Messages

1306

The Hohenzollern / Re: Crownprince Wilhelm & Crownprincess Cecilie, their family, Part I

« on: November 15, 2004, 09:38:25 AM »

Thanks Rhon. That book sounds wonderful; but not showing up on Amazon or other sources I checked. Is if published in Europe?

1307

The Hohenzollern / Re: Princess Margaret of Prussia, aka Mossy

« on: November 12, 2004, 06:02:33 AM »

Interesting. I did not see any cemetery at Kronberg. Is this the same castle that Vicky built and lived in until her death?

1308

Imperial Russian History / Re: 1911 Events

« on: November 11, 2004, 06:58:49 PM »

At the "coming of age" ball for Olga, was she escorted by a young man of her age group of was she escorted by Nickolas? Any romantic ties for Olga during or after the ball?

1309

Imperial Russian History / Re: World War I

« on: November 11, 2004, 06:55:11 PM »

Thank you all for noting this important and sad day or memory. I too bow my head in silence for lost family in the European (and Pacific) wars. How tragic the lack of public awareness of the significance of today! If more were known and taken to heart, perhaps the continuation of the wars (and in large part the current global crises are WWI act three) would/could have been averted long ago. Hmmmm. Must be the so-called human nature.

1310

The Hohenzollern / Re: Crownprince Wilhelm & Crownprincess Cecilie, their family, Part I

« on: November 10, 2004, 03:16:12 PM »

Ah yes, all that makes sense and tracks. I wonder how "relatives" could, especially given they traded places so frequently and became "loyal" to different nations, get to a point of such severe anger and hostility to allow their ministers to opt for wars or other tough actions. Seems like the interrlations of the royals would have averted such tragedies.

1311

The Hohenzollern / Re: Crownprince Wilhelm & Crownprincess Cecilie, their family, Part I

« on: November 10, 2004, 10:51:36 AM »

The famous cousins, aunts, uncles, second cousins etc among the European royals, in general, did not gather the way most "real" families do at Christmas and Easter dinner etc. The royal relations were, by current definition, somewhat disfunctional in that while they were blood relations, they had hostilities brewing and being acted on regularly. The disfunctions were escaled by virtue of the fact they almost exclusively intermarried. So while we Americans, in particular, wouls tend to assume the royals of our discussions would be calling, visiting, writing, vacationing etc with each other all the time, it was rare they enjoyed each other's company.

1312

The Hohenzollern / Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part I

« on: November 06, 2004, 05:12:28 PM »

Appreciate seeing such headlines indeed. I also recall Fritz health started to majorly deteriorate while he and Vicky were vacationing in San Remo. San Remo was the elite, "jet set" spot for the royals and priveleged in the late 19th century. Did they travel with a huge entourage or fairly small? Was their residence in San Remo their own palace or a rented place? Is it still there?

1313

The Myth and Legends of Survivors / Re: Anastasia Inheritance Would Have Been What?

« on: November 06, 2004, 02:26:35 PM »

Obivously alot of back and forth about this issue. One item that I am aware of is that at the turn of the century, the czar of Russia Nickolas was listed as the world's richest person next to Rockefeler. I always thought such assets in a monarchy were the monarchs, not those of the so-called state.
I see Forum Admin is adamant that N had little money and hence no legacy, but it strikes me that this would only be true as a result of the fortunes being taken away, not that they weren't his to begin with.

1314

The Hohenzollern / Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part I

« on: November 06, 2004, 02:00:15 PM »

Fritz' illness, especially if it was cancer, was not easy to diagnose at that time. Often, patients died of "consumption" when in fact they may have had cancer. And some cancer patients may not have had it. Usually, cigarette smoking relates to lung problems; pip and cigar smoking causes more of the mouth and throat problems. Poor Fritz. He should have been spared to live longer.

Is there any evidence of US President Grover Cleveland expressing attitudes and feelings about Frederick? It seems with what Germany at large felt about the hopeful future with Fritz as Kaiser, the U.S. government would have embraced him completely.

1315

The Russian Revolution / Re: Soviet Life - What Was Gained From the Russian Revolution?

« on: November 05, 2004, 08:41:42 PM »

Any German-American museums paid for the government?
Cheers,

1316

The Hohenzollern / Re: Kaiser Wilhelm II

« on: November 05, 2004, 09:45:19 AM »

The moustache has surely been a source for charicatures world wide especially since WWI. But, during the late 1800s and early 1900s, Wilhelm was a very popular (in a semi-nerdy sense) personality and his moustache style was adopted by men all over the place. The long handle bars can be seen both in fashion as well as in common life. "Kaiser Bill" was commonly used to refer to him and his particular style.

1317

The Hohenzollern / Re: Kaiser Friedrich III, his spouse Victoria and their family, Part I

« on: November 05, 2004, 09:37:17 AM »

The tragedy of Fritz's illness is indeed so, so sad. Bad enough to lose any person to untimely disease, but in his case, it is nearly undeniably true that 20th century history would be extremely different had Fritz lived and ruled until the 1900s.
However, the docs who treated him probably could not have extended his life too long even had they done the more drastic surgery. Cancers in the neck are among the worse and with no treatment other than cutting, his prognosis was not good. I have always wondered how they were sure it was cancer in the first place. This was a very undiagnosed disease until well into the 20th century, I think.

1318

The Russian Revolution / Re: Soviet Life - What Was Gained From the Russian Revolution?

« on: November 03, 2004, 09:33:15 AM »

Part of the view a population may have is a direct result of the media as well, especially latter 20th century and current. Russians' attitudes and lack of responsibilities for the past may indeed be due to not even knowing or understanding the history or how to position it. Case in point...History Channel's series on horrible dictators has titled the one for Hitler as "Tyrant of Terror". Stalin's is "Man of Steel"; sounds pretty positive for old Joe. This kind of top spin (which is frequently ALL the majority absorb) taints reality in a huge way.

1319

Imperial Russian History / Re: World War I

« on: November 02, 2004, 03:07:26 PM »

....and the point relative to the topic  ...

Nickolas could have avoided the conflict. However, governments of poor nations or nations with loads of miserable people have historically seen war as a short term solution. U.S. did it to get out of the depression and Nickolas saw a war as a means to get the masses of oppressed back on a nationalistic track. So, he actually seems to have invited the opportunity for war and it backfired.
Germany had no such motive. Their population was growing by leaps and bounds, affluence in the middle class was historical. Germans were happy and content and very pleased with the status quo.
What could have happend, but obviously did not, was what is happening today. Had Nickolas not desired a war to divert homeland attention, German businesses would have very likely set their sites on the vast opportunities in Russia. Already, Germany had built the Baghdad/Berlin and Tehran/Berlin railways and Russia was prime for development. Industrial development would have not only jump started a vastly improved life for Russias millions, but would have avoided WWI and set the stage for a very different and less tragic 20th century. The monarchies would have fallen sooner of later, but likely with less misery and bloodshed.

1320

Imperial Russian History / Re: World War I

« on: November 02, 2004, 02:50:45 PM »

Everyone knows the winners get to write history, but it is interesting to me that after 100 years and the trendy attitude to be critical of establishment ideas, that pre WWI Germany is still vilified for that catastrophe. If the "imperial aspirations of the Kaiser" caused the war, what were they? Germany had a few colonies in Africa and the Pacific and had capitalist joint ventures in several places, but the country paled in comparison to the empire of the British and French. One of the most indelible images in grade school was the world map; Britain and its empire was in pink--75% of the world! Imperialistic aspirations?
Wilhelm was creating a great navy, but he was far behind the British and French in the global land grab and well behind the Brits on naval ships by treaty.
During the summer of 1914, after the assassinations, W was the only prominent leader to get Serbia to yield to the Austrian demands. Russia did not. England did not. France did not. William accomplished this goal ALONE, and hence avoided the supposed spark to ingnite war.
Upons closer inspection, Germany was quite satisfied with the Serbian response. It seems Russia and France, each of whom did not at all expect Serbia to fold (and hence bring war) were much surprised and likely disappointed that the trigger had been defused. Rather than back off, they each mobilized in spite of the Serbian accomodations.
Moreover, Germany's and the Kaiser's "imperialist" activities during the Wilhelmine era are ever so misleading. They took great advantage of the industrial revolution and the benefits therein, as did the U.S. and Britain. Germany paralleled the other great powers in industrial and commercial growth in all areas of culture and society. This was not "imperialist" unless every other nation is also guilty of that bad term. And, the Kaiser, who had led Germany through 35 years of peace during which he took the moral high road on issues like the Boer War, had little to gain by any war. He and Germany were in great shape and poised for even larger greatness. The leading commercial giants, such as Albert Ballin, and the leading diplomats, such as Prince ? in England, begged for peace and the Kaiser was on their side.