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The Hohenzollern / Re: German Royals and Nazism/Royals and the Reich
« on: December 21, 2007, 07:43:35 AM »
Why was Hermine, Kaiser Wilhelm's second wife, so pro-Nazi? And why was she not smart enough to get away from the Russians? After Wilhelm's death and before the end of the war did she live in Potsdam with Cecile? After the war, apparently the Russians treated her rather roughly. Is this correct?

I note that both obituaries referred to him as "Carl Ludwig Habsburg-Lothringen" using no title or eve the "von." Austria is still that strict on such things?

Why is the title "by Rhine?" Is it a historical reference to the fact that Hesse is near the Rhine?

With the Red Army nearing Potsdam in the closing days of World War II, Cecille went to Stuttgart correct? Did she have relatives there with whom she stayed?

Thanks again, Herr Kaiser. Sorry if I wrote confusingly, but the French officer quotation was after WWII, when he was briefly in French custody near the family castle in Hohenzollern. I believe it was from a book "Life of Crown Prince Williiam." I have it someone in storage. (I hate not having all my books nearby!)

I am also just starting to learn about Crown Prince Wilhelm. From what I gather he was rather a dashing figure who enjoyed life and its comforts.

However, the literature I have seen is not sympathetic. It paints him as self-absorbed, cruel in wasting lives during the war, and relatively unconcerned with his family responsibilities during and after WWII. I read a quotation from a French officer after WWII in which the officer basically said "the whole world is suffering, your family is suffering, and all you care about is yourself." Is this accurate? Had he been more realistic could he have taken the throne after the first war?

I am just starting to lean about Princess Cecille. Is it true that she and the Crown Prince drifted apart - not divorcing and not completely cutting off contact, but living apart? Is it true that after the war she embraced the Republic? I know she was very popular and her husband was not necessarily so. Was she very bitter about how her life turned out?

The Hohenzollern / Re: End of the Monarchies
« on: October 18, 2007, 06:38:06 AM »
Let's do both: as part of the formal undoing of the Versailles Treaty, Georg Friedrich could be crowned/installed as German Emperor, Titular King of Prussia, and Marraf of Brandenburg. He's seems like a likable enough monarch!

I would think it appalling that most Germans don't know that there was a revolution in 1918, but then what most Americans apparently don't know about history or even contemporary politics is treasonous!

The Hohenzollern / Re: End of the Monarchies
« on: October 17, 2007, 01:48:24 PM »
Thanks again, HerrKaiser.

So the Wettins paraded through Saxony and people recognized them as the former royal family? Interesting. Any chance that in honor of the 100th anniversary of the November Revolution in a few years we can restore the monarchs? Maybe we could start an internet campaign?

The Hohenzollern / Re: End of the Monarchies
« on: October 12, 2007, 11:40:03 AM »
One thing to keep in mind is that when one says "monarchies" there was only one deposed--the hohenzollerns. the other states had aristocratic powers, but the monarchy was in the control of the Kaiser.

But the various monarchs still had powers within their own realms and in accordance with their own constitutions, correct?

And just because even a majority of people may have "liked" or admired many of the royals, it would not follow that the people would continue to support a relatively antquated form of government.

Antiquated? As it existed, yes. But it would have been nice had some form of true constitutional monarchy evolved.

After the wall fell in 1989, the spontaneous parades and celebrations in Dresden, for example, featured the former royals leading the parades to the cheers of the crowds. such was not to be confused with wishing the royals were heading the government.

I did not know this. So the Wettins had some role in public life. But they still have not recovered their properties in Saxony have they?


Greenowl -

Thanks again. While, I am convinced of the advantages of constitutional monarchy, it is obvious that the Federal Republic has found a political system that works well, even if it is a republic!

I know nothing, really, about Max of Baden. It is my understanding that the House of Baden went through some financial troubles in the 70s or 80s, but Max solved the problems by selling some of the old palaces. There was also some sort of scandal about the sell of property belonging to the B-W State Library. I am not sure of the details or whether it was actually a full scandal.

Too bad that the other royals cannot find as prominent a role to play in their hereditary lands as the Wittelsbachs did in Bavaria, although I am sure that the Wettins of Saxony and the Hohenzollerns of Prussia are trying to help in whatever way they can.

Thanks, Greenowl. I appreciate your reply. Rather sad that there is little interest in the former ruling Houses. But, so much water has passed under the bridge. I understand that the Wittelsbachs are still popular in Bavaria. Is Carl popular in Wurttenburg and is the current head of the House of Baden popular in that part of B-W? I suppose there is no talk of a restoration and, indeed, the royals might not want the bother! It is probably easier for them to just lead quiet lives. Thanks again.

How is Georg Friedrich Prinz von Preussen viewed in Germany?  I'd think that he is a popular bachelor or potential husband for the right noblewoman: I mean he's good looking and rich! I know he plays no political role, but it seems that he does receive a fair amount of media coverage. Any thoughts? Thanks.

The Hohenzollern / Re: End of the Monarchies
« on: October 06, 2007, 04:40:36 PM »
Dmitri - When I said that the monarchies remained popular, I was thinking of the good will shown to some of the monarchs. Perhaps I should have said that they remained popular with a segment of society. I do not see how the whole imperial system could have been revived easily, although it could have been done. The German monarchs fared fairly well after the revolution compared with French and Russian monarchs. It is my understanding that some of the royal families are still popular especially the Bavarian royal family.

The Hohenzollern / Re: End of the Monarchies
« on: October 06, 2007, 08:21:32 AM »
Adagietto - I undestand what you are saying and I, too, regret the loss of the monarchies. That said, the revolution swept them away, yet they remained popular afterwards - at least to a degree, correct? I mean most continued to live in their former realms (after a brief exile and excluding the Kaiser). And most were well compensated financially. If I recall the Social Democrats tried to have their property expropriated without compensation but could never muster the votes. All of this seems to prove that the royals remained popular after the war and even to this day especially in Southern Germany. Yet the revolution happened. I just see this as a contradiction. In many ways the November Revolution reminds me of the American Revolution: the monarchy was ended but the same powers that be remained.

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