that they had been involved?
.......................I guess this is not something people are really interested to talk about, but this is specifically called a "discussion forum" so I thought I would see if anyone has thought about this idea and want to discuss it. That's all.

Offline Greenowl

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2007, 11:03:04 AM »
The proof would have to be very convincing. Although I'm not an expert here (and maybe I'm talking a load of rubbish) as I understand it, even more distant members of the same family would have a similar DNA profile, I mean to say, was the DNA from Prince Philip not used in tests on the Romanov remains and he is hardly what one would describe as an "immediate" relative. Therefore, while someone could have a similar (or matching ?? I'm unsure of these terms) DNA to Nicholas II, it would not automatically mean that he/she was a descend of a child of the last Tsar....he/she could equally be a grand-nephew or fourth cousin or something. I stand open to correction on this, as I'm no expert. However, I find it very difficult to imagine that anyone survived that cellar. I accept that anything is possible, but it would take a great deal to convince me.

Offline imperial angel

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #20 on: May 02, 2007, 03:56:47 PM »
I think this is a bit vague! There were many Romanovs, thus a descendent of who exactly?? I mean, if he claimed to be a direct descendent of say, any of the children of the last Tsar, I would find it almost impossible to believe...in other words, he would have to prove to me that the one from whom he claims to be descended was not murdered in that cellar and I think that would be extremely difficult.

What is the point of the question anyway? I don't get it!

Maybe the point of the question is that there are alternative ways to think about things that go outside the typical version?

Offline charley

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #21 on: May 02, 2007, 09:14:28 PM »
Yes, thank you imperial angel.

Offline annya

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #22 on: June 05, 2009, 11:26:22 PM »
Dr. Coble, has stated the statistics for DNA to match the Russian Royal Romanov family, Nicholas, Alexandra, and their children would be more than 4 trillion times to 1. So what would happen if a person came forward who had the mtDNA and DNA that matched? Would that be enough for people to accept or would there be more ridicule? It seems no one is remembering the 5th daughter and it is a possibility she had a descendant. What if that person had the mtDNA and DNA, would that be enough or would it be more ridicule? Would that person get the respect, dignity and the entitlement to their name they should receive or would they be met with character assassination? I for one will be glad when that day comes.
Annya

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #23 on: June 06, 2009, 12:45:50 AM »
Dr. Coble, has stated the statistics for DNA to match the Russian Royal Romanov family, Nicholas, Alexandra, and their children would be more than 4 trillion times to 1. So what would happen if a person came forward who had the mtDNA and DNA that matched? Would that be enough for people to accept or would there be more ridicule? It seems no one is remembering the 5th daughter and it is a possibility she had a descendant. What if that person had the mtDNA and DNA, would that be enough or would it be more ridicule? Would that person get the respect, dignity and the entitlement to their name they should receive or would they be met with character assassination? I for one will be glad when that day comes.
Annya

A person with (presumably you mean) Alexandra's mtDNA could be a matrilineal descendant of Queen Victoria. Since her descendants are known, a "new" person would have to be considered. (Also please remember that people who are not matrilineal descendants of QV could still have that mtDNA, if they are descended farther up the matrilineal chain.

If that person had a nuclear DNA profile consistent with a descendant of Nicholas and Alexandra, that person would also have to be considered. However, since it has now been proven that the entire family died and was buried outside of Ekaterinburg, other possibilities would be more likely for the "new" person.

No one is "remembering" the "5th daughter" because no credible evidence exists that there was one.

Offline Zecharia

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2010, 11:59:22 PM »
   I was not talking about the scientist who did DNA testing already, I was refering to if someone came forward now, and said they had proof and maybe a DNA test. Some people are so mean and ready to attack anyone who comes along. I have not read any of the post on DNA here, I frankly do not understand any of it.
   I am an innocent bystander who was not involved in any previous discussions.  All I wanted to know is if anyone ever thought about proof other than DNA. So, from your very hurtful posts, I assume I am not allowed to ask this question? Maybe I should have posted it in the "having fun section", because this is definitely not fun here. It is actually kind of frightening, like being attacked by some starving vultures. It was simply just a thought, something I was thinking about one day. You people are so cruel.
I feel with you :)

Offline JonC

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #25 on: January 20, 2010, 01:46:38 PM »
The MtDNA scenario has been beaten to death with disbelief from some sources with good cause, we all know the history, but why not direct some of these claimants to a Paternity test using the father's DNA, namely Nicholas's ? In other words, if the MtDNA might be unreliable surely the Paternal connection should be there, no?

Offline Belochka

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #26 on: January 20, 2010, 06:44:12 PM »
The MtDNA scenario has been beaten to death with disbelief from some sources with good cause, we all know the history, but why not direct some of these claimants to a Paternity test using the father's DNA, namely Nicholas's ? In other words, if the MtDNA might be unreliable surely the Paternal connection should be there, no?

The cause you prefer to espouse is tiresome and it is high time you learn to devote yourself to more credible matters.


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Offline JonC

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Re: Romanov lineage, what would you need?
« Reply #27 on: January 21, 2010, 04:13:36 PM »
How do you do that with the blue ink thing its impressive.