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Messages - Bourgogne

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French Royals / Re: Impératrice Eugénie
« on: December 17, 2008, 05:21:16 AM »
It's funny to see those shoes of that time, how small they were! I saw the shoes of Catherine of Württemberg, wife of Jerome Napoléon, on the exhibition on Jerome in Kassel, Germany, this summer, and I coudn't hardly believe that they once wore a person, they seemed small like those of a doll to me! But I don't know about the size of Eugenie's shoes....  ;)

If I remember well, Eugenie's size was 36 (french) so US 4,  UK 3.5...

(Sorry the pictures are not available for one day, I've got a little problem with my PC, all will be ok again this evening!)

French Royals / Re: Impératrice Eugénie
« on: December 13, 2008, 07:34:37 AM »
And the shoes which Eugénie was wearing the day of Queen Victoria's arrival in Paris, for the "Exposition Universelle" of 1855.

The label inside the shoes, with imperial arms!

French Royals / Re: Impératrice Eugénie
« on: December 13, 2008, 07:23:17 AM »
Lovely collage!!! Thanks!

The bodice which Eugénie was wearing the day of assassination attempt by Orsini in 1858...
Eugénie was splashed with blood, but I don't see blood here. I suppose she was wearing a coat, it was the 14th january...

The Hohenzollern / Re: The Grand Ducal family of Oldenburg
« on: December 13, 2008, 06:55:24 AM »
It will be very hard to find her picture or a portrait!

I've seen a sketch of her in the David McIntosch book on the Oldenburgs. Great book.

Really?!!!! Well, I will have to buy this book, then! Thank you so much Svetabel for this information! And do you know where on the net I could buy this book? It's a very recent book, isn't it?

The Habsburgs / Re: Empress Maria Theresa and her large family
« on: December 11, 2008, 05:53:49 AM »
She is descedant of Bourbons through Lorraine family,but Dukes of Lorraine are Germans in the male line...their first ancestor was Count Matfried von Metzgau...after him there were Counts with names  Adalbert,Gerhard,Siegfried and so on...They were also Dukes of Alsasgau(Alsace)...with the marriage of Gothard IV and Hedwig of Namur their descedants names start to mix...but again they keep some german names of Frederick,Theobald,Matthias...they were also Dukes von Bitsch, etc. while their sisters,aunts etc had names like Agatha,Judith,Hedwig,Kunigunde(also german names)....Collateral branch of the family were Herren zu Flörchingen...and the other branch were Counts of Flanders,but they inherited Flanders through female line,through Hedwig of Namur....

Yes! And morever, even if the dukes of Lorraine were "french" geographically and culturally, the House of Lorraine was hating the House of Bourbon and the kingdom of France. France and Lorraine were almost always in enemies camps during the wars.

Saint-Simon said that the german Liselotte, the famous "princesse Palatine", Louis XIV's sister-in-law, had a passion for the princes of the House of Lorraine, because she considered them as "german princes"...

And the french ambassador in Vienna, wrote to Louis XV (ca. 1750) about Franz-Stefan, MA's father : "As a lorrain, he's hating us"...

For Isabel-Fernanda, countess Gurovsky, the man she was supposed to marry, before her escapades, was her cousin Ferdinand of Orléans, Royal Prince of the French, son of King Louis-Philippe. But he refused to marry her. In the Orléans family, Isabel-Fernanda was called "le monstre roux" ("the redheaded monster")!!!!

Ferdinand's sister, Louise, queen of Belgium, received a portrait of Isabel-Fernanda. She wrote to her mother Queen Marie-Amélie (21 november 1836) : " I send you back the portrait. Léopold (Louise's husband, King Léopold I, King of Belgium) said it's awfull! The hair alarm him particulary for the children... If the whole family were carrot-red, it would be really distressing!"...

All the same, this project became serious. Ferdinand was furious and said to his parents: "The Spanish one, never! She's hideous, and she's the daughter of a moron and of a whore!"... (it wasn't very nice for Queen Marie-Amélie, the "whore" was her brother's daughter!...)

The case was closed... He married Helene of Mecklenbourg-Schwerin...

The Habsburgs / Re: Empress Maria Theresa and her large family
« on: December 09, 2008, 08:11:34 AM »
I think had MariaTheresia or Emperor Joseph II still on the throne, MA would have been saved. However when the revolution came, MA's closest relalatives had died and so saving her life wasn't a priority...

Exactly. Her nephew Franz II didn't know her and refused definitively to save her. In april 1793, Austria had captured five delegates of French Revolution (Bournonville, Camus, Bancal des Issarts, Lamarque and Quinette). French government secretely proposed to austrian governement to make an exchange with MA, her daughter Marie-Thérèse and Louis XVI's sister. Franz II refused...!!!
When he finally accepted another exchange, in 1795, MA and Louis XVI's sister were already beheaded. Only Marie-Thérèse was still alive. She went in Vienna, but never forgave her first cousin's behavior, and considered him as the real responsable of MA's death. In a sense, she wasn't completely wrong...

The Hohenzollern / Re: The Grand Ducal family of Oldenburg
« on: December 03, 2008, 05:29:06 PM »
Easy to find by others? or by yourself???
You are doing a request and then making remarks when the picture does not come right away.

? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?

I just say that I wonder why a portrait of this princess is so hard to find, by me or by anyone ! And I see that beladona observed that, too.

What's your problem, darling? You didn't take your sedative, this evening?

The Habsburgs / Re: Archduke Ludwig Victor
« on: December 02, 2008, 10:50:17 AM »
Here are some photographs of Archduke Ludwig Victor (1842-1919). He was the youngest brother of Emperor Franz Joseph. In his family he was called Bubi or der kleine Ludwig (= little Ludwig).

I hope I can make you laugh ...  ;D

Ludwig wearing a dress

Ludwig (on the far left) with sons of Philipp of Württemberg - hot swimsuits  :o

Ludwig as a woman and as a man (photomontage?)

I'm sorry, I can't see these photographs, could someone post them one more time?

His sister-in-law, Louise of Belgium (archduchess Stéphanie's sister) says in her french Mémoires ("Autour des trônes que j'ai vus tomber") that Ludwig-Viktor was charming and wanted to seduce her... But she declined... And Ludwig-Viktor never forgave this and became her worst enemy...

The Hohenzollern / Re: The Grand Ducal family of Oldenburg
« on: December 01, 2008, 05:45:45 AM »
It will be very hard to find her picture or a portrait!

I know, I know...!
You can find pictures of her sister Adelaide, Friedrich-August's first wife.
You can find pictures of Cecilia of Sweden, Friedrich-August's third wife.

And you can't find a picture of Ida, the only one who gave birth to the heir, Peter II, grand-duc of Oldenburg... I don't understand that! Ok, she did very young, but...?

The Hohenzollern / Re: The Grand Ducal family of Oldenburg
« on: November 30, 2008, 01:42:37 PM »
Does somebody have a picture of Ida von Anhalt-Bernburg-Schaumburg-Hoym (1804-1828), duchess of Oldenburg, second wife of Friedrich-August I, grand-duc of Oldenburg?

Her sister, Adelaide, was the first wife of Friedrich-August, and mother of Amalia, Queen of Greece (wife of Otto I).

Ida was the grand-grand-mother of Sophie-Charlotte v. Oldenburg, wife of Eitel-Friedrich of Prussia, son of the Kaiser William II...

I can't find even a picture of her, so if someone could help me... Thank you!

French Royals / Re: Count and Countess de Chambord
« on: October 15, 2008, 12:00:33 PM »
Well said ! It was a shaky throne. I said Marie Therese was responsible to moud him into amore conservative than liberal prince that might handle the challenges of the nineteen century. For eample, Alfonso XII was sent to progessive England to learn about demoracy and of course military training. Chambord should have a liberal traing to take over when Naploeon III fell. Instead he wanted to return to the trappings of the old regime. I saw the hand of Marie Therese in that. Early education does effect the charecter of the person. I agree that the Polish thing is rubbish.

If you read exactly what Henri was thinking, what he wrote about politic, you will see that he wasn't this man who "wanted to return to the trappings of the old regime". Absolutely not. That, it's the black legend which the ennemies of the monarchy wanted to spread about him. And they were successfull, alas.

You're talking about Napoleon III. Well, there is something completely stypefying, which almost nobody knows.

In 1874, the Queen of Spain, Isabel II, talked to the empress Eugénie, Napoleon III's widow. And she suggested her to organize the adoption of the imperial prince, Louis-Napoleon, by the comte de Chambord.

The Queen wrote:"Here's my proposition. Monseigneur would adopt the imperial prince and would have the merit to constitute a new dynasty, which would combine the antiquity and the glory, for the happiness of France."

The empress Eugénie was quite ok.

But Henry? The reactionary, obtuse, obscurantist Henry? Of course he must have been outraged by such a dynastic heresy?

Here's what he answered to his cousin Isabel II:

"This could make definitely the happiness of France. And, whithout doing harm to my dignity, I perfectly could pass down my ancestor's heritage to this young man, who, this way, would join two conceptions which today are clashing a little. But, it's to late now, I'm too old and nobody would understand me..."

And even after this, the relationship between Eugénie and Henry remained always affectionate, up to Henry's death.

This is just a very little example. There are many others. Henry's politic writings are miles away from his cliched image... Very sad misunderstanding...

French Royals / Re: Count and Countess de Chambord
« on: October 04, 2008, 09:14:22 AM »
What does ANY of this recent stuff have to do with the Comtesse de Chambord??

A conversation on a forum is not a prison. A subject brings about another one, and so on. If you have something interessant to say about the Comtesse de Chambord, you're welcome, Excellency Professor.

The Hohenzollern / Re: Question about and/or Help with Picture(s)
« on: September 19, 2008, 03:40:31 PM »
Wonder if a colour copy exists ? We can see his fresh coloring as well.

I've never seen this picture in colour, I just know this black and white photography. It's a portrait of Ziesenis, kept in Berlin but I don't know exactly where... Stadt Schloss, probably.

French Royals / Re: Count and Countess de Chambord
« on: September 19, 2008, 03:22:21 PM »
That generation of Savoy princesses weren't as pretty as Aledaide of Savoy, mother of Louis XV....

Indeed. I don't understand why the comtesses of Provence and Artois were so ugly, because their mother Maria-Antonia of Bourbon (infante of Spain) was really lovely.

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