Author Topic: Romance between Elizabeth of York and Richard III?  (Read 103139 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Eric_Lowe

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 17014
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Romance between Elizabeth of York and Richard III?
« Reply #165 on: October 12, 2013, 04:20:37 PM »
Good. Always like a good intelligent discussion on a complicated subject. Richard III was one of those. History can record his activities (both success and failures) but it cannot record his true motives and the reason behind his actions. That is where people have problems. Was he a good person gone bad, or blinded by ambition or just someone who want to do the right thing ? There is no true answer to that since he was long dead and no wittness to the inner dealings of his mind.

Offline Selencia

  • Boyar
  • **
  • Posts: 120
  • Her Imperial Highness Grand Duchess Nadezhda
    • View Profile
Re: Romance between Elizabeth of York and Richard III?
« Reply #166 on: May 05, 2014, 11:54:28 PM »
Ok hasn't anyone thought up the fact that this idea of love between Elizabeth and Richard makes them both look bad? Not only does it trump on history of Elizabeth's actual marriage being a good one but it makes Richard and Elizabeth willing participants in incest of one of the worst degrees. Why would any Richard defender  want to use such a thing to try and make him look better?

Offline Kalafrana

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2929
    • View Profile
Re: Romance between Elizabeth of York and Richard III?
« Reply #167 on: May 06, 2014, 03:30:01 AM »
I agree entirely that it makes them both look bad. As you can see from earlier posts, I find the whole idea of Richard wishing to marry Elizabeth unlikely. OK, she may have developed a crush on her uncle (warlike men in their early thirties can be very attractive to late-teenage girls!), but a marriage was never going to happen.

Ann

Offline Kimberly

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 3142
  • Loyaulte me lie
    • View Profile
Re: Romance between Elizabeth of York and Richard III?
« Reply #168 on: May 06, 2014, 08:36:00 AM »
Ok hasn't anyone thought up the fact that this idea of love between Elizabeth and Richard makes them both look bad? Not only does it trump on history of Elizabeth's actual marriage being a good one but it makes Richard and Elizabeth willing participants in incest of one of the worst degrees. Why would any Richard defender  want to use such a thing to try and make him look better?

Ok.
This is based on the letter "found" by Buck and it is no longer extant but there is evidence to suggest that it had been tampered with not least by Buck's nephew. ( sorry, I cannot find the source for this at the moment in my massive pile of "stuff". :-) ).
The letter suggests that it was very much Elizabeth who was "chasing" Richard and not vice-versa, to wit - she asks Norfolk to intercede, i.e. put in a good word for her.

Elizabeth would bring no suitable dowry to the marriage and there would be no profitable foreign alliance.

The sheer absurdity of marriage plans with a niece declared illegitimate would make a travesty of Titulus Regis.

Denial by Richard of any marriage plans ( which is preserved verbatim in the records of the Mercers.)

At this time,Richard was planning a marriage with Joanna of Portugal ( note she was of Lancastrian "blood" ) with Elizabeth to wed Manuel of Portugal who was cousin to Joanna.
Member of the Richard III Society