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Author Topic: Murder or execution?  (Read 60465 times)

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Robert_Hall

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2009, 06:05:08 PM »
It was a state execution by the Bolshevik Soviet Republic in power at the time. Simple as that. As I have said many times, the daughters and servants were just caught in the crossfire of politics.
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rosieposie

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #31 on: January 19, 2009, 06:51:11 PM »
Quote from: Robert_Hall on January 19, 2009, 06:05:08 PM
It was a state execution by the Bolshevik Soviet Republic in power at the time. Simple as that. As I have said many times, the daughters and servants were just caught in the crossfire of politics.


I agree with you Robert.  Just wondering was the original execution warrant just for Nicholas, Alexandera and Alexei? 
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Robert_Hall

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #32 on: January 19, 2009, 07:01:06 PM »
Excellent point, Rosiep... I would imagine that FA will have the  full answer, but my  take is that "everyone" was on the execution list, if there was one.. In other words,  if the staff and daughters had  not been with them, they might have been saved.
 Obviously, someone took pity on the kitchen boy.
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rosieposie

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #33 on: January 19, 2009, 07:13:26 PM »
Quote from: Robert_Hall on January 19, 2009, 07:01:06 PM
Excellent point, Rosiep... I would imagine that FA will have the  full answer, but my  take is that "everyone" was on the execution list, if there was one.. In other words,  if the staff and daughters had  not been with them, they might have been saved.
 Obviously, someone took pity on the kitchen boy.

True they did, I guess if they waited for OTAA to arrive then of course the death sentence was for all of them.
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Offline Ally Kumari

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #34 on: January 20, 2009, 02:44:52 AM »
Quote from: Robert_Hall on January 19, 2009, 06:05:08 PM
It was a state execution by the Bolshevik Soviet Republic in power at the time. Simple as that. As I have said many times, the daughters and servants were just caught in the crossfire of politics.


As much as I can see why people call it a murder, this is the most important and valid point. It was an execution. It may not have been rightful, but back then it was thought to be justified.
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RomanovsFan4Ever

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #35 on: January 20, 2009, 09:15:55 AM »
Quote from: Grand Duchess Ally on January 20, 2009, 02:44:52 AM



As much as I can see why people call it a murder, this is the most important and valid point. It was an execution. It may not have been rightful, but back then it was thought to be justified.

I'm agree.
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RomanovsFan4Ever

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #36 on: January 20, 2009, 09:23:52 AM »
And if I want to consider it as a "crime of war", would I be wrong?
However the members of the imperial family are considered martyrs of the revolution.
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Robert_Hall

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #37 on: January 20, 2009, 01:28:43 PM »
It was not a "crime of war" It was an act of the revolution.  And the Romanovs were not  "Martyrs of the revolution". They were given the  holy titles  because they died "in a Christlike manner". That is meekly, so to speak. In the faith.
 Also, IMO, Alexei would have died one way or the other in any event. I am not sure about just how much the Bolsheviks knew about his illness, but he was doomed in any case.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2009, 01:36:28 PM by Robert_Hall »
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RomanovsFan4Ever

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Re: Murder or execution?
« Reply #38 on: January 20, 2009, 02:22:00 PM »
Thank you for the answer.
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Romanov_History_Buff

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Murder or execution? Thread 2
« Reply #39 on: October 04, 2009, 04:29:14 AM »
Was what happened murder or was it a "legal" execution? Honestly IMO it was weirdly in a way BOTH. To me, what happened to the servants and OTMAA i would considered murder or killing in cold blood because they were innocent and they didn't do anything wrong. But and here's the "weird" part I do AND don't consider that N&A were not executed. I believe they made foolish mistakes and were paying for them by their own lives BUT BUT BUT considering that Nicholas did not even have a trial (not that it would most likely be a fair one even if he did get one) i consider it murder at the same time! is that confusing enough for anybody besides me myself? IMO it was more of "lynch mob" execution if it can be viewed that way even.

Okay I'll be quiet now!
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Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Murder or execution? Thread 2
« Reply #40 on: October 04, 2009, 02:05:40 PM »
Why be quiet on a discussion forum?

For me, an execution would have meant an arrest for a specific crime, a trial for a specific crime, the accused would have had a lawyer, the accused to be given a chance to disprove the case, a conviction of a specific crime, and a judicial sentence imposed and carried out.

The killings at the Impatiev house had not one of these characteristics. Jailers do not kills their prisioners, either. These killings were murders, pure and simple. That the government was involved in these murders means exactly zilch to me. There was still no judicial involvement which invalidates the whole "execution" argument.
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Romanov_History_Buff

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Re: Murder or execution? Thread 2
« Reply #41 on: October 04, 2009, 02:49:26 PM »
Quote from: LisaDavidson on October 04, 2009, 02:05:40 PM
Why be quiet on a discussion forum?
I only said "I'll be quiet now" because i felt like i was almost ranting or about to but i do agree with what you said because the whole "people still loyal to you are trying to rescue you so we have to kill you now..." just makes no sense whatever!
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RomanovMartyrs

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Re: Murder or execution? Thread 2
« Reply #42 on: October 17, 2009, 12:29:42 PM »
Simple.

If you're a Bolshevik, Communist sympathiser, or just downright cold-hearted, it's an execution. Lenin/Yurovsky, etc. all deemed it a legal execution, because they were the ones making it legal.

It was just plain murder to anyone else.
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Offline mcdnab

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Re: Murder or execution? Thread 2
« Reply #43 on: October 20, 2009, 11:31:48 AM »
I think given the quasi legal authority that their captors claimed then as the authorities who technically had a responsibility to ensure justice (as any government would) then in the case of Nicholas, his family and servants judicial murder would probably be a more accurate descrption. Murder dressed up as a legal execution by those who technically had a responsibility to uphold the law.

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Rodion_Felix

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Re: Murder or execution? Thread 2
« Reply #44 on: October 20, 2009, 01:49:54 PM »
It was both a Murder and execution. It was an execution on the Nicholas and the Alexandra and the Alexie. And murder on the daugthers and servent
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