Alexander Palace Forum
Discussions about the Imperial Family and European Royalty => Rulers Prior to Nicholas II => Topic started by: ilyala on May 08, 2005, 09:20:59 AM
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did nicholas actually have an affair with pushkin's wife? was he involved in pushkin's death?
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Maybe yes, Maybe no. Maybe he is just danced with her.
But he promised to the dying Pushkin to protect his wife and children. He kept his word.
All of the children has got the excellent education.
All girls was managed very good marriage.
The grand daughter of Pushkin in future married to the one of the Grand Son of Nicholas.
It was a Morganatic marriage and it caused a huge scandal.
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did nicholas actually have an affair with pushkin's wife? was he involved in pushkin's death?
It's a complete myth that Nicholas I had an affair with Pushkin's wife, Natalia Goncharova. I studied Pushkin in graduate school and take my word for it, there is no foundation in fact either for this rumor or the one that Nicholas had a hand in Pushkin's death. He didn't.
It's true that Nicholas I was no great admirer of Pushkin, who had been friends with many of the Decembrists who staged a revolt against Nicholas at the beginning of his reign. The straight-laced Nicholas regarded Pushkin as not only politically unreliable but also as a "depraved person" ("porochnyi chelovek") because of his reputation as a gambler and a ladies' man. He respected Pushkin as a poet but did not like him personally. By way of contrast, he seems to have liked Pushkin's wife Natalia very much. She was a beautiful woman, some said the most beautiful woman in Russia, and by all accounts perfectly charming. It is probably because Nicholas enjoyed mild flirtations (and nothing more!) with Natalia that he eventually appointed Pushkin as a "kammerjunker" at court. Pushkin, typically, saw this as an insult (because most kammerjunkers were young boys and Pushkin was in his thirties). However, it is almost certain that Nicholas had not intended it this way. He viewed any court appointment as an honour and a privilege.
There are various controversies surrounding the death of Pushkin, too elaborate to go into here. But Hikaru is right, Nicholas I vowed to take care of Pushkin's widow and children and he kept his word. Natalia remarried many years later and one of her and Pushkin's descendants ultimately married a member of the imperial family, Grand Duke Mikhail ("Miche-Miche").
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Yes, I must to say that I adore Nataliya Nikolaevna, Pushkin's wife.
She was an angel.
She was regarded as the most beautiful woman in Russia, but she could not married with a wealthy person because, she was an poor aristorcratic girl.
Only 150sm 's Pushkin proposed her, and she accepted it. Pushkin was not an angel: his temper was africaine,
his gambling's debts were incredible, he loved women.
But Natalia overpassed everything( the lack of money, food etc.).
She was beautiful, she liked to go to society, to the balls etc.
But, I think, that she never was close to the Dantes,
who killed Pushkin.
Natalia's Sister - Katya (who loved Pushkin to death and who lived together with them) married Dantes (Pushkin's killer) immediately after the duele. So, Natalia cut any relations with the only syster.
Natalia have got a lot of marriage proposals after the Pushkin's death. But she did not accept them for 10years (which is the significant approve her truly love to the poet).
Then ,she married with a good, brave general Lanskoy,
had more children and lived in the peace and happiness.
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Does anyone have a picture of Nataliya Nikolaevna?
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(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y140/auersperg23/Natalia.jpg)
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There is also a photograph of Natalia Nikolaevna taken in late middle age, in which she appears to be as beautiful as ever. She hardly seems to have aged at all. I wish I had it but perhaps someone else here does and can post it. The artist's portrait of Natalia is obviously very accurate in its depiction of her because - as I recall - the resemblance between it and her photograph is extraordinary.
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It's almost certain that Nicholas I did have an affair with Natalya. However, it started some years after Pushkin's death, when Nataliya was already married to General Lanskoy - who knew and tacitly approved of the "august grace" conferred upon his wife.
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Mike, I hate to tell you, but this is absolute nonsense. Natalia Nikolaevna never, I repeat never, had an affair with Nicholas I. What source are you actually citing? Because reputable historians completely dismiss this story as nothing but vicious slander.
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There is also a photograph of Natalia Nikolaevna taken in late middle age, in which she appears to be as beautiful as ever. She hardly seems to have aged at all. I wish I had it but perhaps someone else here does and can post it. .
WOW! I'd like to see the photo of such a lengendary character!!! :o :o
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Natalia Nikolaevna never, I repeat never, had an affair with Nicholas I.
Neither you nor me or anybody else cannot be 100% sure of existence or non-existence of such affair.
As you're certainly aware this issue has been vividly discussed by hundreds of "Pushkinists". Incidentally I'm a nephew of one of them, and of a very prominent one - which of course doesn't make me an authority on Pushkin and related topics. However, from my childhood I have always been interested in this field, and what I've said in my previous post is a personal impression derived from reading thousands of pages and hearing hundreds of hours of lectures and talks.
Many people closely familiar with the subject are of the same opinion, while many others think differently, and we will never know the truth. Anyway, I don't see why such an assumption should be called "vicious slander" and in which way could it damage Pushkin's memory or that of Natalia Nikolaevna's.
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I tnink Nikolay wanted to give to Pushkin the official status of the State Poet.
He asked him to make the official history of the Pugachov case. He gave him the permission to use the
personal archive of the Court and Romanov Family, which was extraordinary.
Catherine the Great had not problem with Diderot , but Nicholas had a lot of problems with Pushkin whose character was not the angel's one.
There are some strange points about relations of Pushkin and Nicholas I - for example: poet had no money to live in such good apartment as his last one - almost in front of the Winter Palace.
As for the relations of the Nicholas and Natalia - possibly , we will never know about it.
I also like very much the picture of the soviet artist
ULYANOV -"Pushkin and Natalia in Winter Palace"
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I also would like to give to you the ifm about 4 children of Pushkin and Natalia , who lived with great passion too.:
1. Son Alexandr -
He was brave officer and hero of the Russo-Turkey war.
He also supported the reform of 1861 year very much.
2. Son Georgy
he was good looking officer.
He felt in love with one girl but could not get the permission to marry . SO he quit the officer's service and went to his country estate where lived calmly for a lot of time till his marriage at the age of 48 with Ms. Varvara Melynikova , who was the niece of the famouse engineer who built the railroad between Moscow and St. Petersburg.
3. Daughter Maria . ( Maria Gartung after Marriage).
She became the model of the Tolstoy's Anna Karenina.
( In the first variant , Tolstoy gave to the heroine the name Nana Pushkina ).
4. Daughter Natalia, who had a great beaty , just like her mother. Her life was like the adventure.
Her first marriage was not happy one. She divorced the general Dubelyt . In the first marriage she had 3 children.
Then she married with the prince of Luxemburg - Nicholas Wilgelm of Nassau. He was a heir and did not
go to the throne because of this morganatic marriage.
Natalia was given the name of the countess of Merenberg.
They had 3 children too.
Their son married the daughter of Alexandr II and Ekaterina Dolgorukaya.
Their daugher married to the Grand Duke Mikhail Mikhaylovich Romanov. Their marriage was not approved by the IF, so they lived happily in London.
Windsors now are their relatives.
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wow that's some interesting information, thank you hikaru :)
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Can someone tell me more about Natalia's(Goncharova) ancestry?Did she come from a noble family?Who were her ancestors?
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Natalia Goncharova did come from a noble family, although they were very poor by Western standards, like a lot of the Russian nobility. Her father, as I recall, was either an alcoholic or a madman or both (he attacked his wife once with a knife, and was then kept locked up in a set of rooms separate from the rest of the family). Natalia did not have a dowry, and this is probably why she ended up marrying Pushkin, who was not considered a good catch. On the contrary - he also lacked a personal fortune and had a bad reputation as a gambler and ladies' man (although he was also a great poet, this did not count for very much in the eyes of the aristocracy). With her astonishing beauty, it surprised society that Natalia did not make a better match. But Pushkin was deeply in love with her and remained so for the rest of his life, calling her "my angel" and writing many famous poems about her.
Natalia's own reputation has suffered greatly since Pushkin's death - in some quarters she is still blamed for it - and she is still the subject of great controversy amongst Russian "Pushkinists," although not so much amongst Western ones, if I have read the sources correctly (it's quite possible I have not). Nicholas I's chief Western biographer, W. Bruce Lincoln, states that the tsar was only unfaithful to his wife after thirty years of marriage, and then only with a lady-in-waiting named Varvara Nelidova. No mention is made of Nicholas ever taking as his mistress the widow of Pushkin. As far as I know, this relationship only ever existed as a matter of rumor and gossip, chiefly amongst Nicholas' many enemies.
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She probably married Pushkin because of nobody else - nobody proposed the Goncharov girls - their mother was in the worry.
Their estate near Moscow still exists .
The most famous Pushkin's verse about wife is "Madonna"
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the tsar was only unfaithful to his wife after thirty years of marriage, and then only with a lady-in-waiting named Varvara Nelidova. No mention is made of Nicholas ever taking as his mistress the widow of Pushkin.
Nelidova had a lasting, almost official affair with Nicholas. When he layed on his death bed, Empress Alexandra Fedorovna even suggested to invite Nelidova (whom she respected for her sincerity and modesty) for the last good-bye - which Nicholas refused.
As to Natalia Goncharova-Pushkina-Lanskaya, her probable affair with Nicholas was fleeting and not "serious". The tsar had many such affairs called, for some reason, his "blue-bonnet adventures".
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Hello
I am new here.
I just read what you had to say about pushkin- I am sorry- but I don't believe you can get an any worse perception of him ever!
First of all; his wife was one big flirt- she flirted whenever she could, she liked the dinnerparties, she loved the attention she could get from whom ever would give it to her... Pushkin did like to gamble, but excuse me, who didn't gamble at that time, as it was concidered a form of socialism. Yes, he may not have been a great gambler... I agree he left a huge amount of depth after his death...
But natalya did not love pushkin, I really don't believe she loved him the way a wife should. I might agree that she admired his talent or so. But Pushkin was a good man with great humane qualities and beliefs. He was very loyal to his friends, and very truthfull.
try and make some research or try at least reading what he left behind at the age of 37, before you make any judgements!
>:(
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did nicholas actually have an affair with pushkin's wife? was he involved in pushkin's death?
I have read that Nicholas was just one of many lovers of Pushkin's wife. She had many affairs, as did Nicholas himself.
Pushkin's death was the result of a duel he had with a French nobleman who was pursuing a military career in Russia. The Frenchman was intimately involved with Pushkin's wife, which is why Pushkin fought him in a duel.
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I have read that Nicholas was just one of many lovers of Pushkin's wife. She had many affairs, as did Nicholas himself.
Pushkin's death was the result of a duel he had with a French nobleman who was pursuing a military career in Russia. The Frenchman was intimately involved with Pushkin's wife, which is why Pushkin fought him in a duel.
There are two schools of thought about Pushkin's wife, Natalia Goncharova. They both have supporters in the academic community. They both can be termed equally legitimate and equally open to question. In essence, one school holds to the opinion that she was an angelic wife and mother, whilst another believes that she was a scarlet woman. Sound familiar? (The usual dichotomy when analyzing a mysterious female beauty.) But here the evidence really does point both ways and, as always in such cases, the truth probably lies somewhere in between. Natalia probably enjoyed flirting with admirers; nevertheless, she probably remained faithful to Pushkin. But we have no way of knowing for certain unless new evidence comes to light.
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But we have no way of knowing for certain unless new evidence comes to light.
Which means: never. Whether Natalia was a faithful wife or adulteress, is not a matter of facts and proofs. It's a matter of personal taste and almost religious belief.
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This is surely a very interesting thread.
Where is Pushkin buried now? Where is Natalia Goncharova Pushkina better? Was Pushking afforded a religious burial (because he died in a duel and the Church prohibited religious burials for those who died in a duel).
Please, Hikarushka, there is a lovely old churchi in Moscow, set back off the street, behind another dilapidated building, and it is called "Pushkin's Church". The church was never closed because of its relation to Pushkin, not even during the darkest years of the Godless Soviet Regime and the rector (nactoyatel) of the parish was never trucked off to prison nor shot like the rest of the clergy.
I prayed in this church the last time I was in Moscow but I CANNOT remember its name at all. It has lovely deep green cupolas and white face.
Hikarushka, Mike, can you help? I know that it is called "the Pushkin Church" unofficially.
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There is some mistery with this church.
Officialy, ( from the official point of view), Pushkin married in the Great Ascension Church of Moscow at the
Nikitskie Gates Square.
Marriage took place on 18th February 1831 in the vestibule of the still unfinished church. During the ceremony a sudden gust of wind blew out the groom's wedding candle, then he dropped the cross from the lectern, and during the exchange of rings one of them fell to the floor. Pushkin turned deathly pale - he saw all these things as a bad omen.
But, according to the old moscow drivers, there were another church ( I think somewhere near the Basmannaya street)
I do not know , who was right. I think that official version is more correct.
Or maybe in the small old church they celebrated something else?
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I read that Nikolay I has sent his ''people'' to stop the duel between Pushkin and D'Anthés however he delibaretely had sent them to the wrong adress.
There are some really twisted stories about Nikolay I, I dont know if I should write here but as far as I know Pushkin's wife didnt have an affair with him , didnt even flirt with him. However in the first ball she's ever been in Tsar's palace, Tsar requested to meet her but their meeting has interrupted by one of his men.
Pushkin was too Jealous of his wife eventhough he wasnt faithfull to her; and he was very afraid of being a ''Tsar murderer'' he says in his journal. When he catches Tsar's eyes staring at his wife, he was staring at Tsarina lustfully in order to make him understand what he's doing and he strictly has forbid his wife to go to the palace, they even did stop going to T.S. that often according to what I read.
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Technically Natalia was enable to flirt a lot to anybody, because she gave birth to several children of Pushkin - They had no money and she, as well as her sister, had to take care of her children.
The fact that children did not die could tell us that her care was good.