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Messages - Bach

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The Final Chapter / Re: Would ANY country have offered sanctuary?
« on: January 10, 2007, 07:19:00 AM »
Was the offer from Spain based on familial/blood ties (Ena (b1887) & Alix (b1872) as cousins, albeit not close emotionally due to the age gap,) a simple sense of honor among royals, a characteristic of the King's personality?

Speculation welcome....since none of us have ever met King Alfonso XIII  ;)

For some reason, I am of the opinion that their final residence would have been Switzerland or Denmark.  But, since this is again speculation, they might have ended up on the beaches of some tropical island nation.

The list of countries which would have been willing to host them is, indeed, a short one.

The Final Chapter / Would ANY country have offered sanctuary?
« on: January 08, 2007, 08:42:44 AM »
I have often mused about what country actually would have taken the Imperial Family in?

I have thought that culturally, the Pacific Northwest would have been a good pick, given that there was a large White Russian population.  However, as part of Canada (and therefore the UK,) it could have been tricky.

The US was most likely "out" since Woodrow Wilson was...well....not an ardent supporter of the IF.

France?  Switzerland?  Denmark?

I think any of the German principalities would have been out of the question as well.

Any musings?


Did anyone from the IF attend the funeral?

grandduchessella, I'm always just floored by your collection of photos and postcards of this era and its players.

The Windsors / Re: THE QUEEN - new DIANA film starring Dame Helen Mirren
« on: September 08, 2006, 12:34:24 PM »
If I heard that Helen Mirren were:

1.  Reading the phone book;
2.  Outside on the sidewalk;
3.  In the pouring rain;
4.  In late November or early March;
5.  With a price tag of $1000 USD to attend;

I would go.

So I will be at this motion picture!

TampaBay, like you, I have heard that her half-sister finally had her fill of Maria and ended their relationship.  Since it was the money of Helen Kirby's father, Leonida's first husband Sumner, which supported Maria and her son these many years, it would appear that other arrangements needed to be made for their table, hearth and roof.

As they are both citizens of Spain by virtue of birth, it may be that the Spanish Royal family considers them a special kind of ward of the state, distant relatives of royal blood who should be sheltered.  Did not the Royal Family of GB eventually offer a grace-and favor to one of the GD's later in life?  I'm on vacation and have not access to my books, but I'm certain that was the case.

The Final Chapter / Re: UK Sunday Express 25th June
« on: August 19, 2006, 11:19:58 AM »
(tapping foot impatiently.....)

Wonderful and scary all at once.

Imperial Succession and the Throne / Re: Tsarevna Olga Nikolaevna
« on: August 19, 2006, 11:00:28 AM »
If Nicholas II thought of naming Olga his successor instead of Alexei, why didn't he do it? Alexei's life was always in danger, so what better why to have made sure that the Romanov line was secure than to have someone healthy and strong as his successor?

See, I think this is a terrific question.  Do you suppose that it's because the IF really did believe that Rasputin would keep Alexei alive?

Perdon me for bringing this up, and believe me, it's not scandal-mongering, but has Georgy been linked with any female to date?  He's in his early twenties and surely must have formed some attachments.

There aren't a lot of "eligible" (meaning Orthodox, equal-house, child-bearing age) females about that have enough money to support Georgy in the style that his half-aunt's inheritance has accustomed him to having, and to which his mother's pretensions compel him.

To whom has he been linked?  The only photos I've seen him with women are the typical Euro-trash "all the fun people play together" where he's gyrating away with a cluster of sweaty men and scantily-clad women.  Hope he's not with either of those groups.  But I haven't seen much either way.

So it's a combination of #4 and #5.

*  She doesn't want a private life, she wants recognition of her "claims;" and

*  There is no incentive for the government of Russia to invite her back in that capacity.  She adds nothing to the equation.

Same for her son, I imagine.

The money question is also important, but of course MV does not address her underwriting.

On the citizenship debate earlier:

My father holds dual US and Irish citizenship, which is useful when traveling in the EU.  My mother, who is of Hungarian descent, also holds dual US and Irish citizenship by virtue of being married to my father.  The US government does not recognize the Irish citizenship and my parents pay all taxes to the US.  Ireland allows dual citizenship and does not demand taxes until residency is established.

My great-uncle held US citizenship by birth and when he traveled in Europe for 3 years prior to the outbreak of WWII, he was granted Hungarian citizenship (Austro-Hungarian) after visiting Budapest and applying.  He was not required to renounce his US citizenship.  When he returned to the US in 1939 and enlisted in early 1940 (having seen the situation in Europe and knowing that the US was destined to enter the war,) he was required to renounce his Hungarian citizenship although he had never given up US citizenship.  About 2 months after his death under US arms in 1942, he got a draft notice from Nazi Austria saying that they had rejected his renunciation of citizenship.

Strange citizenship questions indeed, and my uncle was clearly not a Grand Duchess where "extraordinary possibilities" existed.

I think to answer that question, TampaBay, is to examine several questions:

1.  How is she funded, and would she be able to enjoy her lifestyle (without working) equally well there as in Spain?
2.  Is part of her financial funding requisite on her remaining in Spain?  I have heard that the Royal family of Spain contributes to her furbishment and upkeep; perhaps there is the agreement between governments that she can agitate for restoration but cannot return to Russia unless specifically invited.
3.  Who is Putin and would he permit her to return?  She is of no value to him, and he is old-style Soviet, dressed in democratic trappings, after all.
4. What can she possibly offer to the Russian government that would make her attractive to invite back? Her claims are disputed, her imperiousness offensive.  If the Russian government thought she was a horse to be backed, arrangements would have been made to un-invite the other Romanovs to the reburial, and glorify her only.  That didn't happen.
5.  And given the reburial situation, it could be that she just doesn't WANT to go back and lead a private life.  Russia is not her home; Spain is.  It's her terms or no terms, and Russia isn't exactly saying she's all that and a bag of chips.

That would be my line of questioning and reasoning.

When did this forum become a prophecy board for religious zealotry?  I must have missed that memo.

This thread, from its title, is about whether Russia will again become a monarchy.

Speaking as someone who has had extensive dealings with Russia-based financiers, I can say that the Russians I know - not the religious abroad who appear to be as lost in dogma as the late Alix was - the chance of restoration is zero.  The Royal family, if considered at all, are mocked for their pretensions.  It's a source of amusement in many cases.   I'm not saying that their mean-spiritedness is appropriate, but these are those in positions of power.  Highly unlikely that they will cede that power to the tattered and watered down remnants of pretenders.

Facts.  Not fantasies.

Perhaps you should start a new thread that is appropriately titled, something like "Religous Prophecy in Support of Restoration."

It's such a hot topic, it has its own thread in the Forum!

It's complex and passions run high around this issue.

While I would not have chosen the exact language, the tailoring reflects poorly on one who aspires to the position.  Surely Georgiy Mariavitch's (my own personal nomenclature for this individual) financial backers could have sprung for a better cut of suit.

And yes, Lisa, I agree.  As we have seen in several other Royal houses of late, knowing one's lineage seems to not reflect any higher standard of behavior.  I know many fine people of less lofty lineage who behave with more elegance and restraint than Royal behaviour of late.

I have thought of this, and I think it would have been improbable that all of the family would have gotten out.

I think that the Emperor and Empress would have had to remain behind and would have suffered the same fate - death.

England was out of the question, as I believe the US would have been.  The Fall of Eagles throughout Europe would have made any country unstable for heirs to a fallen throne.

I imagined that a remote area of Canada, a farm-style life, would have been best.  I, like Robert Hall, considered the Vancouver area where the Russian emigre community was well-established would be a possibility.  I think of someplace like Brasova, a self-contained estate, perhaps in Saskatchewan, Alberta, or British Columbia.  While they would have still been nominally under the protection and as guests of the British Crown, they would be in a remote-enough area that "out of sight, out of mind" would have quelled the worst of the anti-Russian feeling of the British public.

I can envision Alexi proclaiming himself as Alexander IV, then immediately setting about to provide for the succession not by marrying, which would have been nearly impossible, but for the children of his sisters to inherit the throne in a similar fashion as the Fundamental Laws: first the sons of Olga, then those of Tatiana, then Maria, then Anastasia, provided they made equal marriages.  Then the daughters of Olga, etc.  (This is providing, of course, that all made it out.  I'm of the opinion that only two or three of the Grand Duchesses would have actually made it out.)

We would still have a similarly murky inheritance picture as now: some of those sons and daughters would have married willy-nilly for money or love but not title.  Others might marry into ex-ruling houses but insist that those "count."  One or two would waddle their way to the front of the camera, wear absurd little crowns, and live off relatives.  But at least the immediate opinion about inheritance would be answered to the generation of the grandchildren of the last Tsar.

I hope Maria would have married a soldier and renounced her rights.  She did so want to marry a soldier.

Forum Announcements / Re: eBay Theif - Using us for Profit
« on: August 01, 2006, 10:36:08 AM »
I have several E-Bay ID's - one for selling, one for buying, and one for silly auctions that I run that sell things like a yard full  of Canadian snow in the winter (buyer must pick up.)

I can and will use my silly ID to explore these thieves.

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