Messages

1

The Russian Revolution / Re: Question about Archangel Barge (Blown Up loaded with White Russian Soldiers)

« on: February 13, 2018, 02:34:02 PM »

I've been doing some plowing through contemporary British newspapers. General Miller left Archangel in February 1920. That means that this barge massacre must have happened around then. So far, I can't find any other reference to it than the English Wikipedia article and the quote from Alexei Scherbatov's book. If anyone comes up with any other info on this, I'd appreciate it. Thanks!

2

The Russian Revolution / Re: Question about Archangel Barge (Blown Up loaded with White Russian Soldiers)

« on: February 06, 2018, 06:09:17 PM »

Judging from his Russian Wikipedia article, which can be translated with Google Translate, he wasn't recently released from a mad house, but rather a longterm and dedicated revolutionary and Chekist, who in March 1920 "was appointed a member of a special government commission to investigate the atrocities of the interventionists and Whiteguards in the North. Arriving on the Solovetsky Islands, Kedrov liquidated the Solovetsky Monastery, exiling its leadership." Whether this massacre was part of that liquidation or not I have no idea.

See https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D0%B5%D0%B4%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2,_%D0%9C%D0%B8%D1%85%D0%B0%D0%B8%D0%BB_%D0%A1%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%B5%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87
The English version mentions his cruelty and the barge incident.

Thanks for the links to the Wikipedia pages. I see it is mentioned on the English version. Anyone have any idea when in 1920 that event would have happened? Any help on that would be great.

3

The Russian Revolution / Question about Archangel Barge (Blown Up loaded with White Russian Soldiers)

« on: February 06, 2018, 10:01:39 AM »

Hi! I'm studying some various family notes, but this is something that I can't quite make out and hope that someone knows about this event. I'd like to learn about this event, if possible.

All I know is that it happened in 1920. There were White Russian forces at Archangel, fighting with the British forces fighting in North Russia with General Miller. In 1920, the British forces betrayed the White Russians and pulled out, taking the reserves and all protection to the small amount of White Russians. A mentally-ill Bolshevik commander, Mikhail Tsiderbaum-Kedrov (only recently released from a mad house) ordered several hundred young officers and cadets of the remaining young White Russian officers to be put on a barge in the White Sea. The barge was then blown up. All the young men died.

This is a bit about this story as quoted from Alexei Scherbatov's book:
Бориса в 1918 году
пригласили в качестве переводчика для
работы с англичанами в Северную
армию генерала Миллера. Английская
интервенция в районе Архангельска
закончилась еще до разгрома этой
армии красными. Англичане, мало
заинтересованные в помощи России,
фактически предали белых соратников:
бежали в 1920 году, успев вывезти
огромные запасы леса. Борис остался с
сослуживцами и попал в число нескольких сот молодых офицеров и юнкеров,
которых чекист Михаил Цидербаум-Кедров, психически больной человек, недавно выпущенный из сумасшедшего дома, распорядился посадить на баржу
и взорвал ее в Белом море. Все, конечно, погибли.


Can anyone help me fill out this story, verify names, etc.?
Thank you so much!
Sarah

4

Russian Noble Families / Nurses, Nursemaids, Servants to Imperial Family c. 1890s??

« on: October 22, 2017, 05:28:46 PM »

Hi! I'm hoping that some of you who have studied so much about the Imperial Family and their home life may be able to help with this or point me in a good direction.

I've got a friend whose relative was Emma Pugh (later Emma Bates, after her marriage). Emma was a young nursemaid to grandchildren of General Sergei and Eleanor Plaoutine / Plautin. From her remaining photos/papers, it appears that she cared for the children of Sergei and Vera Denissieff / Denisiev. She must have gone over to Russia around the 1890s, though the exact time is unknown. She returned to England for a couple years, married and had a daughter of her own. She was then called back in the early years of the 20th century (about 1904, I think) to help with the youngest of the Denissieff children.

One of Emma's nieces wrote that Emma's best friend worked for the Imperial Family and that the two were able to attend shows in the Imperial Box. Emma did save a picture of the Tsar and Tsarina with some of their young children.

Has anyone ever run across the name of Emma Pugh (Bates), or have any suggestions as to possibilities for the identity of her friend who worked for the Imperial Family?

Thanks very much!
Sarah

5

Russian Noble Families / Re: Colonel Bernard Ernest Jule de Koetteritz (Russian Imperial Guard)

« on: September 27, 2017, 11:08:56 AM »

Hi, again!
Sorry to be so late in replying, but I changed computers and then could not find this post again until just now. (For some reason, no notification came in, either.)

Here is the whole page, which is supposedly some German Lutheran records. Click the link to see the whole page. The Koetteritz entry is the last one at the bottom (and if you click on the image it will blow up very large).
http://www.sarahbethonline.com/photos/forumpics/Otto%20von%20Koetteritz%20Marriage.jpg

Thanks, too for the photo of Valerian Koetteritz. That's great!

Regards,
Sarah

6

Books about the Romanovs and Imperial Russia / Re: Anyone know if this book is available in English, please?

« on: September 27, 2017, 10:39:51 AM »

Thanks. I was afraid of that.
By any chance, does anyone on this forum have the book in Russian? Apparently, there is at least one picture of Boris Sergeyevich Stcherbatov (1897-1920) in there, and I would sure appreciate a scan of that. Also, if anyone could have a look and see if there is a mention of that Boris, I'd be so appreciative.

It is sad that there is so little available in English. I am working to put the story of Sergey and Elizaveta Stcherbatov and their children online in English.
Thank you!
Sarah

7

Books about the Romanovs and Imperial Russia / Anyone know if this book is available in English, please?

« on: September 26, 2017, 05:07:27 PM »

Hi! I am trying to do family research on the family of Prince Sergei Borisovich Stcherbatov and Elizaveta Plautin, particularly their son, Boris Sergeyevich Stcherbatov (1897-1920).

I live in the USA and don't speak Russian (though I'm pretty good at using online translators, now!). I came across a PDF which quotes the book shown at this site:
http://ru-history.livejournal.com/255147.html

This was a cousin of Boris, and he mentions him. I'm wondering if anyone knows whether this book is available in English?

Thanks!
Sarah

8

Russian Noble Families / Re: Help, please, with Russian Article about Mikhail N. Plautin

« on: August 21, 2017, 11:56:59 AM »

Thank you SO much! Great help, and I was even able to contact the author and discuss this. I really appreciate it.

Regards,
Sarah

9

Russian Noble Families / Help, please, with Russian Article about Mikhail N. Plautin

« on: August 19, 2017, 06:42:17 PM »

Hi! I live in the USA and am really working on putting together the family history of the Plaoutine/Plautin family (being relatives of Gen. Sergei Nikolayevich Plautin and Eleanor Pringle). I just found out that an article was published last year about their grandson, Mikhail Nikolayevich Plautin. It was published in a Russian magazine, and I'm really hoping that someone may be able to help me obtain a copy of the article . . . photos of it, anything. I do know someone who speaks Russian, so I can even get it translated.
All of the info about the article is shown as Source #3 to this webpage:
http://tsarselo.ru/yenciklopedija-carskogo-sela/istorija-carskogo-sela-v-licah/plautiny.html#.WZjLVj596Uk

That translates in Google to: Shergalin E.E. In memory of Mikhail Nikolayevich Plautin (1895-1920) - a collector of bird eggs. Russian ornithological journal. 2016. Volume 25. Express release № 1267

Any help would be so much appreciated. Thanks!
Sarah

10

Russian Noble Families / Re: Colonel Bernard Ernest Jule de Koetteritz (Russian Imperial Guard)

« on: March 16, 2017, 09:29:49 AM »

Here is a marriage record for Otto and Clara. I'm hoping that someone may be able to translate this, as it may offer some more clues.



To see the image at full size, you can use this link:
http://www.sarahbethonline.com/photos/forumpics/ottodekoetteritz.jpg

Thanks for any help!

There's no mention of a Clara in this clip?

From what I think I can read (do you have the pic in higher resolution, or the original url?) it's about Otto Adolph von Koetteritz, lieutenant of the Royal (Prussian?) army in the artillery guards, son of (Jonas??) Ernst Julius von Koetteritz, Chief lieutenant in the Imperial Russian Army, and Juliane Eleonore Montflarin.
Age 35 years and 1 month

Just saw this particular reply, so I'm sorry to be late in answering it. Here is a link that should show the clip larger:
http://www.sarahbethonline.com/photos/forumpics/ottodekoetteritz.jpg

My father works with someone from Western Germany, and she and her mother say that this piece was written in the Eastern parts and seems to have some Polish characters in it.

I've also found an entry for my Bernard de Koetteritz in the England Probate Calendars. It does give the name of his heir as "Valerian Ketteritz", a nephew in Russia. Maybe this is a clue? So far, I can't turn up anything on Valerian, but here's the probate listing:

Ketteritz, Bernard Julievitch
Personal Estate 461 pounds 18 shillings 5d.
20 May. Administration of the Personal Estate of Bernard Julievitch Ketteritz late of Florence in Italy a retired Colonel from the Russian Army a Widower who died 26 April 1888 at Florence was granted at the Principal Registery under the usual Limitations to James Curtis Leman of 51 Lincoln's-Inn-Fields in the County of Middlesex Solicitor the lawful Attorney of Valerian Ketteritz the Nephew and one of the Next of Kin now residing in Russia.

Thanks so much to everyone for their help!

11

Russian Noble Families / Re: Colonel Bernard Ernest Jule de Koetteritz (Russian Imperial Guard)

« on: March 16, 2017, 09:20:31 AM »

Another possibility for the upper badge: Regimental badge of 13th Life-Grenadier Erivan regiment.

Thanks a lot! That's something to go on. This gent is just so elusive . . . but I can't help wanting to find out more about him.

12

Russian Noble Families / Re: Colonel Bernard Ernest Jule de Koetteritz (Russian Imperial Guard)

« on: March 10, 2017, 06:29:34 AM »

I don't know if this will help you or not but I found the following with different birth date AND listing a death date... 

Кёттериц / Koetteritz, фон Бернард Юльевич, 9.2.1806 – 26.4.1888
Kёtterits / Koetteritz, Bernard von Yul'evich, 1806/02/09 - 1888/04/26

Source:  http://www.v-ivanov.it/files/4/4_arhivRusIt8.pdf

Thanks very much for this! That's a great help. Can you tell me why he is listed in this document? It seems to have a lot of people in the list with him.

Thanks!
Sarah

Sarah, It is a list of people (and their grave site registrations) buried at the Cimitero degli Allori, Cimitero Evangelico degli Allori  (English: The Evangelical Cemetery of Laurels), which is located in Florence, Italy.  The small cemetery was opened on 26 February 1860 when the non-Catholic communities of Florence could no longer bury their dead in the English Cemetery in Piazzale Donatello.   As he and his wife lived in Florence, it would make sense that he is buried there.  Hope that helps!  Kind regards, JGP

Thanks a lot! That is a great help. From his middle name being listed as "Julevich" (multiple spellings appearing on that, of course), I would guess his father must have been Jule. This is all getting me closer.

I have a photo of him, and he is wearing a couple medals (though he is not in a uniform). Does anyone recognize any of these?


It's been suggested to me that they may be French or Belgian, though one gentleman suggests that it could be the Order of St. Anne.

Thanks!
Sarah

13

Russian Noble Families / Re: Colonel Bernard Ernest Jule de Koetteritz (Russian Imperial Guard)

« on: March 08, 2017, 06:31:01 AM »

I don't know if this will help you or not but I found the following with different birth date AND listing a death date... 

Кёттериц / Koetteritz, фон Бернард Юльевич, 9.2.1806 – 26.4.1888
Kёtterits / Koetteritz, Bernard von Yul'evich, 1806/02/09 - 1888/04/26

Source:  http://www.v-ivanov.it/files/4/4_arhivRusIt8.pdf

Kind regards, JGP

Thanks very much for this! That's a great help. Can you tell me why he is listed in this document? It seems to have a lot of people in the list with him.

Thanks!
Sarah

14

Russian Noble Families / Re: Colonel Bernard Ernest Jule de Koetteritz (Russian Imperial Guard)

« on: March 07, 2017, 09:56:11 AM »

Hello, again! I'm working on this some more and trying to sort out this family in hopes of discovering more about Bernard de Koetteritz.

I think it's still promising for the birth record above, because it seems like there might be a little confusion between the children of General Bernard von Koetteritz and Juliane Eleonore Montferrin. They had another son, Otto Adolph Von Koettertiz. He married Clara Vogel in 1835, and I think that he will have married Emily Dorothea Hoepner as a second wife later.

Here is a marriage record for Otto and Clara. I'm hoping that someone may be able to translate this, as it may offer some more clues.



To see the image at full size, you can use this link:
http://www.sarahbethonline.com/photos/forumpics/ottodekoetteritz.jpg

Thanks for any help!

15

Research Russian Roots / Re: Help Translating a Russian School Report

« on: May 06, 2016, 03:28:14 PM »

You are welcome. It was a fun search. I hope you find out more, including how and where the elusive L. N. Zhuk  died.

Do you know if the Ukrainian National Army would have drafted men in 1917? I'm wondering if this document was necessary to the Army (things like this were necessary to enter the British and Indian Armies). I don't know whether Anton was drafted or enlisted.

This I know nothing about. Except that in some circumstances a high school diploma like the one you have posted was necessary for going into the army and directly train as a non-commissioned officer. But I'm sure the resident Russian military expert Mike will know much more!

Thanks a lot! I am going to keep working on this, and I'll be sure to post any updates that I find along the way.