Messages

61

Books about the Romanovs and Imperial Russia / Re: "Memoirs of the pages to the Tsar"

« on: November 08, 2004, 06:52:40 AM »

Dear Elisa,

The book covers several tsars but focusses in Nicholas´time. There´s not much information on the Empresses, but there are a couple of anecdotes and the kind of first hand comments that you could like. Most of the material deals with their life in the corps des pages, and they pay a lot of attention to uniforms and military. Anyway, Many of the most interesting information, once you already own Virubova´s, Dehn´s, etc,etc... comes from this kind of books.

Definitely, i would highly recommend it.

62

The Imperial Family / Re: Dolls, wax figures, busts etc of NAOTMAA

« on: November 07, 2004, 09:51:02 AM »

Hello Elisa ,

The dolls the grand duchesses had were mainly done of bisque(head) and composition( for the ball jointed body).

The major part of their dolls were made in germany(the land of the dolls), by the best dollmakers such as Handwerck, and Simon and Halbig(most frequently) and Kammer and Reinhardt. I´ve also seen a couple of "Dream Babies" i think from Armand Marseille.

They also had French dolls( mainly "Jumeau"), that were produced in a far smaller scale and therefore were much more expensive than those from Germany.

The grand duchesses´doll collection was really incredible, i would say the largest in the world. We must remember that to have just one of the smaller dolls(cabinet size or even the so called frozen charlottes that were quite tiny if i remember well) was considered quite a luxury at the time.

In adition to those smaller dolls the grand duchesses had life size lovely dolls(36 inches or more), and extensive complements, trouseaus, trunks full of wonderful clothes, with french lace and all the things we could ever imagine.

A middle class girl from that time would have think she was in paradise if she would have seen all these things.

Today, a well preserved, dressed in period clothes french doll by Jumeau can easily cost 6000 dollars.
One good 36 inches girl by Handwerck might cost around 1500 dollars. And those are the prices you can find in Ebay auctions, if you go to an antiques shop it would be much more expensive.

I love this kind of bisque dolls, so i hope people will add more information on this very interesting(at least for me ) thread...

63

Books about the Romanovs and Imperial Russia / "Memoirs of the pages to the Tsar"

« on: November 06, 2004, 06:34:48 AM »

I´m just reading this book and would highly recommend it. It´s full of anecdotes and details i think are very interesting.

The book is hard to find, published by Gilbert´s Royal Books, translated and edited(it was previously published in french in the 1960s) by Dr. Thomas E. Berry.

I think the best way to buy this book could be through Paul´s website, but may be Arturo has also some copies.

64

Palaces in St. Petersburg / Re: Nikolaevskiy Palace, home of the Nikolaevitchi

« on: November 05, 2004, 08:44:22 AM »

Thanks so much for your kind words Sunny

I would highly recommend this concerts to anyone visiting the city. In fact, they are more the kind of russian folckloric show than a classic concert. The group at the landing stage with the fancy dresses welcome you dancing a lovely minuet while you ascend the staircase. During the "entre´acte" the doors are open to show the adjoining reception room, where the hors deuvres are served and you can help yourself and take glass after glass of champagne.

Everything is perhaps "too turistic", but i enjoyed it all the same and we attended no less than three times each time we were in Petersburg. At the end we could recognize the dancers from the preceding years!

The same could be said about Ella´s palace. The dancers are mostly the same that used to be in 1999, and even one of them, fancifully dressed with a 18th c. livery greeted us. The concerts at Ella´s palace, as well as those in the Nikolay N. palace are the only possible way for tourist to see their interiors.

65

Palaces in St. Petersburg / Re: Nikolaevskiy Palace, home of the Nikolaevitchi

« on: November 05, 2004, 08:02:59 AM »

Here is a photo i took during one of the concerts that are held in this palace. The palace has one of the most magnificents staircases in all Petersburg.

66

Tsarskoe Selo Town / Re: Hotels in Pushkin / Tsarskoe Selo

« on: November 03, 2004, 06:13:08 PM »

To Tsaria and Antonio.....Many thanks for your wonderful descriptions!  I have my big map of Tsarskoe Selo (I mark everything on it) and for the last 20 years my most fervent dream has been to visit there.  Your descriptions bring it so to life for me.  Now sadly I know that I shall never make it.....but you guys make it so real and a person can ALWAYS dream!      ..Arleen

PS Post pictures please....would love to see the black cat waiting......

Dear Arleen,

Please do not say never. I wish you can go soon to Tsarskoe and see your dream become real. I looked for the photo and here you have. Sadly, i did not take a close up of the cat but i enlarged a fragment of the original photo so you can see him as better as possible...I know, he looks so tiny....

67

Tsarskoe Selo Town / Re: Hotels in Pushkin / Tsarskoe Selo

« on: November 02, 2004, 06:37:26 AM »

Dear Tsaria,

I was very touched by your words about the cat. I think i also took a photo of him, but at that time i must confess that i took the last photographs quite compulsively(if that words may be used...)

I totally agree with you about the city infraestructure. Everything is changing-developing so quickly! Only four years back things were quite different. The restaurant in the Admiralty we frequented, but there are now so many lovely restaurants. The Staraya Bashnia al fresco restaurant is one of my favourites, since you can have dinner so close to the former tennis court, inside the courtyard of the Fyodorovsky Gorodok.

One of the most recently opened, near the palace, is decorated in the old russian style, and there´s a balcony looking over Anna´s house´s backyard.

They´re also building a lot of lovely houses in classic and even a restrained version of russian art nouveau styles. One of them i thought it was simply a dream, since it was at the corner directly in front of the palace gates.

Sadly all these new restaurants are extremelly expensive and. i think, are almost unaffordable(?) for the inhabitants of the city in general. We frequently saw there only mature men with young women, always carrying Louis Vouiton handbags and the like...

And yes, the city museum is quite lovely, the people there always so kind and helpfully!

 

68

Tsarskoe Selo Town / Re: Hotels in Pushkin / Tsarskoe Selo

« on: November 01, 2004, 06:25:05 PM »

Dear Tsaria,

Thanks so much for your quick answer. Now i really think i´ll try to spend if only a few nights in Tsarskoe, even when, i must confess, i´ve always felt a little moody(sad?) every time i´ve remained there after the palace was closed. I´ll never forget the last day i spent in Petersburg, when we took a late train and arrived in Tsarskoe just 15 minutes before the palace closed. I was alone after the last guided group that toured the palace, and when i looked back to the Empress´ enfilade of rooms i saw as one by one the lights were switched off. It was raining, and we remained by the semicircular flight of steps until a man with militar attire came and closed the main entrance door. No one remained inside, and a black cat sat quietly by the door.
I felt as if the whole palace was dead.

69

Tsarskoe Selo Town / Re: Hotels in Pushkin / Tsarskoe Selo

« on: November 01, 2004, 12:23:34 PM »

Dear Tsaria,

I never imagined there could be a hotel in the Catherine palace! Do you know which rooms are used?? I can only think of the service wings that close the courtyard...

70

Having Fun! / Re: The Romanov You Dislike

« on: October 31, 2004, 11:00:44 PM »

i've been thinking about this question, the favorite romanov and the favorite windsor woman for a few days now.

from the first instance,as an adult, my answer is alexandra.  she brought with her such possibilities for failure and she fulfilled all of them.

one would have thought that she had been reasonably well educated, seeing that QV had personally overseen her education.  but even though QV had groomed her to become the Q of england, i find her lack of education appalling.  and she seemed to revel in her ignorance: her romantic ideas about russian peasants come immediately to mind.

she was ignorant, hysterical, overemotional.  she never had a grip on herself.  i even think that she was aware  of her shortcomings at first, but she never made an honest effort to adapt to her surroundings.  her surroundings had to adapt to her. this was also due to the fact that she was an empress almost immediately after arriving in russia; no one could teach her by example as she was at the social pinnacle.

she was a slave to her emotions and she held her family, the dynasty and the empire in scant repsect, as she emoted her way through life.when she needed to think and act from informed courage, she felt and prayed.  if it wasn't so tragic, it would be funny.

she was never responsible for anything: everyone else was the problem: MF, the court, the family, even later, ella.  she was hardheaded, no one could tell her anything.  i think even if nicholas ever had the nerve to contradict her, she would have just bowled over him too. (altho i do remember a scant few times, he put his foot down and she demurred.)

one cannot just go seemingly frowning[/i] through life and then expect mercy.  everyone had/has a sad story: that was/is life.  what makes one successful in life is one's attitude and alexandra had, to my mind, a shockingly bad one.

she was not temperamentally suited to her job and, imo, she never really made a good effort.  it is that lack of effort which makes me dislike her. going through life, not being responsible or making an effort or demanding that everyone come to you is also a way of being lazy.

on the other hand, nicky seemed to try sometimes but he was as unsuited as she: he was a lazy tsarevich who didn't bother to learn (if he could have, one wonders if he wasn't a bit stupid too)  and when he had to ascend the throne he was not prepared. but did he learn and try to ensure that alexei would be ready to rule? no.  so much so that at the abdication, i think he abdicated for A. also because he knew that baby was not intelllectually able to rule.

for all that they were supposed to be good parents, they had not enabled ANY of their children to meet adulthood adequately.  i look at them as an example of how NOT to bring up a family: treacly love is not enough.

for all that we study them, i think (at least) some of us find them fascinating because it is like watching a car wreck.

so, (just so the incensed posters can get it right) alexandra is my least favorite, nicky the punultimate favorite.  i do not have the talent for elegant, succinct prose, as has arturo, but i concur with his finding heartily.

Hello Pushkina :)

Really, the last paragraph was unnecessary, it was quite clear whom you disliked most of all the Romanovs...

Even respecting your opinion as any other should be respected, i must disagree with at least a couple of your statements.

Leaving other considerations aside, i do not not think Alexandra could be considered an ignorant at all. Her education was simply above the standard education given to a woman in those times. She was fluent in several languages, and had great interest in Philosofical, Scientific and Theologic studies. You just need to see the inventory of her private books kept at the Mauve boudoir( and those were just a few).

In a time when Darwin and his Theory about the evolution of the species was generally ridiculized and considered by many even insulting, she was prompt to study it and took it seriously, even against the express desire of the religious authorities(i think, cannot tell for sure just now, it was her confessor who told her not to read Darwin´s book). And that when she has always been described as a fanatic as far as religion was concerned.
Could go on and on...

And second, you say: "one cannot just go seemingly frowning[/i] through life and then expect mercy"

Too hard, don´t you think? In my humble opinion everyone has the right to expect mercy.

71

Books about the Romanovs and Imperial Russia / Re: Exhibition Catalogues

« on: October 31, 2004, 05:54:27 AM »

Does anyone know where I can buy the Nicholas and Alexandra exhibitionb catalogue? (the one with OTMA's portraits by Kaulbach)

!

Hello Lisa,

As far as i know those portraits were sold in the 1920-30s and have never been exhibited. In fact, we do not know even who bought them. Have you ever seen them in any exhibition?? That would be the new of the year!( at least for me...)

72

Having Fun! / Re: The Romanov You Dislike

« on: October 30, 2004, 09:35:16 PM »

Claro Antonio,

However, and perhaps for the sake of argument, A3 did not place as much effort as he should have on having his son educated for the role the future had in store.

So yes, Nicholas ascended the throne without the preparation demanded by his office...then again he had more than 20 years to learn the "trade" and failed miserably at doing so...hence my criticism of his shortcomings as a political figure still stands.  And I have never diubted that he was a nice man to those who knew him and we know through reliable sources that he was a respectful son, loving husband and father, but a failed Tsar.  Some people just cannot separate one from the other I suppose.

I operate from the fact that this is an educated community of people interested in discussing the Romanovs and their historical role.  Surely, sometimes there are moments of levity when some discuss the less meaningful aspects of this family (dresses, who looks more like them, et al.), and that is perfectly OK of course.  However, it is quite scary when one expresses one's opinion -based on fact, historical fact mind you- and as a result one receives nasty emails filled with threats, obtuse comments and such from people who are cowardly enough not to sign their messages with their own name.

It is kind of sad, and laughable at the same time, but troubling nonetheless that when confronted with a differing opinion these APA members react in such an uncivilized manner.  Then again...am I suprised...sadly, not really.

Arturo Beéche

Dear Arturo,

I agree with you that this is an open forum and all the different opinions must be respected ( as long as the opinions do not offend any other member).

And of course, when i give my opinion, it´s always based on something i have read, even if it could take me a whole week to trace the information and find the exact book. So be sure i do not base my statements in gossip. In fact, since i do not know anyone who could give me first hand information on Imperial Russia i simply have no other way than the books.

It´s shameful that you are receiving those nasty emails. You should tell that to the Forum A. I would never think people could go that far...

And really, i can perfectly separate Nicholas´role as a father from his role as a Tsar, and am not blind as far as his own faults are concerned.

Best to you Arturo, and just ignore those stupid messages.

Antonio.

73

Having Fun! / Re: The Romanov You Dislike

« on: October 30, 2004, 12:25:37 PM »

Antonio,

que tal..

I do not agree with your statement that "Alexander III...openly despised his son."

A3 may not have been happy with how Nicholas Alexandrovich turned out, but to "despise" is truly a harsh statement.  Do you mind if I ask where the proof for this is?

Despise = Detestar

Arturo Beéche

Hey Arturo,

Thanks for your kind editorial assistance

You´re right, when i used the verb despise i did not want to say "detestar". Of course AIII did not detest his son.

The problem is that in my Spanish-English dictionary the word despise is translated as despreciar (meaning to feel contempt, disdain, scorn), and not, as you say, as detestar. (hate, loathe)

In my dictionary the english verb for detestar is hate or loathe.

So, as you see, in my dictionary the verb despise is not translated as detestar (hate, loathe).

So what i meant was that Alexander III belittled his son. Hope this word will be correctly understood.

74

Having Fun! / Re: The Romanov You Dislike

« on: October 30, 2004, 11:57:57 AM »

The Dowager Empress was not a figure with constitutional obligations.  Nicholas II was faced with terrible events during his reign, granted.

Dear Arturo,

I agree with you that Maria had no constitutional obligations. However, the high social position she held carried along some responsabilities as well. She instigated the bad feelings against Alexandra, and even when the gossip and despiseful remarks did not come from her own mouth she allowed them to be told in her presence, thus undermining the Empress´(and also his son´s) prestige.

It´s a fact that the majort part of the gossip underminning the Empress´reputation came not from the lower classes but from the highest  ones. What the aristocracy did not know is that while they gladly(and loudly) chatted and commented the wildest stories about Alexandra and Rasputin they were also ruining the whole institution of the monarchy before the eyes of the russian people. They played with fire and ultimately got burnt.

Maria F. had her part in that.

She was neither very responsible about the many charitable institutions she presided, and there were several scandals about lost funds which she tried to hush up, just to protect her own name.

Finally, i´m still to discover if she cared for anything other than dresses, balls and jewells.

I´m not comparing her with her son or daughter in law, just looking for her own individual faults.

75

Having Fun! / Re: The Romanov You Dislike

« on: October 30, 2004, 06:04:27 AM »

Maria Feodorovna is a product of her time and environment, perhaps, misguided in her excessive love for her children, perhaps a little too selfish, but she is dwarved by the failings of others inher family circle...

Arturo Beéche

Hello Arturo

It seems you can find an explanation for every member of the Romanov family except for Nicholas and Alexandra. I mean that the argument "he/she was a product of his/her time and environment" should be then applied also to Nicholas, for example. He was not properly prepared for the role he was to play as an Emperor, and that was Alexander III´s fault, who, by the way, openly despised his son.
Maria´s attitude towards Ksenya´s engagement was simply histerical, not to say the way she married off Olga....

As for Alexandra, i think Maria had a much easier situation and environment, for the court was always ready to praise anything she did, and equally ready to criticize anything Alexandra did or did not do.

They commented on the excesive attention Alexandra paid, at the beginning, to clothes and jewells, but she spent half as much as Maria had done before her.

Also, i wonder what Maria would have acted like about "one Rasputin" if she would have had a hemophiliac son.