Alexander Palace Forum

Discussions about the Imperial Family and European Royalty => The Tudors => Topic started by: Helen_Azar on October 20, 2005, 11:00:01 AM

Title: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on October 20, 2005, 11:00:01 AM
Just found this online: http://www.bbc.co.uk/drama/features/feature_10.shtml

Anyone catch it? I didn't like the book (actually couldn't read it all the way through), but how was the film? I didn't even know they made it...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Prince_Lieven on October 20, 2005, 11:11:15 AM
I seen it, but can't remember much. To be honest, I wouldn't recommend it, Helen. It seemed pretty low budget or something, because the camera work was terrible and full of odd angles, which I know some people like, but I don't. Full of inaccuracies too.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on October 20, 2005, 11:21:24 AM
Thanks, PL.

Quote
Full of inaccuracies too.


Yeah, that would be the case if it was based on the book at all...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Prince_Lieven on October 20, 2005, 11:26:01 AM
No prob.  8) Personally, I don't like Philippa Gregory's books - among other things, her language is far too modern for the subject matter, IMO.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on October 20, 2005, 11:30:17 AM
Quote
 Personally, I don't like Philippa Gregory's books .


I don't either.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on October 20, 2005, 12:52:34 PM
I quite like Phillipa Gregory although saying that her latest one is utter pants. I watched the Other Boleyn Girl and it was so so.  Can't remember much about it so it couldn't have been that good.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Lanie on October 20, 2005, 12:54:32 PM
There's going to be some Hollywood film of this coming out in 2006, I believe.  I think Keira Knightley was asked to be Anne Boleyn.  Let me laugh really hard.

I liked Boleyn Girl, don't like her other Tudor novels.  Of course, I realize it's all totally sensationalized, but it's still fun reading.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on October 20, 2005, 01:06:04 PM
Quote
I quite like Phillipa Gregory although saying that her latest one is utter pants.


I am currently attempting to read "Virgin's Lover" - is this the one you mean? It's about Amy Robsart, Robert Dudley's wife. I am on page 15 maybe, and it seems sort of ok so far. But I don't like Gregory's style of writing that much and don't like that she takes liberties with historical facts. In which case I should probably stick with non-fiction and stop tormenting myself  ;D.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on October 20, 2005, 01:09:50 PM
Oh gawd, yes, thats the  one I got about 3/4 of the way through and thought " Oh hurry up and fall down those bl**dy stairs or I will push you myself ;D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: bell_the_cat on October 21, 2005, 12:53:09 AM
Quote
Oh gawd, yes, thats the  one I got about 3/4 of the way through and thought " Oh hurry up and fall down those bl**dy stairs or I will push you myself ;D



Kimberly! :o
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on October 21, 2005, 03:22:43 PM
 ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Zanthia on June 22, 2006, 01:54:00 AM
According to "The Hollywood Reporter", Natalie Portman and Eric Bana are in the final talk to star in the new making of "The other Boleyn Girl". Natalie as Anne and Bana as Henry VIII. Justin Chadwick will instruct and the shooting is set to begin in September.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Taren on June 22, 2006, 10:36:43 PM
I actually came here specifically to post about this. The Hollywood reporter link is http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr/film/brief_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002691243. I've never read the book, but I read these boards like crazy, and everyone seems to be in agreement that the book is awful, so will the movie be worse? I can't see Natalie Portman as Anne Boleyn. To me it's Helena Bonham Carter or nothing, but she's probably too busy filming Harry Potter.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on June 23, 2006, 02:38:15 AM
Eeeeuuuwww no, not Helena B-C .Wasn't she Anne Boleyn in a recent ITV production of the life of Henry VIII (played by Ray Winstone)
Oh and welcome to the threads Taren,nice to meet you. ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: ilyala on June 23, 2006, 05:49:52 AM
i personally think natalie's looks are too ingenue for the role. helena bonham carter has that 'sexy but bad' thing that might suit her better... but of course it depends on what is the image of anne that they are trying to create.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on June 23, 2006, 07:02:06 AM
I just think that Helena B-C always looks a tad unwashed ;D and her hair looks a bit itchy :o
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Zanthia on June 23, 2006, 10:17:23 AM
I've read the book, and I did'nt hate it, but I did'nt liked it either. I had to struggle to read on once in a while, but I finished it. It was a little boring and not well written, but I think most people don't like it because of the historical unaccurrancies.
The thing that annoyed me most was that P.G. made Anne older than Mary, putting Anne's birthyear in 1509, (which I personally think is wrong) and it seemed a little unlikely that Mary only should have been 13 years old when she became Henry's mistress. I know girls was married early back then, but I have always had the impression that Henry prefered women in his bed, not children! Catherine Howard was young too, but she at least was 16. Mary's body would barely have been full developed. And it also was a little wierd if Thomas Boleyn would have married his youngest daughter off in the age of 13, and waited to arrange anything for his eldest daughter until she was in her 20's.
I definetely think P.G. should have done her homework a little better, before writing this novel, because it is a good idea for a book. It just got the wrong writer.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on June 23, 2006, 12:17:28 PM
I think we should all take our Philippa Gregory books to the second hand shop and pick up anything by Barbara Erskine ;). She writes excellent historical fiction (not Tudor though)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Taren on June 25, 2006, 01:38:09 AM
Thanks for the welcome, Kimberly.  :)

I was looking up this movie on the internet movie database and the only name listed in the cast thus far is Rue McClanahan who is to be playing Lady Jane Rochford. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0467200/ is the address is anyone wants to check it out. I don't know if I'd trust this, as IMDB isn't 100% reliable so I guess we'll just have to see.

I noticed on the film's message board that they were speculating on the casting of Mary Boleyn and I realized I had completely forgotten about her, and she's the main character of the book, right? All the sites I saw only mentioned who would play Henry and Anne. So who would everyone like to see as Mary? I don't have any opinions now -only that I hope it's not Keira Knightley!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Prince_Lieven on June 25, 2006, 07:56:01 AM
The dislike of Ms Knightley that emanates from this board, in particular from the female members, never ceases to amuse me.  ;D ;D ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on June 25, 2006, 03:54:14 PM
I think you mean Keira Poutly don't you ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Lady_Aurora on June 26, 2006, 11:40:52 PM
The fact that they're making a movie based off of a book that (or so it seems) appears to be widely disliked amuses me.  I'm wondering if the movie will be better than the book...I only got about half-way through it.  Though I'm tempted to try again.  Sometimes I think the writing is worse than many sad fanfiction attempts I've read before.  Which is sad because I love the subject so much.  It seems weird that they would have Natalie Portman play Anne, no matter what version of her I can think of Natalie just doesn't seem like her...it's just weird to me.  I doubt I'm alone... I don't think I could see Keira as Mary either... maybe because the Bolyne sisters are interpreted differently... meh it might work though?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Zanthia on June 27, 2006, 04:01:08 AM
I too have a little difficult to imagine Natalie as the ambitious Anne. She is to "sweet" to that role. But she usually get sweet roles, maybe she want to show that she can be ruthless and pushy too. And who knows, maybe she'll surprise us. I, for one, is going to give the movie a chance when it comes up in the theaters, even though I was'nt thrilled of the book. "Marie Antoinette" gets a chance too, in spite of the very bad reviews.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on July 02, 2006, 03:29:41 PM
Stop press... Ms. Gregory has written another one soon to be published. This one is about Jane Boleyn and her actions regarding Anne Boleyn and Catherine Howard. I'm guessing Helen Azar will be first in the queue.......NOT... ;D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Lady_Aurora on July 03, 2006, 10:58:06 PM
ok...well i thought that no one read Ms. Gregory's books...the other day I went to the library to see if they had it...and maybe give her another chance.  And I've looked before and they have had several copies of her books...well there were only 2 left.  So maybe she's getting popular?  It weirded me out.  Oh well.  I'm kind of interested in seeing what they do with the movie though.  Maybe it will be better than the book?  It doesn't have to try to hard though...who knows.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on September 29, 2006, 11:39:29 AM
Why, oh why, would they make not one but two films based on that horrible book?! I'd like to keep an open mind, but the Scarlett J one sounds like it will be even worse than the BBC film....

I am sure there will be many more books coming from Ms Gregory, as long as there is demand (and obviously there is). But then again, the mass market has never been known for good taste  ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: nerdycool on October 28, 2006, 06:09:13 PM
I think I'm one of the few on this board who really likes "The Other Boleyn Girl". Granted, when I read it I knew next to nothing about the Tudors except for Henry had a gazillion wives, some of whom he had executed. But even then I knew that since it was a fictional book, many of the facts were bound to be wrong. In the end, it got me insterested in learning more about the Tudor period. And I am looking forward to the movie, even if most movies based off books are horrendous. They certainly have an all-star cast though... Scarlett Johansson, Natalie Portman, Eric Bana, Kristin Scott Thomas, Rue McClanahan.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Elisabeth on October 29, 2006, 07:42:07 AM
Nerdycool, I liked The Other Boleyn Girl, too. I found it to be thoroughly enjoyable, high-class historical trash. It reminded me of Kathleen Winsor's Forever Amber. Of course it's far more readable than Gregory's other books - better written and what's more important, better paced. I didn't find her playing fast and loose with the historical facts offensive. I was more intrigued by her ability to fashion a riveting melodrama out of the sparse material available to us on the early life of Anne Boleyn.

Prince Lieven, my estimation of Keira Knightley has risen considerably since I saw her play Elizabeth in the latest film version of Pride and Prejudice. Judging from that performance, she has a lot of range as an actress - she would have made an excellent Anne Boleyn. Does anyone know why she was replaced or why she bowed out of the production (did I miss a post or two)? Of course, Natalie Portman, as a natural brunette, looks more like the real Anne Boleyn than Keira. She's very beautiful and a thoroughly competent actress - but am I alone in finding her somewhat bland? She's like a young Natalie Wood - without the fire.

But the fact that Scarlett J is playing the role of Mary means that this will be a movie worth seeing. I do think Scarlett is one of the best, maybe the very best, in the latest crop of young Hollywood actresses. She looks like a baby Lana Turner, blonde, buxom and sexy. She also brings a great deal of intelligence to her roles. Although maybe intelligence isn't really called for in playing the role of Mary Boleyn?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: ilyala on October 30, 2006, 03:28:09 AM
i saw scarlett play in 'the island'. i agree, that movie is not one to impress with anyone's acting abilities but i was really not impressed. unlike her partner in the movie, ewan mcgregor, who can shine in a completely bland movie with his extraordinary acting ability, scarlett struck me as... ordinary. completely ordinary.

honestly, i didn't see any intelligence in her. she could make a good mary boleyn because of that, tho :)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: AuraBelle on October 30, 2006, 04:17:09 AM
I think I'm one of the few on this board who really likes "The Other Boleyn Girl". Granted, when I read it I knew next to nothing about the Tudors except for Henry had a gazillion wives, some of whom he had executed. But even then I knew that since it was a fictional book, many of the facts were bound to be wrong. In the end, it got me insterested in learning more about the Tudor period. And I am looking forward to the movie, even if most movies based off books are horrendous. They certainly have an all-star cast though... Scarlett Johansson, Natalie Portman, Eric Bana, Kristin Scott Thomas, Rue McClanahan.

Nerdycool, I thought *I* was the only one who liked "The Other Boleyn Girl".  It was pure luck really when I picked it up at the bookstore's but it really has spurred me on to learn more about the Tudors.  I suppose it was also because I knew little about that period that I enjoyed it and didn't think much of the anomalies and discrepancies but I am very much looking forward to seeing the movie along with Showtimes' The Tudors.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on October 31, 2006, 11:02:25 AM
I suppose I am irreversibly ruined by reading, for the last ten years, the  incomparable Jean Plaidy, who is an absolutely wonderful author of historical fiction - and who doesn't even have to stoop to "fantasy" to make her books interesting. And now I have discovered Elizabeth Byrd, who is just as good. Too bad they don't make movies based on their books! After being exposed to these two amazing authors, unfortunatley anyone else attempting the same genre seems, at best .... well ... bad.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: historylover on November 06, 2006, 01:13:52 AM
I grew up reading Jean Plaidy and I don't really agree.  I like Philippa Gregory, although she's quite hard on Elizabeth 1!

Regards,
Lisa
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on November 06, 2006, 08:02:34 AM
I like Philippa Gregory, although she's quite hard on Elizabeth 1!

Regards,
Lisa

I don't know if "quite hard on Elizabeth" is the right term. A more correct way to describe it, IMO, would be: she turns Elizabeth into a silly and weak harlequin romance heroine, which, IMO, is historically inaccurate and quite insulting. This is the main problem I have with Ms. Gregory's writing. In fact, most of her female characters are portrayed in a very distasteful way (IMO). But maybe it's just me...



Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on November 06, 2006, 01:31:27 PM
And me but I do like her non-royalty historical novels ;D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on November 07, 2006, 07:28:53 AM
I think that Ms. Gregory has a very active imagination, which is precisely what ruins her "historical" novels, but is the exact thing that is great for the authorship of regular fiction. She is not unique in this: I can think of other authors who, with their imaginative talents should be writing fiction only, but for some unknown reason wish to pursue historical non-fiction. IMO, Ms. Gregory would be so much better off sticking to regular fiction - something that would make everyone very happy - including yours truly  :). But obviously I realize that all this is not about making me happy but about selling books, so of course it will never happen   ;).


Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Harumi on December 01, 2006, 02:20:43 PM
(http://img162.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-1592/loc471/58345_2akb4h5_122_471lo.jpg)(http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/9429/17232nataliescarlett312ua8.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/2535/13597nataliescarlett612yf8.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)(http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/7936/13586nataliescarlett412xj5.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on December 01, 2006, 02:36:05 PM
Sorry, couldn't resist this; Bottom left photo, she looks a bit like Zara Phillips.  ;D

And Anne Boleyn is wearing the latest "chavtastic" trackie suit :P
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Marlene on January 08, 2007, 11:32:44 AM
The 90 minute BBC program is on my new Six Wives of Henry VIII DVD set

Why, oh why, would they make not one but two films based on that horrible book?! I'd like to keep an open mind, but the Scarlett J one sounds like it will be even worse than the BBC film....

I am sure there will be many more books coming from Ms Gregory, as long as there is demand (and obviously there is). But then again, the mass market has never been known for good taste  ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on January 09, 2007, 05:24:28 PM
The 90 minute BBC program is on my new Six Wives of Henry VIII DVD set

How was it, Marlene? Did it only come out as part of the Six Wives set and not on its own?

Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Marlene on January 11, 2007, 09:33:52 AM
I thought it was a preview, then realized it wasn't .. because it lasted a long time.  I was taking down the Christmas tree so I wasn't really watching.  So now that I know, I will watch it again.

Yes, it is on the last dvd in the set for the Six Wives of Henry VIII  (with Keith Michell)

The 90 minute BBC program is on my new Six Wives of Henry VIII DVD set

How was it, Marlene? Did it only come out as part of the Six Wives set and not on its own?


Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 04, 2007, 03:54:43 PM
I have this boxed set now ;) There is also an excellent documentary about the execution of Anne Boleyn- part of the BBC 2 series (The Days That Shook The World).
I gave "The Other Boleyn Girl" another airing tonight and if nothing else, it really does portray the absolute ruthlessness of families throwing daughters into the Royal bed.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Zanthia on March 10, 2007, 02:25:46 PM
Two pics from the upcoming movie. I hope they have corrected one of the mistakes that really annoyed me in the book: that Mary is portrayed as the eldest sister, like she was, instead of the youngest. But we'll have to wait and see.
(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i201/Zanthia1982/ref11.jpg)

(http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i201/Zanthia1982/ref10.jpg)
The costumes seems to be good, but the fabric for the sleeves looks very shiny. I'm not sure if they had silk/satin back then ???
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: ilyala on March 14, 2007, 03:22:15 AM
i'm not sure mary is the youngest sister...  :-\
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Zanthia on March 14, 2007, 07:25:47 AM
No, Anne was, but in the novel Anne was the oldest, and it really annoyed me, also that in the book, Mary is only 13 when she become Henry's mistress. That was so misplaced as anything could be. I don't think Henry would find sexual satisfaction with a child. (Catherine Howard was 16, but the body is more developed at this stage of the teens, and Henry was in the time of life when the midlife crisis usually turns in, at this point). There are strong evidence that says that Mary was the oldest of the Boleyn children, so why miss Gregory made her the youngest and put her date of birth as late as in 1508 is a riddle.  ??? If she was born in 1508, she would have been six years when she was sent to France to serve as maid-of-honour to Princess Mary Tudor, and about seven or eight when she was Francis I's mistress. I mean, come on, how likely is that? 8)
So I really hope the moviemakers have corrected those historical errors.

But my former post was easy to misunderstood, sorry :-*, hope it's clear now ;)

BTW, I had my doubts when I heard Natalie Portman should play Anne. I thought she would be to "sweet" for the part, but I love that look she has in the second pic. Very determined and tough, but also a little scared, knowing that she play with high stakes. I can easily imagine Anne looking like that.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Twinkle on March 24, 2007, 07:43:01 AM
I read 'The Other Boleyn Girl' and it's quite an entertaining read -providing you accept that it is heavily fictionalsed. It's just a shame that because the authoress has included a number of reference works in her bibliography, many readers will assume that her 'facts' are accurate -(and it is puzzling why anyone should go to so much trouble swatting- up only to squander the knowledge anyway. What's the point?) I agree that she isn't a patch on Jean Plaidy, who always researched extensively and knew that the true story was interesting enough without the need to try and embellish further. Her books are unputtdownable, and the characters so vivid that you live every moment with them and come away with far more knowledge on the era than any conventionable history lesson could provide.

I'm not getting a good feeling atall  about the 'Other Boleyn Girl' as a film. Neither of the actresses looks particularly well cast. I wonder if it's due to the fact that modern Hollywood faces have had so much surgical help that any essential character is missing? Contast those faces with the exquisitely bright and 'real' features of Genevieve Bujold in 'Anne of the Thousand Days' or the sultry Charlotte Rampling version of Anne in 'Henry VIII and his Six Wives'. (O.K. so the historical facts were a bit dodgy...) One actress whose face looks reasonably old fashined is possibly Racael Weisz? She'd have made a not bad Mary I think. Sometimes it would be almost better to take a chance on using an unknown name, but I don't suppose the film backers would go for the financial risk involved

Also the costumes look very disappointing. What are those silly little french hoods doing perched right up there ? In nearly all the designs, they concealed the ears. And where are the fabled hanging Boleyn sleeves? slashed puffs at the top of the sleeves were not that common until much later. The necklines were usually more elaborate too. Sorry to keep harping on about the the two previous films but the costuming was so superior. In almost every British T.V. drama on the Tudors the costuming has been superb. It's only in the last five years or so that it's started to suffer here too and ironically one of those T.V. dramas was- 'The Other Boleyn Girl'. Possibly the budgets just don't stretch to the same degree of splendour and authenticity any more. Or am I just being a grumpy old sod?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: ilyala on March 24, 2007, 10:25:55 AM
or maybe their targeted viewers are the people who are not aware of the facts you mentioned...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on May 12, 2007, 09:56:49 AM
I thought it was a preview, then realized it wasn't .. because it lasted a long time.  I was taking down the Christmas tree so I wasn't really watching.  So now that I know, I will watch it again.

Yes, it is on the last dvd in the set for the Six Wives of Henry VIII  (with Keith Michell)

I am confused now... This movie is not supposed to be coming out until the end of the year (December), but it's already out on DVD? Why would they have done that - has it come out in Europe, but not in the US?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on May 12, 2007, 03:40:15 PM
No, Marlene is talking about "The Other Boleyn Girl" that was the BBC production with Jhodie May and Jared Harris as Anne and Henry. Don't worry, you haven't missed much, although Jared was a very good Henry ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on May 12, 2007, 03:48:27 PM
No, Marlene is talking about "The Other Boleyn Girl" that was the BBC production with Jhodie May and Jared Harris as Anne and Henry. Don't worry, you haven't missed much, although Jared was a very good Henry ;)

Oh, I see. I guess you can't get that one anywhere else but as a bonus to Six Wives? I wonder why they decided to make not one, but TWO "The Other Boleyn Girl" versions?  ??? I mean, it's not that good  :P.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: FaithWhiteRose on June 20, 2007, 08:58:17 PM
There's going to be some Hollywood film of this coming out in 2006, I believe.  I think Keira Knightley was asked to be Anne Boleyn.  Let me laugh really hard.


Cast of Hollywood Other Boleyn Girl (from imdb):

Mary Boleyn= Scarlett Johansson
Anne Boleyn= Natalie Portman
Henry VIII= Eric Bana
Eddie Redmayne= William Stafford
Katherine of Aragon= Ana Torrent
George Boleyn= Jim Sturgess
Mary Talbot= Tiffany Freisberg
Jane Parker= Juno Temple
Thomas Boleyn= Mark Rylance
Wiliam Carey= Benedict Cumberbatch

And Keira Knightley as Anne is hillarious . . . I also heard that Jessica Biel tried out for a role. Which one I have no idea.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on December 29, 2007, 11:50:44 AM
Here is the official website with previews...

http://www.sonypictures.com/movies/theotherboleyngirl/
 
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on December 29, 2007, 11:53:29 AM
No, Marlene is talking about "The Other Boleyn Girl" that was the BBC production with Jhodie May and Jared Harris as Anne and Henry. Don't worry, you haven't missed much, although Jared was a very good Henry ;)

I still would like to get my hands on the BBC version...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: anna11 on January 12, 2008, 02:32:18 PM
I have the script for the new movie with Eric Banner and Natalie Portman. If you want it, pm me your email.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Silja on February 03, 2008, 12:05:14 PM

I'm not getting a good feeling atall  about the 'Other Boleyn Girl' as a film. Neither of the actresses looks particularly well cast. I wonder if it's due to the fact that modern Hollywood faces have had so much surgical help that any essential character is missing?

I very much agree. I saw only the trailer of it at the cinema, but judging from this, I think that both Natalie Portman and Scarlett Johansson are totally miscast in these roles. They look like modern Hollywood actrices who dressed up - not particularly accurately - for a fancy dress party. Also movements and manners looked entirely 21st century. I expect nothing of this film.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 03, 2008, 12:20:08 PM
I think that both Natalie Portman and Scarlett Johansson are totally miscast in these roles. They look like modern Hollywood actrices who dressed up - not particularly accurately - for a fancy dress party. Also movements and manners looked entirely 21st century. I expect nothing of this film.

Not a big surprise there... I will still watch it of course, but I don't expect much either...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: boleynfan on February 06, 2008, 12:28:19 PM
Saw the preview in the theater this past weekend.  I'll go see it too, but WOW....it's gonna be bad. 

Guess the story of a women becoming the king's mistress only to be followed by her sister, who becomes the Queen after her King breaks with the Pope to establish a church to marry said sister, and this Queen becomes the first English Queen to be beheaded (& mother of the great Elizabeth I) in isn't compelling enough.(Snark!)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on February 19, 2008, 04:21:33 PM
Well, if you want compelling.....Eric Bana's cod-piece was so huge he could apparently balance a cup of coffee on it!(they didn't say wether it was decaff.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 19, 2008, 04:37:23 PM
Oh lord, I can't wait...  ::)   :D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 19, 2008, 05:50:41 PM
Scarlett and Natalie show sisterly support at Royal Premiere of Anne Boleyn film 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/showbiz/showbiznews.html?in_article_id=516473&in_page_id=1773
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 19, 2008, 05:54:24 PM
I wonder what Prince Charles thought of the movie ;-)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 22, 2008, 09:17:26 AM
I may be able to see the early screening of the film this coming Wednesday, as my employer is giving out some tickets for that... I'll post my impressions if I do see it!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on February 24, 2008, 11:23:52 AM
Helen, I'm anxious to read your review! I didn't care for the book much; in this instance the truth was fantastic enough without having to be fictionalized in my opinion. I do like Scarlett J, she is so ethereal-looking it's almost creepy. But I find it's a rare thing when an American actress can pull off a British role better than even the most pedestrian British actress could have.

Are any of the dozen Boleyn Girl knock-off books better than the original?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 24, 2008, 12:11:22 PM
I didn't care for the book much; in this instance the truth was fantastic enough without having to be fictionalized in my opinion.

I didn't like the book at all, and I am prettysure the movie won't be that great, but at least knowing what to expect it won't be a disappointment. I look at it the same way as I look at Showtime's The Tudors when I watch, just to see what they will do with it ;-).


I do like Scarlett J, she is so ethereal-looking it's almost creepy. But I find it's a rare thing when an American actress can pull off a British role better than even the most pedestrian British actress could have.

I think Scarlett J will be good as Mary. Don't know about Natalie Portman as Anne. Although it's possible they will both surprise us...


Are any of the dozen Boleyn Girl knock-off books better than the original?

Oh yes, tons of them!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on February 24, 2008, 01:21:35 PM
And now....especially for Helen.....her favorite author speaks :-)
http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=517758&in_page_id=1879 (http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=517758&in_page_id=1879)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 24, 2008, 01:50:03 PM
And now....especially for Helen.....her favorite author speaks :-)
http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=517758&in_page_id=1879 (http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=517758&in_page_id=1879)


LOL. Thanks!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: boleynfan on February 25, 2008, 06:24:05 PM
And now....especially for Helen.....her favorite author speaks :-)
http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=517758&in_page_id=1879 (http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=517758&in_page_id=1879)

From this article "the historically based account of Mary Boleyn, the sister to Anne, who was Henry VIII's lover before her sister and who chose to leave Court and marry to suit herself, while Anne fought for the throne and the scaffold"

Anne "fought for the scaffold"?!?!  Mary "chose to leave court" and "marry to suit herself"?!?!   ACK!   ::)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Vecchiolarry on February 25, 2008, 06:49:00 PM
Hi,

I am slightly confused here:

Wasn't Mary older than Anne?
I understand that the movie has Anne as the older one.  Was this in the book?

What are the facts?  -  Who was older?

Thanks,
Larry
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 25, 2008, 06:50:11 PM

Wasn't Mary older than Anne?
I understand that the movie has Anne as the older one.  Was this in the book?

I don't think anyone really knows. It could be either one of them. Some historians believe it was Anne, others - Mary. There are no definitive records one way or another...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Vecchiolarry on February 25, 2008, 09:01:12 PM
Hi Helen,

Thanks for the info.  I guess it's like Yul Brynner said, "It is a puzzlement!".....
I guess Henry didn't check ID at the door to see if either was "legal";  although I think the least of his worrys as King was whether they were "jailbait"....

Larry
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: boleynfan on February 26, 2008, 12:38:27 PM
Hi,

I am slightly confused here:

Wasn't Mary older than Anne?
I understand that the movie has Anne as the older one.  Was this in the book?

What are the facts?  -  Who was older?

Thanks,
Larry

Sadly, you may be safest in betting the true history is the exact opposite of what is depicted in this film.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Princess of Cupertino on February 26, 2008, 12:58:20 PM
I am reading the book currently - I found it an enjoyable read. I've also read PG's other Tudor series and this is one of the better ones. Of course you can't take it as a serious history course but I think a lot of the sentiment, psychological analysis was not unfounded.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 29, 2008, 12:08:47 PM
Well, I saw the movie on Wednesday and am ready to give my feedback.

I will start with the positive. IMO, the acting, the sets, the costumes were very good. It was filmed on location in England (although not at Hever Castle - which would have been nice). It looked like Oxford, but I couldn't be sure... Scarlett J was very good as Mary, as was Natalie Portman. Brana gave a good performance as Henry VIII, despite his non-resemblence to the latter... After a while you kind of bought it. Most of the cast (with the exception of Brana) were chosen not only for their acting but also for their resemblence to real characters. The movie was enjoyable.

But...

Warning: Plot giveaway!  


As expected, many many historical inaccuracies - even worse than the book. For example, Cardinal Wolsey did not even exist in the movie! One  of the major players, and I don't think he was even mentioned! Another disturbing bit: in the movie Henry raped Anne Boleyn just before they got married - this is how their relationship was consumated! Ugh... 

More feedback later...

Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: boleynfan on February 29, 2008, 01:04:33 PM
Thanks for the review, Helen. 

SPOILER

Wonder what the deal is with Henry 8 being portrayed as a rapist?  Remember, Winstone's Henry raped Helena BC's Anne. At least there, it was at the end of the relationship when they were not on good terms.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 29, 2008, 02:07:05 PM
Thanks for the review, Helen. 

SPOILER

Wonder what the deal is with Henry 8 being portrayed as a rapist?  Remember, Winstone's Henry raped Helena BC's Anne. At least there, it was at the end of the relationship when they were not on good terms.

Well, in this movie, it was even more strange, because in one scene they show Henry raping Anne, Anne crying, and in the next scene they are getting married...  ??? It was almost as if they realized they are running out of time and better step on it and not waste anymore time on anything else...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 29, 2008, 02:48:18 PM
Don't get me wrong, I wasn't expecting anything more from the movie (having read the book). I think the movie achieved its purpose, i.e. to show Gregory's version of events: the competition between the Boleyn sisters and the love triangle with Henry VIII. And for that, historical accuracy was not really necessary (no matter how much we would like to have it). The movie skipped a LOT from the book, and changed some things (if I remember correctly), but that's  the nature of book-to-movie conversions. So a whole, I thought they did a pretty good job, if you base it on the book. I wasn't bored for even one minute, and as long as they go in with the idea that the movie won't be historically accurate, most people will enjoy this screen version of the book, IMO.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on February 29, 2008, 02:53:03 PM
Thanks for the review, Helen. 

SPOILER

Wonder what the deal is with Henry 8 being portrayed as a rapist?  Remember, Winstone's Henry raped Helena BC's Anne. At least there, it was at the end of the relationship when they were not on good terms.

Well, in this movie, it was even more strange, because in one scene they show Henry raping Anne, Anne crying, and in the next scene they are getting married...  ??? It was almost as if they realized they are running out of time and better step on it and not waste anymore time on anything else...

BTW, I can't remember, what was PG's version of this, did she have Henry rape Anne, or did the producers take liberties with that? I can't remember now...

Funny note: there were several times when the audience at the screening laughed at scenes which weren't supposed to be funny, when things they showed were on the ridiculous side...


SPOILER

Like when Anne was ready to have sex with her brother George, in fact was begging him to do it, so that she can get pregnant again... They never did it in the end, but attempted to, which is how Jane Rochford got the idea of incest, with which she went directly to the king (yeah, like that would ever happen!)...

Another weird thing was that there were no other men with whom Anne got accused of sleeping with, only George. They completely skipped over the adultery/treason and stuck with incest charges only... Now was there Francois I and Mary's affair with him...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: anna11 on February 29, 2008, 09:14:52 PM
Quote
Another disturbing bit: in the movie Henry raped Anne Boleyn just before they got married - this is how their relationship was consumated! Ugh... 

Oh dear...How much is Katherine of Aragon in the movie? I don't remember her at all from the script I have (which is a very early draft) but I can't imagine her not in it, she is fairly important!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on February 29, 2008, 10:01:41 PM

Like when Anne was ready to have sex with her brother George, in fact was begging him to do it, so that she can get pregnant again... They never did it in the end, but attempted to, which is how Jane Rochford got the idea of incest, with which she went directly to the king (yeah, like that would ever happen!)...

Another weird thing was that there were no other men with whom Anne got accused of sleeping with, only George. They completely skipped over the adultery/treason and stuck with incest charges only... Now was there Francois I and Mary's affair with him...

Helen, here you have proved more clearly than ever the dangers of historical fiction. I think the writer of such fiction has an obligation to adhere to at least the bare-boned facts. Create the dialogue not the facts!

People Magazine, for what it's worth, suggest the movie might have been better had Scarlett and Natalie flipped roles. Any opinions?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: anna11 on February 29, 2008, 10:43:12 PM
Oh god no. They fit the descriptions of their respective roles much better than the opposite!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 01, 2008, 09:08:22 AM
Oh god no. They fit the descriptions of their respective roles much better than the opposite!

I agree. IMO they were pretty well cast.

Quote
Another disturbing bit: in the movie Henry raped Anne Boleyn just before they got married - this is how their relationship was consumated! Ugh... 

Oh dear...How much is Katherine of Aragon in the movie? I don't remember her at all from the script I have (which is a very early draft) but I can't imagine her not in it, she is fairly important!

Katherine is there, but not too much. Of course, once again - as they often tend to, the actress they casted looked nothing like the real Katherine, she had the Spanish look with dark hair/eyes, but she didn't do a bad job... In the movie they had Katherine confront both Boleyn sisters and basically call them "whores". Which of course the real Katherine would never have done. And they had both sisters present at the trial. Of course that wasn't the case either...  ::)
Title: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Lucien on March 01, 2008, 12:25:37 PM
I wonder what Prince Charles thought of the movie ;-)

...."A kitchenmaids drama in beautifull costumes"...maybe.But then Portman told HRH;"It must be strange to see a fim version of your family .....the Prince repleid;"They were not family"
Title: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Lucien on March 01, 2008, 12:37:51 PM
Well, if you want compelling.....Eric Bana's cod-piece was so huge he could apparently balance a cup of coffee on it!(they didn't say wether it was decaff.

size of a butler-tray...it was nescafé...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 01, 2008, 03:08:31 PM
Oooh Lucien darling !!!! I will take my opera glasses and sit in the front row when I get round to seeing the movie.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 01, 2008, 03:15:11 PM
You know, I was so involved in the movie plot that I failed to notice Brana's codpiece!   :o
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Princess of Cupertino on March 02, 2008, 10:38:56 AM
I just finished reading the book. It seems PG was implying George and Anne did have an improper relationship. Where did she get this idea? Everything I read before stated this was a false accusation. It sounds like they went even further in the movie.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 02, 2008, 11:11:50 AM
I just finished reading the book. It seems PG was implying George and Anne did have an improper relationship. Where did she get this idea? Everything I read before stated this was a false accusation. It sounds like they went even further in the movie.

This is the type of stuff Ms Gregory tends to do, so nothing new there... Where did she get the idea? In her own vivid imagination, so she can sell more books ;-). I am not sure if I can say that the movie went farther, but Anne and George tried to have sex (in order for Anne to get pregnant again since Henry wouldn't sleep with her), but in the end they couldn't (or George couldn't)...

I forgot one more thing from the movie which was pretty out there   ANOTHER SPOILER BELOW


Anne and Henry Percy actually got married by a priest (but weirdly with no witneses) and consumated the marriage, after which the family freaked out (because Anne was supposed to be seducing Henry and not marrying someone else after all) and they annuled the marriage and Anne was sent away to France. She blamed Mary for this because Mary was the one who told on her, which is why later she took Henry away from Mary....She returned from France a whole new woman and Henry was besotted and dumped Mary as she was giving birth to his baby boy.... Ahum. Yep...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on March 02, 2008, 08:56:04 PM
So does the movie leave you feeling any more or less sympathy for either Anne or Mary?

Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: boleynfan on March 02, 2008, 10:56:21 PM
Well, spent my $6 today and got about what I expected.  My boyfriend told me to point out the inaccuracies.  I had one factual and one costuming before the credits were through...haha!

The director had a strange penchant for shooting through lattice screens and there were a few other choices that were equally annoying after you caught on to them.  Bana was ok, but the writing sure made Henry look a simpleton, thinking with one part of the anatomy only.  Scarlett's Mary was dull, dull, du..zzzzzzzzzzz! Thought Portman was OK as Anne, no Genvieve Buljold of course, but not bad considering what she had to work with. 

Anne was not written accurately, but we knew that.  Poor woman, we're still having to defend her against false charges of incest 500 years later.   Loved the time compression of the story, down to about three years, it seems.  Mary sure rode about the countryside alone on her horse a lot. 

Time to start setting the record straight on Anne again!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 03, 2008, 11:48:38 AM
So does the movie leave you feeling any more or less sympathy for either Anne or Mary?

No, not really. I think the idea was to make Mary sympathetic, but not sure if it worked. But for what they had to work with (the Gregory book) I didn't think they did a bad job. Of course I knew what to expect, which wasn't much...

I had one factual and one costuming before the credits were through...haha!

What was the costuming error, I didn't catch it?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on March 03, 2008, 01:20:04 PM
Time to start setting the record straight on Anne again!

With respect to those spurious incest charges, or her reputation generally? Just curious to know what you have in mind that needs straightening.

Thanks, Jenn
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 03, 2008, 01:26:17 PM
Time to start setting the record straight on Anne again!

With respect to those spurious incest charges, or her reputation generally? Just curious to know what you have in mind that needs straightening.

Thanks, Jenn

I don't think that by now anyone who has read Anne's biographies has any thoughts about her being guilty of the charges she was convicted of. However, those who are not familiar with history, who only get their information from books like Gregory's, would probably take it at face value that she was guilty (since this is what the book claims). You would be surprised how many people think they are learning real history when they read these "historical" fiction novels!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: boleynfan on March 03, 2008, 02:30:45 PM
What was the costuming error, I didn't catch it?
[/quote]

Helen A. , the dress worn by Lady Elizabeth Boleyn as the three children played in the fields looked straight out of a Cranach painting.  Certainly nothing that would have been worn around 1505 in England.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 03, 2008, 02:44:05 PM
... the dress worn by Lady Elizabeth Boleyn as the three children played in the fields looked straight out of a Cranach painting. 

LOL. I don't remember the dress, but I am sure you're right! I think they got the other costumes right, didn't they?   
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on March 03, 2008, 05:47:29 PM
Time to start setting the record straight on Anne again!

With respect to those spurious incest charges, or her reputation generally? Just curious to know what you have in mind that needs straightening.

Thanks, Jenn

I don't think that by now anyone who has read Anne's biographies has any thoughts about her being guilty of the charges she was convicted of. However, those who are not familiar with history, who only get their information from books like Gregory's, would probably take it at face value that she was guilty (since this is what the book claims). You would be surprised how many people think they are learning real history when they read these "historical" fiction novels!

Funny you should mention this. I began reading Amy Tan's Saving Fish From Drowning last night, having never read her works before. Ten pages in and it's so muddled I can't tell where the facts leave off and the fiction begins. Sad thing is, there IS good historical fiction out there, but there's such a rush to capitalize on PGs success that each of Henry's wives has two or three books apiece now, deserved or not.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 03, 2008, 06:16:38 PM
Funny you should mention this. I began reading Amy Tan's Saving Fish From Drowning last night, having never read her works before. Ten pages in and it's so muddled I can't tell where the facts leave off and the fiction begins. Sad thing is, there IS good historical fiction out there, but there's such a rush to capitalize on PGs success that each of Henry's wives has two or three books apiece now, deserved or not.

Alas... I have heard some of my friends talk about Tudor history, which they think they now know after reading Gregory or watching The Tudors or Cate Blanchett's Elizabeth... They are shocked when I point out the mistakes because they assume that it is all accurate!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on March 04, 2008, 12:31:42 PM
Funny you should mention this. I began reading Amy Tan's Saving Fish From Drowning last night, having never read her works before. Ten pages in and it's so muddled I can't tell where the facts leave off and the fiction begins. Sad thing is, there IS good historical fiction out there, but there's such a rush to capitalize on PGs success that each of Henry's wives has two or three books apiece now, deserved or not.

Alas... I have heard some of my friends talk about Tudor history, which they think they now know after reading Gregory or watching The Tudors or Cate Blanchett's Elizabeth... They are shocked when I point out the mistakes because they assume that it is all accurate!

I'm curious though, films like Elizabeth and A Man for All Seasons, are they considered biographical or more like historical fiction? When I think of Robert Bolt's play/screenplay, it seems to me he gave the subject a very narrow focus; the agenda was not to present More's life in full. Had Bolt also included the burning of heretics the film may have been more "honest," more commercial, but he avoided sensationalism for sensationalism's sake and created a real work of art in the process. I find an agenda, beyond entertainment, harder to pin down in Elizabeth.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: boleynfan on March 04, 2008, 02:04:32 PM
It seems clear that writers in the past were far more likely to dramatize history rather than fictionalize it without being clear that was the plan.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 04, 2008, 02:36:14 PM
I'm curious though, films like Elizabeth and A Man for All Seasons, are they considered biographical or more like historical fiction? When I think of Robert Bolt's play/screenplay, it seems to me he gave the subject a very narrow focus; the agenda was not to present More's life in full. Had Bolt also included the burning of heretics the film may have been more "honest," more commercial, but he avoided sensationalism for sensationalism's sake and created a real work of art in the process. I find an agenda, beyond entertainment, harder to pin down in Elizabeth.

Well, the former (Elizabeth) was completely fictionalized (as boleynfan mentioned), while the latter is less inaccurate (although still somewhat) but dramatized and one-sided...  Elizabeth is extremely "Hollywood", which plays around with history all the time, while MfAS is less so, rather more along the lines of BBC productions on a larger scale...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 04, 2008, 07:46:33 PM
Oh yes, I wanted to add that Johanson and Portman didn't do a bad job with the English accents, IMO ;-) ...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 06, 2008, 10:39:51 AM
CNN review: http://www.cnn.com/2008/SHOWBIZ/Movies/02/29/review.boleyn/index.html
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on March 06, 2008, 11:10:25 AM
CNN review: http://www.cnn.com/2008/SHOWBIZ/Movies/02/29/review.boleyn/index.html

This is the second review suggesting Natalie and Scarlett should have switched roles. I'm a Scarlett fan for sure, have never seen Ms Portman in anything. Eric Bana starred in two of my fave films (Munich, Black Hawk Down), but there is just something very tepid about his performances.
I love the photo accompanying the CNN review!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 06, 2008, 11:25:10 AM
This is the second review suggesting Natalie and Scarlett should have switched roles.

I am not sure why that is. I think they were very well cast, and they both did a good job with their respective roles (well, what they had to play with). Looks-wise, they were almost perfect. If SJ was cast as Anne, I wouldn't buy it, because she looks nothing like Anne, a completely different type, which would be too distracting... But NP does, while SJ resembles Mary a lot more. Take a look:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/helenazar/art_boleyn.jpg) 
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/helenazar/anneboleyn-1.jpg)(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/helenazar/maryboleyn.jpg)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 06, 2008, 11:30:47 AM
Eric Bana starred in two of my fave films (Munich, Black Hawk Down), but there is just something very tepid about his performances.

Bana was miscast IMO, but to be fair I think his role was minimized because the focus of the movie was supposed to on the sisters, not the king...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 06, 2008, 11:55:53 AM
It opens in the UK tomorrow and I am looking forward to it (yes, really) but I'll have to wait until next week to see it.
With a bit of luck, Mark Kermode (an acid tongued film critic who I adore) may well review it on BBC Radio 5 tomorrow afternoon. (He will probably shred it)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 06, 2008, 11:57:13 AM
With a bit of luck, Mark Kermode (an acid tongued film critic who I adore) may well review it on BBC Radio 5 tomorrow afternoon. (He will probably shred it)

Please post it if he does!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Annie on March 06, 2008, 07:50:57 PM
i personally think natalie's looks are too ingenue for the role. helena bonham carter has that 'sexy but bad' thing that might suit her better... but of course it depends on what is the image of anne that they are trying to create.

I think Natalie's looks are perfect for the role, but I guess this is because the image I have of Anne is Genveive Bujold who played her in "Anne of a Thousand Days" when I was a kid.

(http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1213/1405128276_b61d324223_o.jpg)

Besides, Helena is much too old. She's over 40, and Anne only lived to be 27. (Natalie is 26)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 07, 2008, 09:42:34 AM
With a bit of luck, Mark Kermode (an acid tongued film critic who I adore) may well review it on BBC Radio 5 tomorrow afternoon. (He will probably shred it)

Please post it if he does!



Well, the good Dr. Kermode has vented his spleen just now.
He felt that David Morrissey (Duke of Norfolk) was ultra-sinister, Kirsten Scott-Thomas (Elizabeth Boleyn) was brilliant and Eric Bana the most 6 packed Henry VIII he had ever seen.
Eric Bana wasn't given the opportunity to be as psychotic as he could be, Natalie Portman was pretty good but Scarlett Johansson cannot act to save her life.
The problem with the film (he felt) was that it was neither "fish nor fowll". It didn't know wether it was a bodice-ripper or what it actually was; a dark foul story of the abuse of women,political shennannigans, incest, violence and brutal reality. In short, he felt that it was "interesting but a bit rubbish".
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 07, 2008, 01:14:44 PM
i personally think natalie's looks are too ingenue for the role. helena bonham carter has that 'sexy but bad' thing that might suit her better... but of course it depends on what is the image of anne that they are trying to create.

I think Natalie's looks are perfect for the role, but I guess this is because the image I have of Anne is Genveive Bujold who played her in "Anne of a Thousand Days" when I was a kid.

Besides, Helena is much too old. She's over 40, and Anne only lived to be 27. (Natalie is 26)

I didn't buy eithere HBC or Genveive Bujold  as Anne Boleyn (as far as looks). They both have faces that are way too round... Anne had a very long sort of horsey face. The one who came closest was definitely Natalie Portman (although NT is prettier than Anne was). BTW, Anne was about 36 when she died (some believe she was 29, but most historians lean towards the former).


Well, the good Dr. Kermode has vented his spleen just now.
He felt that David Morrissey (Duke of Norfolk) was ultra-sinister, Kirsten Scott-Thomas (Elizabeth Boleyn) was brilliant and Eric Bana the most 6 packed Henry VIII he had ever seen.
Eric Bana wasn't given the opportunity to be as psychotic as he could be, Natalie Portman was pretty good but Scarlett Johansson cannot act to save her life.
The problem with the film (he felt) was that it was neither "fish nor fowll". It didn't know wether it was a bodice-ripper or what it actually was; a dark foul story of the abuse of women,political shennannigans, incest, violence and brutal reality. In short, he felt that it was "interesting but a bit rubbish".

Ouch, he is cruel!  :-) I don't think Scarlett is so bad. She did have to master the English accent after all, not just her lines! ;-) I didn't have a problem with the film being neither here nor there... I wonder if this guy has seen Showtime's The Tudors, and if so I would love to hear what he thinks, lol.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 07, 2008, 01:24:41 PM
I doubt if he has seen The Tudors, (he has a dislike of the TV). If you think thats cruel, you should hear what he has to say about Keira Knightly (or Ikea Poutly) and Uma Thurman and don't even get him started about "Orblando Loon". :-)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/fivelive/entertainment/kermode.shtml (http://www.bbc.co.uk/fivelive/entertainment/kermode.shtml)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 07, 2008, 01:25:53 PM
I doubt if he has seen The Tudors, (he has a dislike of the TV). If you think thats cruel, you should hear what he has to say about Keira Knightly (or Ikea Poutly) and Uma Thurman and don't even get him started about "Orblando Loon". :-)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/fivelive/entertainment/kermode.shtml (http://www.bbc.co.uk/fivelive/entertainment/kermode.shtml)

LOL. I wish he would watch THE TUDORS and give us his opinion!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 07, 2008, 11:51:59 PM
I feel as though Eric Bana didn't really get into the role of Henry VIII. Something just seem to be lacking on his part, which is unfortunate because he's very talented. I also think we've seen Natalie Portman at her best to date. I've never been a fan of her's or Scarlett Johansson's, but the evil side of Portman as Anne Boleyn in the movie really brought out her acting ability.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 08, 2008, 07:34:11 AM
I feel as though Eric Bana didn't really get into the role of Henry VIII. Something just seem to be lacking on his part, which is unfortunate because he's very talented.

I think that's because he was totally miscast...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 08, 2008, 04:18:32 PM
That's probably it. None of the characters really seem to go well with one another, I would never have put any of them together. It was an odd group! But it convinced me to buy Philippa Gregory's book and the Constant Princess too.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 08, 2008, 07:05:21 PM
But it convinced me to buy Philippa Gregory's book and the Constant Princess too.

Well, don't expect too much... It's kind of fun to read as long as you don't expect any historical accuracy.. .Sort of like 16th century Jackie Collins novels ;-)...  The Constant Princess especially is waaay out there. Wait till you get a load of it...The Other Boleyn Girl is not far behind.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 08, 2008, 07:11:45 PM
Haha I'm not expecting much. I have read plenty of biographies, accurate and inaccurate. I still consider myself new to the history scene. I didn't appreciate the subject until after college.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 08, 2008, 07:18:38 PM
Haha I'm not expecting much. I have read plenty of biographies, accurate and inaccurate.

Well, with The Other Boleyn Girl and especially The Constant Princess it goes beyond just inaccurate, it's downright fantasy land...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 08, 2008, 07:27:34 PM
That's okay, I don't mind. My brain needs a break anyway after reading a biography on Queen Victoria and Empress Sissi. :) I always struggle trying to keep up with the politics of any country I read about.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 08, 2008, 07:30:28 PM
That's okay, I don't mind. My brain needs a break anyway after reading a biography on Queen Victoria and Empress Sissi. :) 

You will find it entertaining I think :-)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 09, 2008, 03:00:15 AM
Saving NAOTMAA, don't bother with "The Virgin's Lover". It is so long drawn out that by 3/4 of the way through, you will want to push Amy Robsart down the stairs yourself...just to get it over with:-)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 09, 2008, 08:38:18 AM
Saving NAOTMAA, don't bother with "The Virgin's Lover". It is so long drawn out that by 3/4 of the way through, you will want to push Amy Robsart down the stairs yourself...just to get it over with:-)

Hear hear :-)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 09, 2008, 10:57:13 AM
Quote
Saving NAOTMAA, don't bother with "The Virgin's Lover". It is so long drawn out that by 3/4 of the way through, you will want to push Amy Robsart down the stairs yourself...just to get it over with:-)

I saw it on the shelf and didn't even bother lol. I'm not out to become a huge Philippa Gregory fan, don't worry. But thank you for the warning! :) Any good bios on the Boleyns or even just Anne?? I always read about her through the bios of Henry and Elizabeth.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: RomanovFan on March 09, 2008, 03:53:28 PM
There's a couple of boooks about the Six Wives of Henry VIII. One is by David Starsky and the other, by Alison Weir. I've only read the one by Alison Weir, but what she has written on Anne is pretty good.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 09, 2008, 04:03:15 PM
There's a couple of boooks about the Six Wives of Henry VIII. One is by David Starsky and the other, by Alison Weir. I've only read the one by Alison Weir, but what she has written on Anne is pretty good.

Weir is one of my favorites, her writing is so clear and easy to comprehend. I have the Six Wives of Henry VIII though. Thank you anyway, I really appreciate it. If anything else comes up, please let me know!

Natassja
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: pandora on March 09, 2008, 04:21:52 PM
Purchased this book, yesterday, and I'm hoping it'll be a decent read. The movie I plan on skipping since it hasn't received favorable reviews though very few books-made-into-movies fair well at the box office, in my opinion.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 09, 2008, 04:29:22 PM
Bio; The Life and Death of Anne Boleyn, The Most Happy. by Eric Ives
A really nice fiction novel is; Brief, Gaudy Hour, by Margaret Campbell Barnes (she also wrote a charming novel "My Lady of Cleves). All available on Amazon.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 09, 2008, 05:54:19 PM
Bio; The Life and Death of Anne Boleyn, The Most Happy. by Eric Ives
A really nice fiction novel is; Brief, Gaudy Hour, by Margaret Campbell Barnes (she also wrote a charming novel "My Lady of Cleves). All available on Amazon.

Thank you Kimberly. I will look for them!


Natassja
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: anna11 on March 09, 2008, 07:38:27 PM
Hey, has anyone read The Queen of Subtilties? http://www.amazon.com/Queen-Subtleties-Novel-Anne-Boleyn/dp/B000HWYL1K/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-2 (http://www.amazon.com/Queen-Subtleties-Novel-Anne-Boleyn/dp/B000HWYL1K/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-2)

It's got bad reviews on amazon, and that suprises me because i've read Suzannah Dunn's other book 'The Sixth Wife' (http://www.amazon.com/Sixth-Wife-Novel-Suzannah-Dunn/dp/0061431567/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-1 (http://www.amazon.com/Sixth-Wife-Novel-Suzannah-Dunn/dp/0061431567/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-1)) and I really liked it. I thought it was really will written, and engrossing. It suprises me that I even liked it because I generally don't like historical fiction.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 09, 2008, 07:50:20 PM
Hey, has anyone read The Queen of Subtilties? http://www.amazon.com/Queen-Subtleties-Novel-Anne-Boleyn/dp/B000HWYL1K/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-2 (http://www.amazon.com/Queen-Subtleties-Novel-Anne-Boleyn/dp/B000HWYL1K/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-2)

It's got bad reviews on amazon, and that suprises me because i've read Suzannah Dunn's other book 'The Sixth Wife' (http://www.amazon.com/Sixth-Wife-Novel-Suzannah-Dunn/dp/0061431567/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-1 (http://www.amazon.com/Sixth-Wife-Novel-Suzannah-Dunn/dp/0061431567/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1205109240&sr=1-1)) and I really liked it. I thought it was really will written, and engrossing. It suprises me that I even liked it because I generally don't like historical fiction.

Do you recommend them?



~ Natassja Andreyevna
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: anna11 on March 09, 2008, 08:30:50 PM
I havn't read Queen of Subtilties, but I think I will. If I hadn't read the amazon reviews I would recommend The Sixth Wife, because I thought it was good. But the amazon reviewers are probably a lot more schooled on the subject than I am, so their opinion counts more. Plus there are more of them, and they've pretty much all given bad reviews.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Queen Victoria on March 09, 2008, 08:40:05 PM
I havn't read Queen of Subtilties, but I think I will. If I hadn't read the amazon reviews I would recommend The Sixth Wife, because I thought it was good. But the amazon reviewers are probably a lot more schooled on the subject than I am, so their opinion counts more. Plus there are more of them, and they've pretty much all given bad reviews.

I rarely go by what the reviewers say, because I end up enjoying the books I buy anyway. It's about personal taste and what you like, not what they like. I'll check my local library first, that is what I normally do, and then I can read through the books first before I buy them for my library.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 16, 2008, 09:03:07 AM
Hey, has anyone read The Queen of Subtilties?
  I read it and thought it wasn't bad at all. Certainly not as inaccurate as any of Gregory's books. It was well written and creative. Of course the author has taken some liberties with more obscure characters, but that didn't impact the history. I would recommend it as a good read.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Prudence on March 17, 2008, 10:35:53 AM
I know the birth order of the Boleyn sisters was turned around in the book, which I have read.

To those who have seen the movie, was Jane Seymour portrayed as she was in the book or did she have a speaking role at all?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Silja on March 18, 2008, 02:35:26 PM
I've seen the film now. What rubbish really - hahaha - but the costumes were actually good. Much better than I had expected from the trailer.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: anna11 on March 18, 2008, 06:49:11 PM
Quote
To those who have seen the movie, was Jane Seymour portrayed as she was in the book or did she have a speaking role at all?

She doesn't have a speaking role at all. She's seem very briefly strolling with Henry.

I found the film pretty entertaining, I think you just have to watch it and not take it seriously, just as a piece of entertainment. If you don't you're going to be disappointed.

I thought Natalie Portman was fantastic though.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Prudence on March 19, 2008, 07:56:20 PM
Quote from: anna11
I found the film pretty entertaining, I think you just have to watch it and not take it seriously, just as a piece of entertainment. If you don't you're going to be disappointed.
I find that to be true for the majority of historical fiction. Thank you for answering my question, anna11.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on March 20, 2008, 06:29:58 PM


I found the film pretty entertaining, I think you just have to watch it and not take it seriously, just as a piece of entertainment. If you don't you're going to be disappointed.


Yes, that's exactly the way I approach these kinds of films, which makes them fun to watch...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on March 29, 2008, 05:53:15 PM
Well, I still haven't seen it !!  BUT, I got bitten by the culture bug tonight and hubby and I went to see "Anna Bolena" by Donizetti....opera don't you know. It was my first time and the performance (by the English Touring Opera) was at my local theatre. I have to say that I was absolutely mesmerised by it and, of course it wasn't historically correct but that didn't matter because it really portrayed the absolute tragedy and horror of this poor woman's downfall. Sorry to be o/t but it was really heart-rending. I highly recommend it.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Silja on March 31, 2008, 03:38:37 PM
I've always wanted to see that, but haven't yet. It's not performed so very often. I quite like Donizetti. His two other "Tudor operas", Maria Stuarda and Roberto Devereux are also very inaccurate historically, but I like the music.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: RomanovFan on April 13, 2008, 12:24:56 AM
I've seen The Other Boleyn Girl. The movie itself isn't very good and there isn't any acting chemistry between Natalie Portman, Scarlett Johannsen and Eric Bana. The historical facts are inaccurate and fictional events are put in place those.

1. No one really knows if Mary Boleyn's children were fathered by Henry VIII or otherwise.
2. Henry VIII did not rape Anne Boleyn, thus the future Elizabeth I was not the result of a rape.
3. Anne was the younger sister, not Mary.
4. George Boleyn's wife, Jane, does not witness the nearly-acted-upon inscest between her husband and Anne.

I give it 1 1/2 stars (out of four.) Not very good and historical fact was left out almost completely. Perhaps, if there had been some on-screen chemistry between the 3 lead actors, it would have been a better film. No offense meant to those of you who enjoyed it. This is just my personal opinon.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: historylover on April 13, 2008, 05:14:47 AM
I've seen it and I found it very dark and bleak.  I wasn't expecting it to be much good but I wanted to see magnificent palaces and beautiful gardens at least!

It's not at all historically accurate and now Philippa Gregory is even accusing Anne of committing murder!  Mary was a bit of a slut, not Anne.  There's no evidence that
Anne was unfaithful and most historians agree that she wasn't.  She certainly didn't commit incest with her brother - there was no evidence of that.  I think that it
was just that spiteful Jane Rochford accusing her.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Puppylove on May 05, 2008, 12:00:33 PM
It's not at all historically accurate and now Philippa Gregory is even accusing Anne of committing murder!  Mary was a bit of a slut, not Anne.  There's no evidence that
Anne was unfaithful and most historians agree that she wasn't.  She certainly didn't commit incest with her brother - there was no evidence of that.  I think that it
was just that spiteful Jane Rochford accusing her.


I count myself among those who believe Anne committed neither adultery or incest. On the other hand, there's enough evidence to persuade me she was guilty of great cruelty; I'm not familiar enough with English law to know whether that cruelty rose to the level of a crime. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on May 08, 2008, 12:33:07 PM
On the other hand, there's enough evidence to persuade me she was guilty of great cruelty; I'm not familiar enough with English law to know whether that cruelty rose to the level of a crime. Any thoughts?

Do you mean the way she treated Catherine and Mary and some others?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: mcdnab on May 12, 2008, 07:49:16 AM
I think the perception of Anne's cruelty depends on your view of which was the valid marriage and whether you admire Catherine of Aragon of not.

Ultimately the person responsible for how Catherine of Aragon and Princess Mary were treated lies with one person and that person was Henry VIII.  I certainly believe that Anne wasn't adverse to emphasising her political pre eminence before and after her marriage.

The line that Henry would have done whatever Anne suggested particularly after their marriage in 1533 doesn't hold much water although its often used to lay the blame for how Catherine and Mary were treated on her.

It largely depends on hostile witnesses and uses the convention of the time that a Monarch was never wrong (just surrounded by bad advisors, deceived by evil counsellors etc).

She certainly had no reason to be kind to Catherine and Mary (they were a significant threat to her security and the security of her own potential children) - A 16th Century Court was no place to be a wilting kindly flower!

The one thing that offends me about Gregory's book and the BBC adaptation and now the big screen version is that the original story is stunningly good in its own right and doesn't need the embellishments.

Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on May 12, 2008, 11:57:23 AM
The one thing that offends me about Gregory's book and the BBC adaptation and now the big screen version is that the original story is stunningly good in its own right and doesn't need the embellishments.

Amen!

I still would like to see the BBC version, does anyone know if it's possible to get it on its own (without the Six Wives of Henry VIII DVD)? Who was in it again?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on May 12, 2008, 01:29:14 PM
Jared Harris (son of the late Richard Harris) played Henry.
Jhodie May..... Anne Boleyn.
Natasha McElhone....Mary Boleyn (she is beautiful)
The gorgeous Philip Glenister ....... Stafford.
http://services.windowsmedia.com/dvdcover/cov150/dru500/u520/u52021ug5db.jpg (http://services.windowsmedia.com/dvdcover/cov150/dru500/u520/u52021ug5db.jpg)

http://www.amazon.com/Other-Boleyn-Girl-2003-Version/dp/B00114XM04/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1210616655&sr=1-3 (http://www.amazon.com/Other-Boleyn-Girl-2003-Version/dp/B00114XM04/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1210616655&sr=1-3)

Here ya go Helen, its available from Amazon ( do you have HMV stores across the pond? Its on sale for £3.99 in the uk)
Its ok, Jared Harris makes for a very good (and magnetic) Henry. Its a bit "trendy" because there is quite a bit of hand held camera work and both sisters talk to the camera quite a lot. I understand that it was mostly unscripted.

Oh, I see the release date is October for the UK and December for the US. The Six Wives of Henry VIII with the additional dvd is still available over here and is selling for £16 on Amazon.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on May 12, 2008, 02:10:04 PM
Jared Harris (son of the late Richard Harris) played Henry.
Jhodie May..... Anne Boleyn.
Natasha McElhone....Mary Boleyn (she is beautiful)
The gorgeous Philip Glenister ....... Stafford.
http://services.windowsmedia.com/dvdcover/cov150/dru500/u520/u52021ug5db.jpg (http://services.windowsmedia.com/dvdcover/cov150/dru500/u520/u52021ug5db.jpg)

http://www.amazon.com/Other-Boleyn-Girl-2003-Version/dp/B00114XM04/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1210616655&sr=1-3 (http://www.amazon.com/Other-Boleyn-Girl-2003-Version/dp/B00114XM04/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1210616655&sr=1-3)

Here ya go Helen, its available from Amazon ( do you have HMV stores across the pond? Its on sale for £3.99 in the uk)
Its ok, Jared Harris makes for a very good (and magnetic) Henry. Its a bit "trendy" because there is quite a bit of hand held camera work and both sisters talk to the camera quite a lot. I understand that it was mostly unscripted.

Oh, I see the release date is October for the UK and December for the US. The Six Wives of Henry VIII with the additional dvd is still available over here and is selling for £16 on Amazon.

Thanks, Kim. I don't think I know any of these actors.... Mostly unscripted? Interesting...  As far as I know we don't have HMV stores here :-(... But I added it to my wish list on amazon, not sure if I will buy it for myself or wait until someone buys it for me as a gift!  But I think would like to see it eventually.

P.S. It's got to be better than the Hollywood version since it's made by BBC (although I am surprised that BBC would want to use Gregory's book to base it on...)!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on May 12, 2008, 02:36:54 PM
Well, for starters, the actors in the TV movie can actually act!!
Its really ok, I have watched it 3 or 4 times now.(obviously got way too much time on my hands.)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on May 12, 2008, 02:49:31 PM
Well, for starters, the actors in the TV movie can actually act!!
Its really ok, I have watched it 3 or 4 times now.(obviously got way too much time on my hands.)

That sounds like a recommendation! I will be getting it :-)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on June 30, 2008, 09:11:15 AM
Well, its out on DVD today and I have just wasted £13 on it. Kirsten Scott Thomas (Elizabeth Boleyn ) steals any scenes she is in because she is actually a good actress. On the other hand Scarlett J just gawps about with her mouth half open like some great booby and there is not a lot of passion coming from the other one (Portman), she is just wooden.
The sad thing is this is such a great story of passion, betrayal and death and the main protagonists were utterly without any passion. Poor casting and poor script, what a shame.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on June 30, 2008, 01:01:30 PM
I think it is true that much of Mary Boleyn's life was cut out of the film (survived in deleted scenes section). It is true she was beautiful and had a true heart. She wisely left court forever and kept her promise to Anne (her daughter Catherine Carey was the cloest Elizabeth I had with a sister and guarded and served her till her death).
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Mari on July 01, 2008, 08:15:55 AM
What was the promise to Anne by Mary Boleyn her Sister?   :-\
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 01, 2008, 04:11:35 PM
I think it was to raise her daughter (Elizabeth) or something like that...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 01, 2008, 08:05:19 PM
False. Since Mary Boleyn never returned to court, so cannot serve Elisabeth. However her daughter Catherine and Son Henry were Elisabeth I staunch supporters. Read the recent book on Lady Penelope Rich. It covers her grandmother Kat Carey, her mother Lettice Dudley as well as evidence for her children as bastards of Henry VIII.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 03, 2008, 05:23:49 PM
False. Since Mary Boleyn never returned to court, so cannot serve Elisabeth.

I meant according to this movie. In real life of course that never happened. But a lot of the stuff in the movie was nonsense including this "promise"...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 04, 2008, 01:52:46 AM
That is why I said :False ! It simply did not happen.  :(
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 04, 2008, 08:03:10 AM
That is why I said :False ! It simply did not happen.  :(

Of course not. But we are discussing the movie here, not what really happened ;-)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 05, 2008, 10:59:38 AM
However it should be made clear nonetheless. I heard people discover history only by watching movies and tv...shocking...However "The Tudors" was more problemetic than "The Other Boleyn Girl".  :o
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on July 05, 2008, 02:13:58 PM
But WE know that Eric. A friend of mine, who has no interest in history whatsoever,went to see this movie. She was so entranced by the character of Anne Boleyn (gawd knows how from La Portman's portrayal), she is now reading a couple of my bios of the Tudors and is fascinated by them....so I suppose the film has done some good!!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 06, 2008, 12:05:05 AM
Well...I think the Portman portrayal was quite close to the real Anne Boleyn (in terms of character...). Mary Boleyn was more of a mystery.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: historylover on July 06, 2008, 06:14:43 AM
I don't think that the Portman portrayal was close to her!  I think that the book and the movie ruin Anne's reputation to a big extent.
Most historians agree that she was innocent of adultery and I'm sure that she would never have considered sleeping with her own brother, no matter what the gossip was.
Anne was very religious.

Mary is portrayed in the film as very sweet and innocent.  This is also untrue.

Regards,
Lisa
www.bookaddiction.blogspot.com
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 06, 2008, 10:31:04 AM
You mean the real Mary Boleyn was bitter and nasty while Anne was sweet and innocent ?  :o No...According to the research, Mary was the one geared on love. It was true that after she left court, she never looked back and had a good marriage with Strafford. Her letter pleading for help proved that "she would beg bread with her beloved than to do otherwise". I also belived her to be the least power hungry (in which Anne was) in her family.  ;) Anne Boleyn was a power hungry woman, devoid of marriage with Percy, she went for Queenship. Her treatment of Catherine of Aragon and her daughter spoke volumes about her character. She stormed and screamed and gave Henry VIII no peace before and during her marriage. That was the reason why Jane Seymour was so attractive to the king.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: FaithWhiteRose on July 06, 2008, 04:26:47 PM
I personally thought that Natalie Portman was fabulous as Anne Boleyn. Anne WAS power-hungry and the such, but I agree, she would never have done adultery or incest. But you must remember that this was based on Philippa Gregory's book, and by the looks of it, Ms. Gregory seems to really hate Anne.
And I wouldn't say that Mary was completely innocent, but in personality and character she was. I doubt she really fell in love with the king, though.
I loved the ending. It was powerful and bittersweet. The little girl for Elizabeth was so cute! :)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 06, 2008, 08:02:07 PM
Indeed. Anne was power hungry and greedy...yet she was just trying to get her fair share. I like the fact that before shewas executed, Anne send a messager to address Princess Mary asking her for her forgiveness (she did). Had she been allowed to marry Percy, she might be quite happy. Mary was used by her family, but at the end she struck out on her own. That part was historically true. Her granddaughter Lettice, countress of Leister and great granddaughter Lady Penelope Rich both had turbulent lives... ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 08, 2008, 02:16:14 PM
I finally saw the BBC version of The Other Boleyn Girl. I noticed that they eliminated a lot of the nonsense from Gregory's book, but kept the more reasonable ones - good move! The only exception to that was that they kept the incest, but I thought they handled it ok.

In any case, this film can be taken a lot more seriously than the Hollywood version. I liked the format of the characters talking to the camera. The actresses who played the sisters both did a great job. I didn't like the actor who played Henry VIII though, complete miscasting there (of course still not as bad as Jonathan Rhys Myers in THE TUDORS  ;))...  On the whole, I liked this version a lot more.

P.S. I also noticed that they changed Mary from being the youngest sister to being the oldest sister, and Anne was the youngest... I wonder why.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: jehan on July 09, 2008, 09:22:34 PM


P.S. I also noticed that they changed Mary from being the youngest sister to being the oldest sister, and Anne was the youngest... I wonder why.

Perhaps to keep it more historically accurate?  Most historians believe Mary to have been the elder sister.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 11, 2008, 01:38:49 PM
Yes...That made sence. The elder before the younger...Mary was also married first.  :)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 11, 2008, 03:10:36 PM


P.S. I also noticed that they changed Mary from being the youngest sister to being the oldest sister, and Anne was the youngest... I wonder why.

Perhaps to keep it more historically accurate?  Most historians believe Mary to have been the elder sister.

Yes, but what about the  incest, they obviously didn't care about that being historically accurate...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: FaithWhiteRose on July 11, 2008, 08:18:04 PM
Of course they didn't. It is historical fiction, after all.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 12, 2008, 12:07:59 PM
Of course they didn't. It is historical fiction, after all.

Right. So that's my point, why change what the book says and make Mary the older sibling if historical accuracy is not really an issue?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 22, 2008, 08:42:59 PM
But Mary was the elder sister... ???
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: mcdnab on July 23, 2008, 06:24:07 AM
As Eric said Mary was the eldest sister.  The standard most commonly accepted dates of birth are Mary C1499 Anne C1501 and George C1504 - some historians (particularly Retha Warnicke- whose book is very interesting if anyone fancies a read) have argued for a 1507 birth date for Anne however most now accept that Mary was the eldest surviving child.   
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 23, 2008, 09:48:44 AM
Which would make sense since she was the first to marry...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 23, 2008, 01:26:25 PM
Yes, I know that most historians agree that Mary was the elder sister. But that wasn't my point. My point was that this movie was based on Phillippa Gregory's novel, where Mary was the younger sister. I was wondering why they changed that in the movie (in other words, made it different from the book). There didn't seem to be any need for it, and if they were worried about historical accuracy, they wouldn't have made a film based on Ms Gregory's book in the first place. So why bother changing the chronology of the sisters from what it was in the book? That was my question.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 23, 2008, 10:50:32 PM
Well...both changed a bit from the book really. The BBC one was faithful to the book on the incest, while the film implied they didn't do it.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 24, 2008, 08:04:43 AM
Yes, that's what I said too. Which is why I am wondering why they would change Mary from a younger sister to the older (from the way it was in the book to which they seemed to try to remain faithful). But it's not really that important.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 25, 2008, 10:06:25 AM
I think both versions pick and choose from the book. Also from the DVD extras Philippa herself sounded okay on the changes. Since George was gay it would be hard for him to bed any women, least of all his sister. Although it would not be out of charecter for the desperate Anne to ask...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 25, 2008, 10:10:27 AM
...Philippa herself sounded okay on the changes...

Well, I sure hope so, after she completely butchered history in her book! Why would she care if changes were made...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 25, 2008, 10:15:25 AM
I quite like the idea of history through the eyes of the unknown (Mary Boleyn). That was the most interesting of her books...the others are not as intriging. I think people want to know more about Mary Boleyn and thus create an interest for others to find out more... :D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 25, 2008, 10:28:17 AM
I quite like the idea of history through the eyes of the unknown (Mary Boleyn).

Yes, it's not a bad idea, if you keep to historical facts... Ms Gregory tends to be - how shall I put it -  a bit fanciful  ;). But she is allowed I guess since she is writing "fiction" first, "historical" only secondary. I will be worried when she starts publishing non-fiction though!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 26, 2008, 01:05:11 PM
Yes...although the more unknown the character, the more creative the author can be with the story. It is only recently discovered that Mary was the elder sister and both Carey children are now believed to be Henry VIII's bastards. And also of the two, Catherine Carey was the elder sibling instead of her brother. That would make her half sister and full cousin to Elizabeth I. Also that would make the execution of Lettice Dudley's son, a necessity since he does have Royal blood through his grandmother...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 26, 2008, 01:51:06 PM
Yes...although the more unknown the character, the more creative the author can be with the story. It is only recently discovered that Mary was the elder sister and both Carey children are now believed to be Henry VIII's bastards.

I don't think that either is known for sure. Some historians think it may be so, while others are not sure. As far as I know, most historians agree that Mary's children's were not fathered by Henry. But obviously there is no way to know one way or another.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 26, 2008, 02:12:00 PM
Except with DNA of course...Do read the new book on Lady Penelope Rich (Lettice Knolly's daughter and thus Mary Boleyn's granddaughter). It has solid proof that Catherine Carey was the elder of the two children (based on written records). The date matched the time frame on the affair which supposed to have taken place between Mary and Henry. So I think the case for Catherine Carey being the natural daughter of Henry VIII was a strong one. Do read that book and look at the evidence before you judge, it may open up new possibilities.  ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 26, 2008, 02:15:11 PM
I would like tol! What is the title of the book?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 26, 2008, 02:18:55 PM
Why Lady Penelope Rich...It was published in Britian, but I have seen copies of the book available in Border bookshop in Boston, NYC and Miami (also available was the Ella book by Warrick). I am sure you will enjoy reading it. It even have a portrait of Lady Catherine Carey being pregnant... ;D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 26, 2008, 02:51:20 PM
Why Lady Penelope Rich...


The title is "Lady Penelope Rich"?  I just looked on Amazon and I don't see this exact title... Do you by any chance have the ISBN? Thanks.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 26, 2008, 03:24:48 PM
Sorry...The Title should be "The Lady Penelope: The Lost Tale Of Love & Politics In The Court Of Elizabeth I"  By Sally Varlow.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Helen_Azar on July 26, 2008, 03:33:03 PM
Thanks!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 27, 2008, 11:41:24 AM
You are welcome...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: mcdnab on July 28, 2008, 10:47:12 AM
Reference this comment -

"And also of the two, Catherine Carey was the elder sibling instead of her brother. That would make her half sister and full cousin to Elizabeth I. Also that would make the execution of Lettice Dudley's son, a necessity since he does have Royal blood through his grandmother..."

The Earl of Essex's illegitimate royal blood (if Catherine was Henry VIII's daughter) would be largely irevelant seeing as he had numerous legitimate Royal Line of descent which would have been far more of a problem.

Here's his main ones from Edward III - though he has many more descents from Edward I.

Edward III - Edmund Duke of York - Richard of Conisburgh, 3rd Earl of Cambridge - Isabel Plantagenet Countess of Essex - William Bourchier Viscount Bourchier - Cecily Bourchier - Walter Devereux 1st Viscount Hereford - Sir Richard Devereux - Walter 1st Earl of Essex - Robert 2nd Earl of Essex.

Edward III - Thomas of Woodstock Duke of Gloucester - Anne of Gloucester -(by her first marriage) Humphrey Stafford 1st Duke of Buckingham - Henry Stafford 2nd Duke of Buckingham - Anne Stafford - Dorothy Hastings - Walter 1st Earl of Essex - Robert 2nd Earl of Essex

Edward III - Thomas of Woodstock Duke of Gloucester - Anne of Gloucester - (by her second marriage) Henry Bourchier Earl of Essex - William Bourchier Viscount Bourchier - Cecily Bourchier - Walter Devereux 1st Viscount Hereford - Sir Richard Devereux - Walter 1st Earl of Essex - Robert 2nd Earl of Essex.

Edward III - Lionel Duke of Clarence - Phillippa Mortimer Countess of Ulster - Roger Mortimer 4th Earl of March - Anne Mortimer -  Isabel Plantagenet Countess of Essex - William Bourchier Viscount Bourchier - Cecily Bourchier - Walter Devereux 1st Viscount Hereford - Sir Richard Devereux - Walter 1st Earl of Essex - Robert 2nd Earl of Essex.

Edward III - John of Gaunt Duke of Lancaster - Joan Beaufort - Anne Neville - Henry Stafford 2nd Duke of Buckingham - Anne Stafford - Dorothy Hastings - Walter 1st Earl of Essex - Robert 2nd Earl of Essex.

sorry bit off topic


Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 28, 2008, 09:55:27 PM
Yes...you point it out that Robert did have royal blood from his father as well as his mother. So his taking of the throne (like Manmouth (also a bastard claim) crediable...The book was fasinating on these claims. I recommend it.  ;)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: mcdnab on July 29, 2008, 06:50:00 AM
Its an interesting point reference his claims through both his parents - he is fairly low down though as most of the aristocracy had similar Plantagenet claims (in fact you'd be hard pressed to find many of Elizabeth's courtiers who didn't) but added to his religion, his relationship with Elizabeth, and his undoubted public popularity ahead of his rebellion it was a fairly heady mix!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on July 29, 2008, 11:04:41 AM
A dubious claim can succeed by an army. One only has to look at Henry VII to see how shaky his claim (only his mother Margaret Beaufort had any royal blood and through the bastard line) was to the throne. His son Henry VIII butched anyone who had a better claim than him to the throne. Robert was planning an uprising that would displace Elisabeth and a swift marriage to Arbella Stuart would make him King...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Silja on November 16, 2008, 10:05:55 AM

I still would like to see the BBC version,

I've now reluctantly watched the BBC version - as it's on the Six Wives DVD :). Not as sexually charged as the movie, but naturally the same outrageous story. The movie was more entertaining though. What a waste of money.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 17, 2008, 10:48:03 AM
Nicer sets and clothes I guess !  :D
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 17, 2008, 11:49:53 AM
Well for me the best movies about Henry and his six wifes are:
"Henry VIII"
"The Tudors"  the costumes are great and the actiors.... I don't like the Other Boleyn Girl because everything there is happening so fast... almost couldn't understand everything... if i didn't read about what is happening and i can't find no where in the history that she wanted to sleep with her brother and get a child.....  And one last thing for me it's dramatized in the end and in that how Natalie Portman played the rape scene.....

IrinaAlexandrovna
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 17, 2008, 12:16:21 PM
I agree...Mary Boleyn's husband's death and birth of her daughter was cut out. A mini-serieswould have been better than a movie.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Adagietto on November 24, 2008, 12:52:46 PM
I've just been watching the film of the Other Boleyn Girl, and found it to be quite enjoyable hokum, the kind of thing one will forget after a day or two. If someone is going to go the trouble of writing a historical novel or indeed making a film, I cannot for the life of me see why they cannot take the trouble to make it historically plausible. Sheer laziness, I suppose; why worry about the complexities and half-shades of history if one force eveything into a simple and almost mechanical romantic plot?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 24, 2008, 02:07:51 PM
Well yes i agree here...
Natalie Portman is sweet girl but i don't like her in The Other Boleyn Girl... And Anne Boleyn didn't cry at the end... And the executioner didn't cut her head like that... He said "Boy fetch my sword" and she looked to see the boy and then he take out the fetch and cut her head... All that and the whole life of Anne Boleyn is showed in the SHOWTIME Production "The Tudors" ... that movie "The Other Boleyn Girl" are nonsenses...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 24, 2008, 02:34:29 PM
Well...Anne Boylen (the real one) did felt remorse at her treatment of Princess Mary and Queen Catherine. Before her death she asked someone to go and beg the Princess to forgive her treatment of her and her mother. Accordingly, Princess Mary forgave her and send word to the ex-queen. That story was not done in either versions...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 24, 2008, 10:30:04 PM
Yes i forgot to write this... But you are right... i don't remember her daughter Elisabeth.. only at the end.... she wasn't a baby when her mother die.... because i remember in Henry VIII that she gave her one little cross and kiss her for Goodbye.... i can't see those things in that movie.....
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 25, 2008, 09:42:10 AM
Indeed...Both versions wanted to show Anne as a bitch and Mary as a spoilt brat. The truth was actually much more appealing. That would go to explain why Mary Tudor was kind to little Elizabeth in her later years. In a sense they were both orphans and the villian was their father, Henry VIII. The pleading scene was in "The Tudors", when Anne begged for a second chance with Elizabeth in the garden.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 25, 2008, 11:24:40 AM
Indeed.... I remember in The Tudors that scene with Anne and Elizabeth but can you explain me what Henry mean with "You were not virgin when you marry me ... you are not what you see? " I think she was... but he slept with her before the weding...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 25, 2008, 03:53:25 PM
She had bedded Henry Percy before so she wasn't really a virgin.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 26, 2008, 05:43:26 AM
Ahaaa i remember in Henry VIII but in The Tudors they are not saying this... i mean you have to know it from the history.... Well it wasn't fair saying this to her... Because first she doesn't wanted to marry Henry.....
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 26, 2008, 08:11:58 AM
Which Henry ? Henry VIII or Henry Percy ? Anne was keen to marry Percy and she might have crossed the line with him. There were also indications that she was far from chaste during her time in Francis I 's court...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 26, 2008, 08:39:04 AM
I mean the movie Henry VIII but you are right... i think something more happened in the french court.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: mcdnab on November 26, 2008, 09:11:24 AM

Actually most of Anne's biographies are consistent in the view that she was almost certainly not promiscuous.
Anne was from a relatively young age, unlike her sister, under the control and patronage of women widely regarded for their piety -  Archduchess Margaret of Austria and Queen Claude of France both of whom imposed strict standards on their households. In Claude's case few flouted her moral code despite her husband's reputation. The fact that Anne was regarded well by both Margaret, Claude and Claude's younger sister Renee would suggest that her reputation wasn't an unchaste one. Incidentally Francis I's personal reputation and that of his licentious court increased following the death of Claude of France in 1524 and his second marriage in 1530.  There is also very little evidence that Mary was as unchaste as is often suggested in fiction.
Wether or not Anne gave herself to Percy or not is again highly debateable and impossible to judge - personaly I doubt it.
Let's be honest that history is often unkind to women - Anne was undoubtedly intelligent and her influence on the development of the English reformation is a key chapter in European history. Attacking a woman's morality has always been an easy way to cast doubts on her actions and on the role she played - because of her position as a key figure in the reformation she and her morality was a useful and easy target for Catholic writers keen to attack her daughter, Elizabeth I. They were aided in that by the circumstances and allegations that surrounded her trial and execution.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 26, 2008, 09:33:19 AM
Well...history (remember his story !) recorded that Anne was very keen to marry Henry Percy (it was a genuine love affair between them), but was ripped apart by Cardinal Worlsey. It justified her later revenge on the old and hapless man. The possibility that she would give herself to the one she loved cannot be discounted.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 26, 2008, 09:35:18 AM

Actually most of Anne's biographies are consistent in the view that she was almost certainly not promiscuous.
Anne was from a relatively young age, unlike her sister, under the control and patronage of women widely regarded for their piety -  Archduchess Margaret of Austria and Queen Claude of France both of whom imposed strict standards on their households. In Claude's case few flouted her moral code despite her husband's reputation. The fact that Anne was regarded well by both Margaret, Claude and Claude's younger sister Renee would suggest that her reputation wasn't an unchaste one. Incidentally Francis I's personal reputation and that of his licentious court increased following the death of Claude of France in 1524 and his second marriage in 1530.  There is also very little evidence that Mary was as unchaste as is often suggested in fiction.
Wether or not Anne gave herself to Percy or not is again highly debateable and impossible to judge - personaly I doubt it.
Let's be honest that history is often unkind to women - Anne was undoubtedly intelligent and her influence on the development of the English reformation is a key chapter in European history. Attacking a woman's morality has always been an easy way to cast doubts on her actions and on the role she played - because of her position as a key figure in the reformation she and her morality was a useful and easy target for Catholic writers keen to attack her daughter, Elizabeth I. They were aided in that by the circumstances and allegations that surrounded her trial and execution.



Thank you for that interesting Biography of Anne B .... I'm sure the new fans of her would appraise it .... Well there is alot of true in that opinion of your side ... I have read somewhere something like that
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 27, 2008, 09:10:13 AM
Yet she was a determined and bossy woman and can get on other's nerves that too was the truth.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 27, 2008, 10:08:18 AM
But i have one question do you think that Anne at the end was a bad persone.... because in the Tudors at the end Anne plays the bad one and Jane the angel....
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 27, 2008, 10:25:50 AM
That would depend on what level you stand on being "bad". I think Anne was an ambitious young lady, who loved position but would have been happy marrying Henry Percy, Duke of Norththumberland. However Henry's lust for her and her family pushed her into the lime light. In persuit of that ambition she became a mean spirited person. However she begging forgiveness from Princess Mary Tudor suggested that she had a heart too. Jane is another kind of lady, she was bascially a kind person (her inclusion of Mary & Elizabeth into her court bascially provide her no benefits), but she too was a pawn in her family's culculation.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 27, 2008, 11:52:37 AM
I can't find much about Jane Seymour... i know few things but i think i know Anne better....
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on November 27, 2008, 01:00:57 PM
Hi Irina try this for Jane Seymour;
http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=6741.0 (http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=6741.0)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 27, 2008, 02:02:30 PM
That great ! A thread to Jane Seymour (not the actress !). I do think not too much has been done on her since she died young. Also not much of her on letters etc. People only read what they interpret...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on November 27, 2008, 03:08:55 PM
....and there is always David Starkey......:-)
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 28, 2008, 06:00:36 AM
Hi Irina try this for Jane Seymour;
http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=6741.0 (http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=6741.0)


Thank you Kimberly... For me Jane was very pretty too....Henry got good choise for women....
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 28, 2008, 08:41:28 AM
Well...Maybe not Catherine Howard. He thought she pure, but actually she was quite "experienced"...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 28, 2008, 08:55:51 AM
Hahah i understand what you mean :D .... But What about Anne of Claves?
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 28, 2008, 09:00:20 AM
I think they had a culture shock. Anne was too German in looks and language for Henry. However she improved after awhile and did her duties perfectly as "King's sister". She would have made a good queen...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 28, 2008, 09:23:02 AM
If her head wasn't cut...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 28, 2008, 02:30:48 PM
I don't think Anne would have her head cut off, especially since she was a foreign duchess. Killing her is not good for business.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Vecchiolarry on November 28, 2008, 03:21:31 PM
Hi,

I have always thought Anne of Cleves was the most fortunate of Henry's wives.
She came out of the marriage with a large pension & property and was received at Court and was friendly with Henry, Edward, Mary and Elizabeth.
And, she lived longer than any of the 6.

Not bad for a poor, homely German duchess.....

Larry
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on November 28, 2008, 03:38:06 PM
And a lot of us old timers round these parts think that Jane Seymour was a snake !!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 29, 2008, 03:13:17 AM
I don't think Anne would have her head cut off, especially since she was a foreign duchess. Killing her is not good for business.
]

Anne died at Hever Castle on 16 July 1557, a year before Mary herself died. According to her wishes, she was buried in what is described as a "somewhat hard to find tomb in Westminster Abbey".Yes i agree her head wasn't cut ... Kathryn Howard's head fall...
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 29, 2008, 03:16:07 AM
And a lot of us old timers round these parts think that Jane Seymour was a snake !!

Amm for me Jane wasn't a snake... she was independent woman at first and then in my opinion when she married Henry she become more.... thoughtful
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Kimberly on November 29, 2008, 08:54:58 AM
Umm... "independent woman" ....in Tudor times and unwed.....don't think so!
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 29, 2008, 09:37:15 AM
Umm... "independent woman" ....in Tudor times and unwed.....don't think so!


Well every woman is independent until she got married...even in Tudor times... just my opinion... :/
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 30, 2008, 02:23:14 PM
I think Jane was a sweet woman with a brain.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on November 30, 2008, 02:47:41 PM
Aww 100 times i agree Eric ... =]
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on November 30, 2008, 03:26:37 PM
Thanks. I think both Jane and Catherine Parr had much tact that they know how to display to please Henry VIII.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on December 03, 2008, 03:42:17 AM
Mmm yes here i agree...But some people think that Anne and Henry had more "passion"
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on December 03, 2008, 08:59:51 AM
Yes...Deadly !
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on December 03, 2008, 09:11:37 AM
Agree... because for example H&J ... there passion was diffrent from that of A&H
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: imperial angel on December 03, 2008, 12:29:48 PM
Umm... "independent woman" ....in Tudor times and unwed.....don't think so!


Well every woman is independent until she got married...even in Tudor times... just my opinion... :/

I think they had degrees of independence depending on personality. I think Anne Boleyn could be said to be more independent before marriage than Jane Seymour who wasn't a snake at all. I think she was shrewder than she is often given credit for, but she wasn't another Anne Boleyn in disguise. So many think Jane just appeared meek and mild, and was a snake underneath. I doubt it.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: imperial angel on December 03, 2008, 12:40:40 PM
But i have one question do you think that Anne at the end was a bad persone.... because in the Tudors at the end Anne plays the bad one and Jane the angel....

No, she wasn't bad person- just controversial. She was an outspoken and bold woman for her day, but not primiscous, I don't think even at the French court. I doubt she went all the way with Percy. I would think there might be some evidence if she had, since Katherine Howard was unchaste before her marriage as well as after, and later people were only too willing to tell about Katherine Howard and her love affairs. Of course Katharine Howard's indiscretions took place in England where it might be easier to find witnesses, whereas some of Anne's unchaste behaviour is said to have taken place in France- less witnesses perhaps who would later say anything about it,  if they were French etc, why would they mention it, and it may not have seemed out of place there either. Henry had to resort to trumped up charges and rumors with regards to her morality to put Anne to death. If there had been an actual witness or a account that could be verified of Anne acting unchaste even before her marriage, you'd think someone would have come forward at that point. But there wasn't evidence with regards to Anne like all the detail about Katharine Howard's love affairs or historical accounts we have of the reputation of Mary Boleyn at the French court where she was known for her love affairs etc, no evidence Anne might have been like them, just rumors, speculation, and such.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on December 03, 2008, 03:30:26 PM
I think Anne went all the way with Henry Percy. And why not ? She was in love and hoping to get married. Percy's wife did want a divorce due to a pre-contact with Anne. The interesting thing was that Henry Percy himself was a judge at Anne's trial that condemn her to death. If Anne Bolelyn had been unchaste, he would be the most liklely one to know it since he was a prime suspect to her behavior before Anne's marriage to Henry VIII. As for the French years, Anne may or may not have erred. I do not think King Francis would parade Anne's prospective lovers for Henry's benefit. In fact King Francis was apalled at Henry'VIII's deterination to kill Anne. He would have tried to safe her than to provide emunition for Anne's destruction. So no information would have come from the French court anyway.
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Royal Bulgaria on December 03, 2008, 04:29:18 PM
I agree with both of you....
Still my opinion is that Anne B wasn't guilty and she didn't deserve this death... Jane was more acting like angel... A&J are so diffrent... in my opinion
Title: Re: "The Other Boleyn Girl" dramatized?
Post by: Eric_Lowe on December 04, 2008, 08:05:43 AM
I agree...Jane actually had a much sweeter nature.