Author Topic: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov  (Read 125011 times)

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Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #285 on: November 20, 2011, 04:07:49 PM »
From Greg King's book, it was suggested that she was "violated" on the train...
Why does than not surprise me? I guess that was  after the Rus suggestion.

Sorry?
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Offline blessOTMA

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #286 on: November 20, 2011, 08:21:38 PM »
Quote
author=Janet  Ashton link=topic=11769.msg498584#msg498584 date=1321826869]
Sorry?

I'm referring to another  suggestion of assault...that the girls were violated on the Rus. The  testimony of thier male servant was used...about how the girl's state room door was left unlocked...but his words " however they were left in peace " were omitted... also in another book, it was  suggested  Grand Duke Sergei violated Dimity P. So I'm alluding to a history of  assault suggestions  based on next to nothing ...which I suggest is to juice up the text .

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Offline Sarushka

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #287 on: November 20, 2011, 09:47:54 PM »
So I'm alluding to a history of  assault suggestions  based on next to nothing ...which I suggest is to juice up the text .

As far as I know there is no history of such suggestions -- Eric was referring to the (alleged) Rus incident but misremembered the time and venue. To my knowledge there is no suggestion in FOTR that Olga was accosted on a train.

Which book has the allusion to GDs Sergei and Dmitry? I'm unaware of that one.
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Offline Sarushka

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #288 on: November 20, 2011, 09:52:38 PM »
Which book has the allusion to GDs Sergei and Dmitry? I'm unaware of that one.

Actually, please don't answer that here -- we're straying off topic.

To continue this train of thought, please let's shift to a more relevant thread dealing directly with Greg King's books.
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Offline Sunny

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #289 on: November 21, 2011, 03:04:14 AM »
Sarah, in which thread exactly i can answer? i've a guess for the train thing. Thanks.
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Offline blessOTMA

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #290 on: November 21, 2011, 09:30:41 AM »
Which book has the allusion to GDs Sergei and Dmitry? I'm unaware of that one......] Actually, please don't answer that here -- we're straying off topic.
the question was asked  and remains here on this thread...the answer is

"The Court of the Last Tsar: Pomp, Power and Pageantry in the Reign of Nicholas II "

page 80

move it all where you will =)

"Give my love to all who remember me."

  Olga Nikolaevna

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #291 on: November 21, 2011, 11:11:50 AM »
I know Olga's diary stops abruptly on 15 March 1917, but there's one thing that's not clear to me: did she simply stop making entries after the revolution, or were the post-revolutionary pages removed from the diary?

I believe she just stopped, because after the last entry on March 15th, there seems to just be an empty page. Of course we will never know for sure, but I have a feeling that it was indeed her last entry.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #292 on: November 21, 2011, 11:23:25 AM »
Which book has the allusion to GDs Sergei and Dmitry? I'm unaware of that one......] Actually, please don't answer that here -- we're straying off topic.
the question was asked  and remains here on this thread...the answer is

"The Court of the Last Tsar: Pomp, Power and Pageantry in the Reign of Nicholas II "

page 80

move it all where you will =)

Yes, this is true, it says that there was a rumor that Sergei sexually molested Dimitri, "“…there were rumors that his [Sergei’s] young nephew Dimitri Pavlovich has fallen victim to his sexual appetite…. “ p. 80.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #293 on: November 21, 2011, 11:28:18 AM »
I don't read Russian, so I put one of the earlier links to 1917 diaries/letters into Google Translate (http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Femalkrest.narod.ru%2Ftxt%2Fdet17.htm) At the bottom of the page is Olga's last entry and then:

"The last entry, then ripped out pages of the diary."


I will double check on my photocopies of the original diary to make sure!

Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #294 on: November 21, 2011, 06:05:27 PM »
Which book has the allusion to GDs Sergei and Dmitry? I'm unaware of that one......] Actually, please don't answer that here -- we're straying off topic.
the question was asked  and remains here on this thread...the answer is

"The Court of the Last Tsar: Pomp, Power and Pageantry in the Reign of Nicholas II "

page 80

move it all where you will =)

What is the basis of your claim that this is "based on next to nothing" and added to "spice up the text" in a book where I'd think it pretty uninportant? Have you researched the topic? Are you planning a work on Serge or Dmitri? Have you consulted anyone who is?

I'm sorry that this is off-topic; perhaps the relevant posts might be moved to the book's thread, as I don't really feel a need to discuss your other claims about these alleged assaults; I honestly think your posts have done their own work.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2011, 06:09:03 PM by Janet Ashton »
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Offline Sunny

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #295 on: November 22, 2011, 12:49:03 AM »
Which book has the allusion to GDs Sergei and Dmitry? I'm unaware of that one......] Actually, please don't answer that here -- we're straying off topic.
the question was asked  and remains here on this thread...the answer is

"The Court of the Last Tsar: Pomp, Power and Pageantry in the Reign of Nicholas II "

page 80

move it all where you will =)
I did not know about it because i don't have the book; but i remembered that also Kurth mentioned the rumor about the train rape (not only for poor Olga: for all three of them) in Tsar: the lost world, page 190 in my tranlslated edition. But he points out it was a rumor - as Bless said, maybe this idea came from the Rus rumors.
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Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #296 on: November 22, 2011, 03:24:24 PM »
Olga's "alleged" train rape was in Greg King's last book before the Anastasia/ Anna Anderson book.

Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #297 on: November 23, 2011, 12:23:09 PM »
Olga's "alleged" train rape was in Greg King's last book before the Anastasia/ Anna Anderson book.


His last book before the "Anastasia/Anna Anderson" book (which isn't a "Greg King" book as such, but a collaboration with Penny Wilson; I have pointed out before that you shouldn't overlook co-authors because they happen to be women) was "A Season of Splendor". About the court of Caroline Astor. So I guess Olga must have taken a mysterious and forgotten trip to New York to be violated.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 12:25:55 PM by Janet Ashton »
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Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #298 on: November 23, 2011, 01:16:49 PM »
Which book has the allusion to GDs Sergei and Dmitry? I'm unaware of that one......] Actually, please don't answer that here -- we're straying off topic.
the question was asked  and remains here on this thread...the answer is

"The Court of the Last Tsar: Pomp, Power and Pageantry in the Reign of Nicholas II "

page 80

move it all where you will =)
I did not know about it because i don't have the book; but i remembered that also Kurth mentioned the rumor about the train rape (not only for poor Olga: for all three of them) in Tsar: the lost world, page 190 in my tranlslated edition. But he points out it was a rumor - as Bless said, maybe this idea came from the Rus rumors.

Thanks for taking the time and trouble to check this out; other posters should do the same before firing off their posts.
Peter Kurth is referring to information about the behaviour of the guards on the Rus first published by Edvard Radzinsky in his "Last Tsar". His book and Radzinsky's both came out long before the discussion in "Fate of Romanovs" to which the poster named "BlessOTMA" apparently refers. Kurth has mixed up the context, and he doesn't quite say it was a rumour; he says "no one knows" what really happened. His and Radzinsky's works - and Kurth discussed questions of sexual assault in his book on Anna Anderson as well, I believe - both go to show that alleged assaults had been widely discussed years before Fate of the Romanovs appeared and examined the question to widespread hysteria and misrepresentation. 
Shake your chains to earth like dew
Which in sleep had fallen on you -
Ye are many; they are few.

Offline blessOTMA

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Re: 1913 Diary of Grand Duchess Olga Nikolaievna, transl. by Marina Petrov
« Reply #299 on: November 23, 2011, 03:12:22 PM »
"  the poster named "BlessOTMA" 
lol   That strikes me as funny....however you slice and dice it....made up sexual assault would  seem to be needed for modern  publication...and a number of authors are ready to provide....Indeed, in  FOTR on pages 140-141, King and Wilson  work mightly to create  the impression there was rape ....amazing  how the attacking soldiers  some how missed all the jewels in the girl's corsets .

"Give my love to all who remember me."

  Olga Nikolaevna