Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about Russian History => Russian Imperial Medals, Orders, Uniforms & Militaria => Topic started by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 06:05:06 PM

Title: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 06:05:06 PM
Dear Imperial Russia enthusiasts,

Would you be so kind to assist me in finding out more information about my Grandfather?
His name was Stefan Filipovich Bezuglov (father Filip or Filipovich Bezuglov). I understand my grandfather was in the Tsar Nicholas II personal convoy and I believe he may have been a Kuban cossack based on his uniform. He used to tell my father and aunties he physically had to carry little Alexei at times around because he was unwell. The photos I have uploaded to dropbox are photos of photos and I am able to get clearer pictures if need be. Would you be able to share light on who he was? What regiment he was in? What was he?

https://db.tt/S8lUh3gb - When he was a young man.

https://db.tt/IzkPK5su - When he was elderly (note his badge?)

https://db.tt/dm6B5QVR - Sitting on the very end (2nd row on left) next to lady (directly behind little child). NOTE: We believe the 5th man (from left) in the front lying down in this photo is Grand Duke Nicholas Nikolaevich of Russia. The plaque on the back right wall would be very significant. This is a photo of a photo - so I will need to scan it as it is in Cyrillic.

 https://db.tt/Hjoc6Tj3 - Maybe someone can read the Cyrillic on this photograph?

https://db.tt/fSYp6LC8 - A closeup of a different photo - He is 4th man on the right. 3rd row next to the three men with black hats. He has a different coloured one.


Any help would be amazingly helpful. I've been trying to research my family tree since I was a little girl and only finally got these pictures sent to me.

Regards,
Svetlana Bezuglov
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filiopich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 25, 2014, 06:09:35 PM
It doesn't seem like the images from Dropbox can be viewed.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 06:12:17 PM
Fixed! :)

SB
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 25, 2014, 06:19:51 PM
No hits for Степан Филиппович Безуглов.

Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 06:21:59 PM
What does that mean?

SB
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 25, 2014, 06:27:20 PM
Степан Филиппович Безуглов = Stepan Filippovich Bezuglov. The most likely spelling of his name in Russian.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 25, 2014, 06:32:46 PM
-


Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 25, 2014, 06:45:55 PM
https://db.tt/Hjoc6Tj3 - Maybe someone can read the Cyrillic on this photograph?

It says approximately:
Фотографiе Л. Д. Грановская = Photographs L. D. Granovskaya
Г. Майконь = G. Maykon'

So probably just the name of the photographer. Maykon' means "May horse".
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 06:53:02 PM
I understand my grandfather, Stepan was called Stepan Filipovic Bezuglov His father was called Filip Bezuglov

For some reason the 1st and most important picture which reveals everything doesn't want to open:

So here it is again on another link:

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/YOUNGII.jpg)

Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 25, 2014, 07:02:24 PM
I understand my grandfather, Stepan was called Stepan Filipovic Bezuglov His father was called Filip Bezuglov

Yes. There is the small possibility that the form Стефан / Stefan is the original, but the normal Russian form is Степан.

BTW interesting meaning of your surname: Без углов = Without corners, i.e. homeless, according to some sources.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 07:11:01 PM
There is a town called Bezuglov: http://mapsinworld.com/russia-astrakhanskaya-oblast-bezuglov-map.html - But I don't know if it has any correlation to Stefan. What I really need to know is who was he? What is his uniform? He was in the Tsar Nicholas II personal convoy and looked after Alexei at times. I want to know more about him. What the shoulder epaulettes and medals mean?

Anything anyone?

Thank you guys so much for your help thus far.

Svetlana.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 25, 2014, 07:22:13 PM
You are welcome. I have next to no military expertise. But when the military experts here start, you will be surprised by the details they can give!

https://db.tt/dm6B5QVR - Sitting on the very end (2nd row on left) next to lady (directly behind little child). NOTE: We believe the 5th man (from left) in the front lying down in this photo is Grand Duke Nicholas Nikolaevich of Russia.
Oh, what makes you think that?

Quote
https://db.tt/fSYp6LC8 - A closeup of a different photo - He is 4th man on the right. 3rd row next to the three men with black hats. He has a different coloured one.

I'd rather hazard that Grand Duke Nikolay Nikolayevich the Younger is in this picture, in normal military uniform to the left of the centre.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 08:36:57 PM
Hi Превед,

Quote
Quote from: Bezuglov on Today at 05:05:06 PM
https://db.tt/dm6B5QVR - Sitting on the very end (2nd row on left) next to lady (directly behind little child). NOTE: We believe the 5th man (from left) in the front lying down in this photo is Grand Duke Nicholas Nikolaevich of Russia.
Oh, what makes you think that?

I think this because it looks exactly like the Grand Duke Nicholas Nikolaevich of Russia (look how distinctive the eyes are). I could be mistaken but I feel not. This is why I can't wait for the military experts to start commenting and viewing my pictures.

 
Quote
Quote
https://db.tt/fSYp6LC8 - A closeup of a different photo - He is 4th man on the right. 3rd row next to the three men with black hats. He has a different coloured one.

I'd rather hazard that Grand Duke Nikolay Nikolayevich the Younger is in this picture, in normal military uniform to the left of the centre.

With the Captain hat? Not sure. I would need to get a clearer copy of the photo.

Anyhow, I await information on the regiment, the uniform identification and medals in anticipation. At this stage all I know is that he was apart of the personal convoy for the Emperor Tsar II and watched over Alexei at times.

Svetlana
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 09:01:19 PM
Do we know the names of the guards in this photo with the Tsar and Alexei? I also think there is strong resemblence between my Grandfather and the man right behind the Tsar (on the right - when looking at the photo) which is the Tsar's left. But I could be wrong. Just look so similar it is scary!

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4d/Nicholas_II_and_children_with_Cossacks_of_the_Guard,_cropped.jpg)
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on February 25, 2014, 11:20:47 PM
Dear Imperial Russia enthusiasts,

Would you be so kind to assist me in finding out more information about my Grandfather?
His name was Stefan Filipovich Bezuglov (father Filip or Filipovich Bezuglov). I understand my grandfather was in the Tsar Nicholas II personal convoy and I believe he may have been a Kuban cossack based on his uniform. He used to tell my father and aunties he physically had to carry little Alexei at times around because he was unwell. The photos I have uploaded to dropbox are photos of photos and I am able to get clearer pictures if need be. Would you be able to share light on who he was? What regiment he was in? What was he?

https://db.tt/S8lUh3gb - When he was a young man.

https://db.tt/IzkPK5su - When he was elderly (note his badge?)

https://db.tt/dm6B5QVR - Sitting on the very end (2nd row on left) next to lady (directly behind little child). NOTE: We believe the 5th man (from left) in the front lying down in this photo is Grand Duke Nicholas Nikolaevich of Russia. The plaque on the back right wall would be very significant. This is a photo of a photo - so I will need to scan it as it is in Cyrillic.

 https://db.tt/Hjoc6Tj3 - Maybe someone can read the Cyrillic on this photograph?

https://db.tt/fSYp6LC8 - A closeup of a different photo - He is 4th man on the right. 3rd row next to the three men with black hats. He has a different coloured one.


Any help would be amazingly helpful. I've been trying to research my family tree since I was a little girl and only finally got these pictures sent to me.

Regards,
Svetlana Bezuglov

I just wanted to add to this that it says DANILOV with the Numerals 164 on the back of this photo? https://db.tt/dm6B5QVR:: If anyone can please help me with who my Grandfather was? Where he was? Which Regiment? What is his uniform and medals I would forever be greatful.

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/YOUNGII.jpg)
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Inok Nikolai on February 26, 2014, 07:06:34 AM
https://db.tt/Hjoc6Tj3 - Maybe someone can read the Cyrillic on this photograph?

It says approximately:
Фотографiе Л. Д. Грановская = Photographs L. D. Granovskaya
Г. Майконь = G. Maykon'

So probably just the name of the photographer. Maykon' means "May horse".

Not quite. The "g" stands for "gorord" = town or city, and the last letter is a "p" -- the Kuban Cossack town of "Maikop"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maykop
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Mike on February 26, 2014, 09:44:26 AM
The posted photo (DB images don't open with me) shows a staff captain [pod'yesaul] of the 1st Kuban Cossack Foot battalion in full dress uniform, prior to 1912. He doesn't belong to the HM's Own Convoy. Moreover, he's most likely not Stepan Bezuglov, because no officer of that name served in the Kuban Cossack Host, at least after 1908.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on February 26, 2014, 10:26:45 AM
https://db.tt/Hjoc6Tj3 - Maybe someone can read the Cyrillic on this photograph?
It says approximately:
Фотографiе Л. Д. Грановская = Photographs L. D. Granovskaya
Г. Майконь = G. Maykon'

So probably just the name of the photographer. Maykon' means "May horse".
Not quite. The "g" stands for "gorord" = town or city, and the last letter is a "p" -- the Kuban Cossack town of "Maikop"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maykop

Ah, thanks for the correction! Here we easily see how one feather can become five hens, when we try to find meaning in all kinds of shaky interpretations and memories. I was very satisfied with "May horse", because we are after all talking about Cossacks here :-)

Is it correct to assume that the photographer was a woman, based on the surname? Or is it in the female form because it's a firm / studio name?

1st Kuban Cossack Foot battalion
There was Cossack infantry!? Not enough horses or no use for them?

a staff captain [pod'yesaul]

Svetlana Bezuglov, do you know this song: Бывший подъесаул - Former Pod'yesaul (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLWmCQeu-Yc)
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Inok Nikolai on February 26, 2014, 10:33:13 AM
Do we know the names of the guards in this photo with the Tsar and Alexei? I also think there is strong resemblence between my Grandfather and the man right behind the Tsar (on the right - when looking at the photo) which is the Tsar's left. But I could be wrong. Just look so similar it is scary!

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4d/Nicholas_II_and_children_with_Cossacks_of_the_Guard,_cropped.jpg)

Well, the history book on H.I.M. Own Convoy, published in Russian in San Francisco in 1961, identifies that officer as G. A. Rashpil, and notes that he was later killed.

Modern, on-line, reprint of the book here:
http://www.regiment.ru/Lib/A/5/1.htm

The photo with captions, here:
http://www.regiment.ru/Lib/A/5/36.jpg
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Mike on February 26, 2014, 12:20:35 PM
Now that the DB images opened, a few more details:
- The photographer's name is Granovsky, and he's definitely male.
- The guy presumed to be a grand duke isn't even an officer. He is an army's civil servant, probably a weapon master. There's also a military surgeon on this photo.
- The women on one of the photos wear Circassian costumes, so the men in black fur hats are also apparently Circassians.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Mike on February 28, 2014, 12:57:26 PM
As I've guessed, the officer on the photos is not Stepan Bezuglov. He's been positively identified as pod'yesaul Mikhail Zozulin, of 1st Kuban Cossack Foot battalion. In 1917 promoted to colonel, commanded 20th Kuban Cossack Foot battalion. Fought in the Civil War, emigrated to Yugoslavia, in 1941 joined the Russian Corps on the German side, died in Germany in 1945. Here's his photo in the mixed Russian-German uniform of the Russian Corps (front row, center):
(http://sammler.ru/uploads/post-650-1393608879.jpg)
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 04, 2014, 05:41:27 PM
Sorry I have been absent as I have been doing my own research and wanted to put some information out there on my further discoveries. I will also need to repost the photos for better clarity and detail as the ones uploaded are only photos of photos from my mobile and hence not so clear.

I worked out when the group photos were taken. During WW1 1914 to September 1915, but most likely 1915. Danilov was appointed to the Northern Front as Chief of Staff ,Commander of the 25th Corps from Sept 1915 to 1916 And 1916 to 1917 Commander of the 5th Army.

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/20140223_155336.jpg) To make the photo bigger click: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/20140223_155336.jpg

My grandpa remained with the Grand Duke Nikolai Nikolaievic who was appointed to the post of Viceroy of the Caucasus on 21st August 1915 by the Tsar. (My Aunt Agnessa was born 1914 in Kars an autonomous state belonging to Russia in Turkey.) In 1916 the Russian army captured the Fortress at Erzerum etc that is where my grandpa was.

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/OLD.jpg)

My grandpa was Stepan Filipovic Bezuglov.
His father was Filip Bezuglov.
His mother was Marina Bezuglov.
After their marriage she would be called according to Russian tradition:
Princess Marina Cherkasskaja Bezuglov.
Her father was Prince Cherkasskii
Her mother was Princess Ninella Kobahidze of Gruzia (Georgia).


Bela Crkva in Banat sheltered many Russian refugees who escaped from the horrors of the civil war. In the twenties and thirties where my father went to school the town hosted:


I think that Stepan's father Filip was in the same military Russian Cadet Cors school as the Great Prince Konstantin Konstantinovic and thus have the same epilettes and thus their children finished the same military school? And that is why they are in the same photograph together as they belonged to the same society.

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/20140223_155336.jpg) To make the photo bigger click: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/20140223_155336.jpg
Danilov is the old man in the middle of second front row with the white fur hat sitting next to his daughter. Same row as Stepan my grandpa (who is on the end of the left next to the woman).


Danilov is also in the big group photo (right in middle third row).  Grand Duke is sitting same row to the right of the picture with a man inbetween them.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/20140223_155306.jpg) To make the photo bigger click: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/20140223_155306.jpg

So this is only some of what I have learnt along the way but thought I would update you thiu far. I really appreciate every feedback given as your expertise and knowledge just continues to inspire me to keep digging.

Svetlana Bezuglov
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on March 04, 2014, 06:28:21 PM
Huh, didn't you see Mike's and Inok Nikolai's posts about the man in the pictures not being Bezuglov and there being no grand dukes in the pictures? I can assure you Mike is an expert with regard to Russian Imperial military and both he and Inok Nikolai know their stuff!

Is this some alternative fantasy you entertain because you don't want to acknowledge that your grandfather fought on the German side in WW2?
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on March 04, 2014, 06:49:04 PM
My grandpa was Stepan Filipovic Bezuglov.
His father was Filip Bezuglov.
His mother was Marina Bezuglov.
After their marriage she would be called according to Russian tradition:
Princess Marina Cherkasskaja Bezuglov.
Her father was Prince Cherkasskii
Her mother was Princess Ninella Kobahidze of Gruzia (Georgia).

The princely Cherkasskiy / Черкасский family went extinct in the 18th century, as far as I can see. but it's a fairly common bourgeois surname.
There doesn't seem to have been any Georgian princely family called Kobahidze / Кобахидзе. It seems like an ordinary Georgian family name only famous because of some current football players.

After their marriage she would be called according to Russian tradition:
Princess Marina Cherkasskaja Bezuglov.
Her father was Prince Cherkasskii
No, a Princess Marina Cherkasskaya would have been known as Madame (Marina) Bezuglova after her marriage. Daughters of Russian princes did not retain their title after their marriage, something which is well illustrated by Russian having different terms for the unmarried daughter of a prince (княжна / knyazhna) and the wife of a prince (княагина / knyagina).
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on March 04, 2014, 07:44:15 PM
No, a Princess Marina Cherkasskaya would have been known as Madame (Marina) Bezuglova after her marriage. Daughters of Russian princes did not retain their title after their marriage, something which is well illustrated by Russian having different terms for the unmarried daughter of a prince (княжна / knyazhna) and the wife of a prince (княагина / knyagina).

Most well-known example:
Her Excellency Mrs. Privy Councillor Karenina née Princess Anna Arkadyevna Oblonskaya.

Correction: Wife of a prince: княгиня / knyaginya.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on March 04, 2014, 08:42:45 PM
pod'yesaul Mikhail Zozulin

Wow, when I searched for подьесаул Михаил Зозулин I came to this site: http://forum.fstanitsa.ru/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=35&start=10 (http://forum.fstanitsa.ru/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=35&start=10) with the exact same photo as was posted here and lots of very accurate genealogical information without any fanciful fairytales about grand dukes.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 04, 2014, 08:57:11 PM

Thank you for your help Превед - No I didn't see the replies (until now for some reason). Sorry I am still new and learning on this forum. Thank you for all your help - much appreciated. I do respect everyone's feedback and obviously knowledge on this topic. Apologies if I offended you as I did not mean to not read the replies. Thank you for taking the time to assist.

SB
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 04, 2014, 09:08:07 PM
As I've guessed, the officer on the photos is not Stepan Bezuglov. He's been positively identified as pod'yesaul Mikhail Zozulin, of 1st Kuban Cossack Foot battalion. In 1917 promoted to colonel, commanded 20th Kuban Cossack Foot battalion. Fought in the Civil War, emigrated to Yugoslavia, in 1941 joined the Russian Corps on the German side, died in Germany in 1945. Here's his photo in the mixed Russian-German uniform of the Russian Corps (front row, center):
(http://sammler.ru/uploads/post-650-1393608879.jpg)

Hi Mike,

Thank you for your reply. Can I just confirm you were looking at the right person as Stefan? I didn't proclaim he was an officer? Apologies for the confusion. And once again you have been an incredible help with your expertise. Really appreciate it.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/Circles.jpg)

Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 05, 2014, 04:53:50 PM
I understand my grandfather, Stepan was called Stepan Filipovic Bezuglov His father was called Filip Bezuglov

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/85071626/YOUNGII.jpg)



Mike,
Do you think you could tell me more about this uniform?
Rgds,
SB
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Mike on March 06, 2014, 12:55:02 AM
a staff captain [pod'yesaul] of the 1st Kuban Cossack Foot battalion in full dress uniform, prior to 1912.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 06, 2014, 11:18:36 PM
Thank you very much. It seems there must be incorrect names and incorrect photos for 'Bezuglov' as I do not know any Zozoulin. It is bizzare. Once again I appreciate all the insight provided and will go back to the drawing board.

SB :-\
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 06, 2014, 11:54:28 PM
a staff captain [pod'yesaul] of the 1st Kuban Cossack Foot battalion in full dress uniform, prior to 1912.

Right, and from my understanding they were also the 1st Kuban sotnias Leib Guards of His Imperial Majesty's personal convoy (a special unit of the Russian Imperial Guard acting for personal protection of the monarch).
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 07, 2014, 05:42:19 AM
a staff captain [pod'yesaul] of the 1st Kuban Cossack Foot battalion in full dress uniform, prior to 1912.

Mike,
I can't understand why my grandfather's name is not appearing.  Was there any Bezuglov in the Imperial army or personal convoy to his majesty?  I know he had brothers.  Is there any listing for any Bezuglov whatsoever? In any regiment pertaining to Tsar Nicholas II and Alexei?
Is it possible family were so scared by communism they hid names,  religion and history.
I'm absolutely baffled with this Zazoulin information. I'm wondering if I have incorrect photos. 
Just want to see if any record for Bezuglov anywhere.
SB
SB
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Mike on March 07, 2014, 06:38:57 AM
No commissioned officer named Bezuglov appears on the unit rosters of either Kuban Host or HM Convoy for the 1900s - 1910s. As to the other parts of the Russian Army, it's too big an effort to check them all. The web search for Степан Безуглов yields no relevant information, although this surname is not rare among Don and Kuban Cossacks.
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Превед on March 07, 2014, 11:43:15 AM
If indeed this is a case of a new, assumed identity it is perhaps not without significance that Bezuglov means "homeless"?
Title: Re: Who was Stefan [Filipovich] Bezuglov?
Post by: Bezuglov on March 29, 2014, 06:18:08 AM
No commissioned officer named Bezuglov appears on the unit rosters of either Kuban Host or HM Convoy for the 1900s - 1910s. As to the other parts of the Russian Army, it's too big an effort to check them all. The web search for Степан Безуглов yields no relevant information, although this surname is not rare among Don and Kuban Cossacks.

If there was no listing for  Степан Безуглов on any unit rosters of either Kuban Host or HM Convoy then how come the surname is not rare amongst Don and Kuban Cossacks? And ifso, where can I get information on those Bezuglovs?