Author Topic: Princess Victoria of Schaumburg-Lippe (Moretta), 2nd daughter of Kaiser Friedrich III  (Read 217200 times)

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Offline Sebran

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Jannet_W wrote:
"of course it would behoove the family of her husband to fawn over her and bend over backwards to be nice to her"

Who and exactly what are you talking about?


Jannet_W wrote:
"Would this person fall in love with me and want to stay with me if I didn't have my wealth/title/station in life? Would he/she even deign to speak to me if I was of middle or lower income and without connections to the wealthy and/or exaulted?"

Good question, I don’t know the answer to this one. I know though that Zoubkoff before meeting Victoria was engaged with a Swedish waitress, who was younger than he was – she tragically died. His disillusion after her death might have driven him to search for love in a completely different surrounding. I don’t know, though, and I never will either.


Jannet_W wrote:
"We should all be wary of "confidence games," but those with financial assets and/or social connections need to take particular care."

I think, particularly, that those with a lot of money should live their lives in a responsible way, and try to use their wealth to help others.
A side track: Have you ever thought about where Victoria's heritage originally came from? Her and her family's wealth was the price the German people (and other peoples suffering under oppression) had to pay for having a royal family. Their possessions were the result of the unpaid work of their fellow-countrymen, spoils of war, and taxes; what we today pay in tax to help the poor etc, was then paid to help the royal family. Their richness was the direct cause of peoples suffering - just think about what their money could have done if it was evenly distributed among their people, instead of used to finance wars and gormandizing. In those days the arguments that were used to legitimate injustice, was that the King was king because God wanted him to be.


Poor Moretta, poor Alexander, poor us human beings - poor world. Who our true heroes are is difficult to know. Norms of the pasts have become lies of today. Loved leaders and heroes are now despised and their actions seen as indefensible.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2006, 12:40:31 PM by Sebran »

Offline Sebran

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The Great Hohenzollern Scandal was published in 1965.

Offline Eddie_uk

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I think, particularly, that those with a lot of money should live their lives in a responsible way, and try to use their wealth to help others.
A side track: Have you ever thought about where Victoria's heritage originally came from? Her and her family's wealth was the price the German people (and other peoples suffering under oppression) had to pay for having a royal family. Their possessions were the result of the unpaid work of their fellow-countrymen, spoils of war, and taxes; what we today pay in tax to help the poor etc, was then paid to help the royal family. Their richness was the direct cause of peoples suffering - just think about what their money could have done if it was evenly distributed among their people, instead of used to finance wars and gormandizing. In those days the arguments that were used to legitimate injustice, was that the King was king because God wanted him to be.


 ???

What an odd post.
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Offline Sebran

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I know that facts (in this case not fiction) sometimes can be unpleasant, but please, tell me. What makes it odd? Is it too liberal?  :)
« Last Edit: November 28, 2006, 03:29:33 PM by Sebran »

Offline Eddie_uk

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No, of course, you are entitled to your views! I understood it better when I read it again. Thank you :)
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Offline imperial angel

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The Great Hohenzollern Scandal was published in 1965.

So, it wasn't that removed from the events, although it was somewhat so. I was just wondering if distortions of the time, as you mentioned were in the Newspapers, would still have been prevalent to be used in this book, which was distorted. As for Victoria Moretta, she was supposed to serve a specifc role as a Prussian Princess. She was supposed to be get married and have children, with a suitable fellow royal. She also wanted this very badly, and she was the type to want this. Yet, it was thawarted. This has been many women's tragedy. But, for her it was more so because of the role she was supposed to play. Her life was a very fine one, but she shared what is a tragedy if a woman wants this and doesn't get it, that transcends class, espcially then. This, not her last marriage was the tragedy of her life, if there was one. She did have a marriage with Adolf, but it seemed not to be what she dreamed of, and she didn't have children, although I suppose their marriage was happy as royal marriages go.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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I think Moretta would have been happy had she been blessed by children. As her husband died early, she was like a ship without a port, someone without direction in life.  :(

Offline imperial angel

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I guess her royal role didn't give her that much direction because in those days, as I said the role of female royalty was to marry and have children. As far as I know, there was no public duties or anything for a princess like Moretta in Prussia. So, she may not have found her role that way. Unlike her mother, she wasn't overly intellectual, and she doesn't seem to have had any great hobby or interest that might have given her direction.

Offline Sebran

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I think Moretta would have been happy had she been blessed by children. As her husband died early, she was like a ship without a port, someone without direction in life.  :(

How sad that she needed a man to help her direct her life. Luckily women of today are more independent, and many men less oppressive.
-------------------------------------

Here is an interesting article (two pages) from Nov 5 1929 about Victoria's death. The author has chooses to portray both Mr. and Mrs Zoubkoff in the usual way, describing Mr. Zoubkoff as former gigolo and pimp and and giving him a fake identity as "the son of a cobbler". I wonder where he got all information about Zoubkoff's background, from a time when he was known by few, from...  So far so good. Then he chose to go against the stream and write that Moretta died at a hospital and that her sister was by her side. He also writes about things written in Mrs. Zoubkoff's diary. I wonder where he got hold of the diary?

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,738114,00.html

« Last Edit: November 29, 2006, 03:37:42 PM by Sebran »

Offline imperial angel

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Yes, she did need a man to fulfill her, but that seems to have been her personality. The times she lived in encouraged it, and so did her position. Beyond that, she was that type of woman who may no longer exist, but the kind that wants marriage andd children to give them direction, like Princess Diana was at first, until she found another direction. Moretta's mother was not the type to rely on men that much, I don't think. She was more independent minded, but Moretta was never much of that.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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True...But one must remember Vicky had a very intellectual father who encourage her to be herself and interest in the arts. Vicky tried the same advice on her daughters (especially Sophie. Read her letters to her. Very interesting) with little success...Alas !  :(

Offline grandduchessella

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I guess her royal role didn't give her that much direction because in those days, as I said the role of female royalty was to marry and have children. As far as I know, there was no public duties or anything for a princess like Moretta in Prussia. So, she may not have found her role that way. Unlike her mother, she wasn't overly intellectual, and she doesn't seem to have had any great hobby or interest that might have given her direction.

From 1895 (for how many years I don't know) Adolf was named Regent upon the death of the Prince of Lippe-Detmald since the Prince's brother was mad. I imagine this gave them some public duties.
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Offline Eric_Lowe

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Yes...Tragically, just as Moretta was able to sink her teeth into the role, it was awarded to another relative. She did had tough luck.  :(

Offline Sebran

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Yes...Tragically, just as Moretta was able to sink her teeth into the role, it was awarded to another relative. She did had tough luck.  :(

Gratuitous as it is when people inherit official positions, maybe it was good luck, if it is true (as have been suggested here) - that Moretta "wasn't overtly intellectual".

Offline grandduchessella

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It was Adolf who was responsible for the decisions so it would be his intellect (and he seems to have been solid if not an intellectual) that was important--and that was probably less important than just being capable and dutiful. Moretta would've been used to carry out the more ceremonial duties and there doesn't seem to be anything to suggest that she wasn't fit for this role. There was family in-fighting over who should be the Regent that led to the problems, not a lacking on Adolf or Moretta's part.
They also serve who only stand and wait--John Milton
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