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Messages - brnbg aka: liljones1968

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601
ms. Davidson ---

i must admit that your last post in this thread (when coupled with what the FA stated earlier & the info contained in the link provided) makes  much more sense to me than anything stated previously.

i apologize for taking personally, something that had never been intended that way.  and for allowing it to continue.    childishness & petulance can occur at any age, unfortunately.


sincerely --
Brian von R
brnbg aka: liljones1968





okay, i'm done. ;)

602
thank you, FA, for the link.   i appreciate it very much.
======================================


i would like to add, that if something similar had been offered earlier  in the thread, it would have been much more effective.     in any case, i appreciate the FA's input.   i sincerely wish ms. Davidson had offered to be helpful instead of just telling us all that we were wrong.    

  over time, i've come to realize in a very literal way, that when you're trying to get a point across, it will almost always fall on deaf ears, if you deliver it like  a high-school teacher in a bad mood.      smugness will get you very little.    


and i'd like to make a general apology to everyone involved with this thread for my participation in drawing this thread somewhat away from it's original path.    my only defense is that i genuinely resented the tone i felt was taken in an earlier post;  but i allowed that resentment to continue when the tone i felt i had encountered, seemed to continue.        call it a flaw in my character, but i can't let certain things go unchallenged.....one of those things is a condescending attitude or tone (however unintentional).    

i should have just let it go & laughed it off.   but because it wasn't very important, i let it go on much longer than i should have.  

so, again, i sincerely apologize to my fellow members for helping to pull the thread slightly off the subject.    


lastly, it may seem as though i'm making WAY  too much of this, but there may be some members who resent the previous exchange as much i resented the tone that got me started.      hopefully not, but ya never know.


thanks much.





603
The Yussupovs / Re: Mansions of the Yusupovs in Europe - Finland, France etc
« on: September 16, 2004, 04:46:47 AM »
the answer to all of the above is yes.   she's the same one who lived to be 100; Feliks was the only one to ever eat the mouldy chocolates she always offered (that's why he was her favorite); she was the same one who was admired by Nik I & also built the dacha @ Tsarskoie-Selo (which was a copy of the Tsarskoie-Selo Hermitage); her first husband had been Boris Nikolaevitch.



604
The Yussupovs / Mansions of the Yusupovs in Europe - Finland, France etc
« on: September 14, 2004, 10:49:49 PM »
Feliks' great-grandmother, the princess Zenaîda Ivanovna Yusupova (who was also the marquise de Serre & the comtesse de Chaveau) bought the estate & chateau de Kériolet in Brittany for her 2nd husband, the chevalier de Chaveau.   she had also bought him the title of count (at the same time, buying for herself the title of marquise de Serre).   when he died, he left the chateau to his mistress.     the princess bought it back from her, closed it up & never went there again.     ownership eventually fell to Feliks, and once again, Feliks & Irina found a windfall had descended upon them.   the sale of the chateau & the estate enabled them to live well again, for a while....



605
The Yussupovs / Re: The Yusupov Palace on Moika, St.Petersbourg
« on: September 13, 2004, 10:55:27 AM »
first-off, both photos were taken at the same sitting (notice the wrap, it's obviously the same).   that having been said, i tend to think the photos were taken during the 1920's, given the style of her clothes.    the style of the dress & the way she's wearing her wrap are definitively 'flapper' in style.     it's very possible that the tiara she's wearing was borrowed from one of the many jewellers that Feliks & Zenaida had done so much business with over the years....it may have been part of one of the "deals" Feliks made with Cartier when he would occasionally deposit/pawn some their extremely valuable jewellery with them.   or it may have been borrowed from friends...


secondly, a case can be made for 2 different tiaras.   in the photo of the Yusupov treasures spread-out on the table, it appears that the central stone in that one is clear or, at least, very light or pale.....
whereas, the one Irina is wearing in the photos appears to contain a dark stone in the center.

what do y'all think?

606
The Yussupovs / Re: The Yusupov Palace on Moika, St.Petersbourg
« on: September 11, 2004, 02:17:01 PM »
Quote
Also, they are constantly adding poor quality new tapestries and little carpets that do not fit at all with the size of the rooms(not to tell about the curtains, just see those in Irina´s silver boudoir...). Anyway, it´s a private building and they can do as they like...

i tend to agree with you about the present state of décor.    but i think it was done in much better taste "back in the day";  besides, think about the resources they had to draw from.   i think the old b&w photos sort of show the elegantly traditional hand that had originally decorated it.    

but i must admit, part of the reason i'm so fascinated with this building, in particular, are it's associations with the family that lived there.   i've never seen it in person, and i'm afraid i would probably be disappointed if i did, but until then, it'll likely remain my favorite.




607
HIH Maximilian Josèph Eugène Auguste Napoléon de Beauharnais Duke von Leuchtenberg, Prince von Eichstadt

m.

HIH Maria Nikolaievna Grand Duchess of Russia


5th child:
  HIH Eugen Maksimilianovitch Romanovsky de Beauharnais
  Duke von Leuchtenberg, Prince von Eichstadt, Prince Romanovsky
   m.
   1 (morganatic)Daria Opotchinina
   died in childbirth March 19th 1870
   Created Countess de Beauharnais, January 20th n.s., 1869
   2 (morganatic) Zinaida Skobeleva
    Created Countess de Beauharnais, July 14th n.s., 1878;
    created HSH Duchess von Leuchtenberg, August 28th n.s., 1889

          Child from the first marriage:
           a.Daria Evgenievna Countess de Beauharnais
                  (born: March 19th 1870)
                  (executed in Leningrad on November 5th, 1938 )
                  m.
                  I.     Lev Mikhailovitch Prince Kotchoubey
                   (Divorced: 1911)
                  II.   Woldemar Alexander Eduard Freiherr von Grävenitz
                  III   Victor Aleksandrovitch Markezetti
                         (executed in Leningrad on January 15th, 1938 )



608
Imperial Russian Antiques / Re:   The Hermitage/Winter Palace
« on: September 08, 2004, 06:38:17 PM »
Quote
By the time the staff building was complete, and the Winter Palace needed a paint job, Nicholas I declared that all residences of members of the Imperial family should be painted a dark red, which recalled early Muscovite palaces.



is THAT why Ella & Serge's palace (the Belozelski-Belozerski palace) is that hideous red color?!    i've got photos from when it was all white or, at least, a very pale pastel & it harmonized w/ it's architecture much better.      i could never fathom why anyone would actually CHOOSE that awful color --- it always seems to make it look grimey & dirty.

but an "Imperial command" would alleviate the doubt i had in the resident's tastes ;-)

609
i could be wrong, but i don't think his memorial exists anymore.    Ella asked that it be built (i don't know if she or the state paid for it) and it was one of the first things destroyed by the revolutionary government (Serge was liked by very few).  

also, i too am curious as to why Serge Aleksandrovitch's body was not re-buried in the Romanov crypt?   maybe it boils down to money & publicity?   reburying his body with even remotely similar equippage as those already resting there, would cost an enormous amount of money.   and the world at large would have no clue whatsoever who he was;  but reburying Nicholas II, Aleksandra, & family, while outrageously expensive, would (and did) reap even larger benefits in terms of publicity & revenue through various means.

but that's purely speculation, and he may be there resting peacefully.

does anyone know for sure?

610
since i cannot for the life of me remember in which topic (let alone which thread!) i saw the original request, i'm just going to start a new topic and hope the person who originally mentioned a desire to see the former Kremlin home of Serge & Ella, sees it.



their home in the Kremlin was the little Nicholas palace.   it was from there that HIH the grand duke serge Aleksandrovitch of Russia and Governor-General of Moscow, left for his offices and was the victim of a revolutionary's bomb.

this photo shows the view from the Ivan Veliki looking north, with the small Nicholas palace in the foreground on the right; the other buildings shown, are:
the Chudov Monastery (left foreground); the church of the Archangel
Michael (background center w/ onion domes); and the court of Justice (in the back, on the left w/ the single large dome).


while the court of Justice building is still there, the other three buildings in foreground were razed and replaced with a "modern" theater.

611
Palaces in St. Petersburg / Re: Private rooms of the Winter Palace
« on: September 01, 2004, 11:27:01 AM »


it's the moorish bathroom that's situated behind the room marked 'F' on the above plan (they have a communicating door)

i've always wondered what this room looks like now.   since it's not open to the public, it could be in any condition.   it may have even escaped destruction....who knows?

612
the emeralds of HIH the grand duchess Vladimir of Russia
(Mariia Pavlovna the elder)

the original necklace

613
The Imperial Family / Re: Imperial Family Jewels
« on: August 31, 2004, 07:52:55 AM »
Quote
Am I correct in thinking that the nuptial crown was made by Catherine the Great from a diamond belt? Grandduchessella, the photo in which the jewels are laid out is in fact only half of the picture. Most of the jewels are State jewels but I think that I am correct in saying that there are some of Alix's personal jewels laid out on the table, notably the tiara at the very end on the right which I think was given to her upon her marriage. I'll have to take a look at the wonderful Geoffrey Munn before I attempt to remember who made it (possibly Kochert?) and what it was set with (maybe emeralds?).  This must have been the most dazzling display of jewellery; such a shame that we don't have a record of these remarkable jewels in colour apart from the few pieces that survive.


i don't know if anyone has mentioned this yet, but, in fact, everything on the table (and, indeed, everything that was eventually to find it's way to the auction-block) was painstakingly documented & photographed (presumably in color).    the son of Peter Karl Fabergé was "persuaded" to do the documentation (how could he refuse those who were killing everyone around him?).     he removed all the stones from their settings, weighed them, cleaned the stones & their settings, replaced them, and then had them photographed (he may have done the photographing himself, but i'm not sure).    

i'm assuming those in power had this done for several reasons....
A). to determine the ACTUAL (intrinsic [sp?]) value (regardless of their
     possible historical significance) of all the jewels & artworks they
     now controlled and in what form;
B). as preparation for their eventual sale, done to raise capital;

et cetera.


just imagine:   somewhere, in some Russian archive, there exists an album or folio --- i'd guess there are several --- probably covered in layers of dust, that contain the images of EVERY JEWEL (state property and personal) along with the carat weights of the stones and
weight of the gold/silver/platinum of the settings!  however i doubt if they did this with every confiscated collection (the task would just be too overwhelming.   as it was, it took the younger Fabergé around 2 years to do what had been "asked" of him...)

i think i could die happy if i were able to liesurely leaf through them all...

(btw, one of the interesting things Fabergé's son discovered during the course of his work concerned the fabulous pieces of colored diamonds {such as those from the 18th century that have the foliage & bees}.....   most of the stones weren't colored.   they were diamonds alright, but there was colored foil on the back of them to give them the desired color {he surreptitiously scratched a few with his fingernail {he considered them just too good to be true.  and he was right.!})

some of the "colored" diamonds in question:

614
Imperial Russian Antiques / Re: Romanov Tiaras
« on: August 30, 2004, 08:45:26 PM »
Ella's emeralds worn as "buttons" down the front of her court gown:





later, worn on her kokoshnik:




here, the Serbian tiara with it's new glass "emeralds":


615
Imperial Russian Antiques / Re: Romanov Tiaras
« on: August 30, 2004, 07:43:03 PM »
someone asked to see the "ears of wheat" tiara?   here's the original.   i'll try to dig-up the image i have of the modern copy.



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