Author Topic: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?  (Read 7576 times)

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Offline Annie

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2008, 06:12:49 AM »


No Annie, I think I've been really clear.  You argue with anyone who dares to say something or post something you don't agree with and I will give you neither the pleasure, nor the opportunity, to argue with me.  This is a published article, of interest to many and that's good enough to post.

Can I be any clearer?  It's not *always* about you, your opinion, what you believe or who you've decided to to make the next victim or your attacks...

dca

Look, this  is totally uncalled for. Of course you hold your own hatred and prejudice against me due to my stand against AA, however, there were things in this article I question because they do not make sense. Alexei was not the last Tsar. Phillipe did not 'help' Alexandra conceive a son. I question the numbers and logistics of the kills. As Harrison said 1400 in one day? You have to wonder how. I can't imagine anyone of such guarded status having the time or freedom to persue stray dogs and cats around. I'm not saying it wasn't 'interesting' I'm only questioning parts of it. Others may do the same, but since you don't dislike them, you wouldn't make an issue of it.

I am not making anyone a 'victim' and never attack anyone personally, only ideas and views. I don't want anything to be about 'me'. In fact I'd rather just be left alone and do not want to be singled out for judgement of any kind, especially not your obviously hostile and negative grudge you obviously carry.

Offline Dominic_Albanese

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #16 on: April 06, 2008, 09:14:35 AM »
Go back and read the (your) post that started this and you'll (maybe) understand my response to your "attack" (my word).  Naa, probably you won't get it.  And by the way, we actually agree on AA...It's not what your say, but often how its said.  'nuff in public - you know how to get at me in private if you feel the need to continue this...

Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #17 on: April 06, 2008, 11:38:18 AM »
Annie, I mis-read the article and I see your points.
 As for those massive animal slaughters, it is my understanding that what was not consumed by the "guests"  at the  evening meal, was given to staff,  often their only source of meat.  I have no idea what the reason was behind  shooting stray dogs & cats.  Maybe because they could not shooting the peasants?
  It was odd, on my first visit to Bulgaria,  the streets were full of stray dogs.  On my last visit, the Pope and Nato were in town, and not a dog to be seen!
 Perhaps both were a form of "animal control?
 However, we are totally off-topic here, are we not?
 
Life may not be the party we expected, but while we are here, might as well dance..

Do you want the truth, or my side of the story ?- Hank Ketchum.

Offline Sarai

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #18 on: April 06, 2008, 12:53:24 PM »
Quote
Chairman of the Third Duma Aleksander Guchkov, who received Nikolay II's abdication, openly asked: "Are we dealing with a normal, healthy individual?" But any sane person might ask such a question after learning that the Tsar killed as many as 1,400 pheasants per day, slaughtered 3,786 homeless dogs over 6 years, 6,176 cats and 20,547 crows. This was written in the Tsar's log of hunting trophies.

I have never heard this one. In addition to the fact that, as an animal lover, it would completely damage my opinion of him to know he went on rampages killing stray dogs and cats (not even counting the animals he hunted) the logistics of it do not make sense. Here we have the TSAR, a man who is basically a recluse and heavily guarded. How on earth is he supposed to slip about the city streets and open fields preying on stray dogs and cats? When? Where?


I don't think that Nicholas personally went out and killed over 3,000 dogs and 6,000 cats with his own hands. I think what this means is that perhaps he authorized their extermination by "animal control" organizations or persons, and as such he was ultimately responsible for their deaths.

Offline pandora

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #19 on: April 06, 2008, 04:55:40 PM »
Dominic, I second the "interesting article" motion. I read the article, tongue in cheek, at the obvisious faux pas. Whoever wrote that article won't be getting an "A" on that paper/article. However, I did have a few good laughs whilst reading it, so thank you for posting it.

Louise

"Interesting" to say the least...lol...never ceases to amaze me things that get published.

Offline Annie

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #20 on: April 06, 2008, 05:18:59 PM »
Annie, I mis-read the article and I see your points.

Thanks!

 
Quote
As for those massive animal slaughters, it is my understanding that what was not consumed by the "guests"  at the  evening meal, was given to staff,  often their only source of meat.  I have no idea what the reason was behind  shooting stray dogs & cats.  Maybe because they could not shooting the peasants?

I still don't see it was realistic that he was stalking around back streets and fields in search of strays. It makes no sense. As Harrison said, too, he'd have needed a machine gun to bring down that number of birds, and would there even be that many in one place?

 
Quote
It was odd, on my first visit to Bulgaria,  the streets were full of stray dogs.  On my last visit, the Pope and Nato were in town, and not a dog to be seen!

Probably either poisoned or beat them with sticks like the Greeks and the Chinese for the Olympics:( I'm sure most of them didn't live happily ever after.

Quote
Perhaps both were a form of "animal control?

Sarai suggested this too but I don't think that's it, especially not when it was said to have been the Tsar himself who did it(hope it's not true) Besides they didn't really do that back then. Nicholas was an animal lover, kept pets and mourned his dead dog. All the kids had many animals running around too, and they had their own pet food made by the cooking staff. It doesn't seem right.

 
Quote
However, we are totally off-topic here, are we not?

Not really because it's related to the article.
 
[/quote]

Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #21 on: April 06, 2008, 06:15:16 PM »
I would agree with you, Annie. Especially as the IF kept a  "private zoo" along with their pets, and the tamed deers in the park.  My own opinion, and it is JUST my opinion, is that he might have  simply looked at the poor animals as pests.  We would not look at them as that oursselves, of course. I do not know when the Russian SPCA   was founded, I suppose they they had a lot on their plate to deal with  besisdes animal care,  but would suppose it came about the same time as  the British- 1824? This was a movement that took some time to  get a hold on public attention...
 As you well know., I am a great advocate for animals, both here and in England!
 But, back to  the "Tsar"....
Life may not be the party we expected, but while we are here, might as well dance..

Do you want the truth, or my side of the story ?- Hank Ketchum.

Offline halen

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Re: News: How did the Russian Tsars die?
« Reply #22 on: April 06, 2008, 07:15:04 PM »
I think we can, for the most part, agree that the article posted by Dominic, is full of mistakes, or half truths. Not that it isn't an interesting article and worthy of us reading it (Thanks Dominic). The author of that article ain't going to be getting the Pulizter!
Horribly it is true regarding that wholesale slaughter (hunting) occured. I highly doubt that Nicholas hunted down cats and dogs, but he did love to shoot game. George Buchanan, mentions in Mission to Moscow, that the highest tally for Nicholas was 1,400 pheasants. I'm kinding thinking the author made a mistake in saying cats and dogs.

Again, this author is not going to win any awards for super investigating reporting!

Louise
There are those who look at things the way they are, and ask why... I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

When he shall die
Take him and cut him out into stars
And he shall make the face of heaven so fine
That all the world will be in love with night,