Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about the Imperial Family and European Royalty => The Stuarts of Scotland => Topic started by: Annie on January 09, 2005, 07:07:45 PM

Title: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Annie on January 09, 2005, 07:07:45 PM
Well, I never expected to see a forum for this! See, I am a Stuart, well, my husband and children are ;) I have been interested in tracing this family line to see if they could be related to this royal family. My husband's father, and his father, were both named after sons of the pretenders and I wonder if this means anything. How would I go about tracing this? All I know is my father in law's parents names. He passed away many years ago and everyone else older is dead and gone so I can't find anything else out to make a connection. If anyone has any info on the Stuarts after the failed attempts to reclaim the throne please talk to me! I want to know if my husband is a claimant! ;)
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: ChristineM on January 10, 2005, 08:08:53 AM
Dear Annie

I presume your husband's father and grandfather were named either James (the Old Pretender) or Charles (the Young Pretender).  

It is possible to trace family records at the Scottish Records Office in Edinburgh (Register House).   Official records have been maintained since approx. 1817.   Prior to that date you will have to use baptismal records for your searches.   This means you would need to know the name of parish in which they lived.   This is further complicated by the fact that in Scotland it was the established church - the Church of Scotland - which formed the Parishes.   The parish records were therefore held by the Church of Scotland.   The Roman Catholic Church kept its own records.

The Stuarts were Roman Catholic, but many converted.   In my experience, the best records and by far the simplest to follow, are the Mormon records.   In the past, the researches I have done, has literally been on the hoof, in Register House, where you pay a fee for either a half day - I think about £10 or a full day - £18.   This could have changed, but in order to save valuable time, you must have every tiny piece of information at you fingertips.

There are other methods.   There is a possibility the Records are now 'on-line'.   I know that was the plan, but whether they have achieved it, I cannot say.   Alternatively you can employ a genealogist who, at a price, will do the work for you.  (Not nearly so interesting or as much fun because as you explore yourself, you keep finding fascinating related and unrelated records).

I'll refresh my memory on the various spellings of the name and come back to you.

tsaria
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Annie on January 10, 2005, 08:35:56 AM
Thank you so much! My father in law was named James Francis and his father Henry Charles. They were Roman Catholics right up until the last generation. I will  try the Mormon records if I can, and please let me know whatever else you can!
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: ChristineM on January 10, 2005, 08:47:52 AM
Dear Annie

They were named after both James VII and 'Bonnie Prince Charlie'.   Do you know where they originated?   That's the most important starting point.

tsaria
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Annie on January 10, 2005, 10:16:02 AM
My father in law was born in Michigan in 1924. His father was from Mass. and his mother was from Quebec but she wasn't the Stuart. They lived in Michigan and Reading, PA. So I need to make the connection between Mass. and the 'old country' I guess? I'm also not sure if the PA connection might mean something?
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: AGRBear on January 10, 2005, 12:21:03 PM
You start with birth and death records, if no one in the family has additional information.

When you get to the point where they have migrated to the USA, there will be naturalization records....

LDS  [Mormon Church Records] are, now, on line and are great in your search.

There are various ways to spell Stuart/Stewart so don't just use one spellings.

Since the family of Stuart is popular,  there are many many books about the family.  I suspect you can even find a Stuart Group who may have everything you need.  If not,  they can help.

Go to "google" and type in "Stuart" [add genealogy to prevent other connections from poping up on the search list' and you might be surprissed by what you find.

There are many books about genealogy which give you addresses of places where you can find more data.

Good luck.

AGRBear
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Annie on January 10, 2005, 12:28:55 PM
It's spelled the same way, though most people spell it wrong and use the 'stew' version. I have done well tracing my own family, but I knew so much about them farther back than the US Civil War, I don't have anything on this line yet. What is the very last thing known about the last pretender and his children, anyone know?
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: ChristineM on January 10, 2005, 12:34:31 PM
Dear Annie

We really need to know where in Scotland your husband's family originated.   You will probably get that from immigration records in the US.

When I get the precise details about the spelling and the changes in the spelling of 'Stuart' I'll let you know.

Meantime, originally the name was spelled Steuart.   Originally the ruling line used it in the form 'Stewart' - derived from Steward of Scotland.  This changed again, but I'll need to do a bit of digging to re-establish why.  

tsaria
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: ChristineM on January 10, 2005, 12:38:58 PM
Dear Annie

I omitted to mention the outcome of the 'Pretender'.   There is still one who surfaces every so often with his claim.  

This is a huge subject.  

The Jacobite Rebellion and its aftermath - the Clearances and the forced evacuation of so many Highland Scots to North America is an area of special interest to me.

tsaria
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Annie on January 10, 2005, 12:46:49 PM
Thank you, it would be so interesting if my husband was a 'pretender' too ;) or at least related to the highland Stuarts who came to North America, I guess he'd have to be at least among those. I'm sure the story will be very interesting to find out no matter what it is!
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Annie on January 11, 2005, 01:53:56 PM
Tsaria, any info on the rebellions and the explusion of the highland Scots would be very interesting. If you have time could you please start a thread with the info you have?
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: AGRBear on January 17, 2005, 05:35:16 PM
How were Mary Queen of Scots and Elisabeth, Queen of England related?

Let's take each one backward to their common ancestors Henry VII and  Elizabeth of York, daughter of Edward IV.

Gen.
Mary, Queen of the Scots, dau. of
Gen.
James V, King of Scotland m. Mary of Lorraine, dau. of Claude, Duke of Guise [second wife].  James V was the son of
Gen.
James IV, King of Scotland, House of Bruce and Stuart,  and Margaret, sister of Henry VIII and  who was the dau. of
Gen.
Henry VII, House of Tudor and Elizabeth of York

----
Gen.
Elizabeth I, Queen of England , was the daughter of
Gen.
Henry VIII and [second wife] Anne, dau. of Thomas Boleyn, Earl of Wiltshire.  Henry VIII was the son of
Gen.
Henry VII, House of Tudor,  and Elizabeth of York.


AGRBear
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: AGRBear on January 22, 2005, 01:34:21 PM
To make the family tree heavy on the branch connected to Henry VII and Elizabeth of York,  their daughter  Margaret Tudor, who was the widow of James IV of Scotland,  married Archibald, Earl of Angus.

Margaret's and Archibald's daughter,  Lady Magaret Douglas,  m. Mathew,  Earl of Lennox.  Margaret and Mathew were the parents of

Henry, Lord Darnley who was the second husband of Mary, Queen of Scots.  

Yep, Mary and Henry had the same grandmother, Margret Tudor and this made them  first cousins.

AGRBear
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Donielle on February 21, 2005, 07:26:56 PM
Quote
Dear Annie

I omitted to mention the outcome of the 'Pretender'.   There is still one who surfaces every so often with his claim.  

This is a huge subject.  

The Jacobite Rebellion and its aftermath - the Clearances and the forced evacuation of so many Highland Scots to North America is an area of special interest to me.

tsaria

Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Donielle on February 21, 2005, 07:42:31 PM
Tsaria,Let me thank you, for your gracious and kind support and advice .Since my first post, on this wonderful website.My mother was born in Birkenhead raised in the Isle of man.My fathers' family came here(America) in 1820 from Campbelltown,they were farmers.My mothers name was Martha Roberts Evans.My fathers name was Charles Donald McMurchy.My mom came here after the war,she never wanted to be come an american citizen.She died last year at 75,still a british citizen.She always said "England is my home"The McMurchy side of my family came to America during the land clearances,or did this(the land clearance) occur earlier in the 1700's?They settled in Southern Ohio.-Donielle
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: capttrips on November 23, 2010, 05:44:26 PM
I am facing a similar research problem: There are a lot of Stewarts and I know nothing about Scotland.

In relation to the real Stewarts (the ones with the titles, castles, responsibilities, history, straight line of descent, etc), who was Duncan Stewart b. 1530 at Glenagle, Scotland?

He had a son Andrew born 1560 at Perth, Perthshire.

Andrew had a son William born at Balguhidder, Perthshire, who married Barbara Menzius, daughter of Duncan Menzius, son of Robert Sir James Menzius, who married Barbara Stewart daughter of John Stewart from Perth, Perthshire.

I suspect my cousins' research might be erroneous, because, It just sounds too complete and ellaborate, still, I am really curious about this family--are there any pedigree rolls which would clearly show how all the Stewarts are related from so far back?

Thank you.
Title: Re: Tracing the family tree
Post by: capttrips on March 29, 2011, 10:55:28 PM
Hmm.  I see.  My cousin has traced my family into a peerage roll.  I do not know what to say, other than, I regret any impact my post may have had in quashing the thread.  That was not my intention.

We should address the origanol poster's origanol concerns.

Once one has eclipsed all American records, other than Ships' Lists respecting persons of Quality, how can one find their proper place of origin, and family line, as recorded by the Extracted Court Records of the United Kingdom?

As to the origanol poster's specific predicament of just begining, I have no advice, except, if you can correctly trace your family in the US Census--Big Brother has been watching, since the beggining.  The great and grave difficulty is not tracing name to name (in generations), but place name to place name (every 200 years, or 20 as is often the case.)

Ask your husband and other Stewart kin.  Someone in the family probably already did it, a long time ago.

How did our ancestors do genealogy before the internet?  Assuming the genealogy fell outside of the Living Memory?
Title: Tracing the family tree
Post by: Topy6relnen on November 06, 2019, 10:50:58 PM
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I think its normal among goofy families.  Nothing wrong with it, so long as its not the topic at Koto Japanese Steakhouse during the hibachi performance

 
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