Author Topic: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated  (Read 294026 times)

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Offline Carolath Habsburg

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #675 on: December 30, 2009, 10:01:49 PM »
Pavlov, i ve thought exactly like yuo.. i always thought that in later years Alexandra suffered of some mental  illlnesss...can that be possible?

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Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #676 on: February 26, 2010, 10:55:34 PM »
I think that Alexandra's treatment of Ella was really nasty. I am referring to the last meeting they had, when she virtually threw her own sister out of the palace. Prinsess Yussoupov recieved the same treatment. This is definately not the behaviour of a normal person, is it ? Both of them went there with the best intentions in the world, and were treated abominably.
Typical of Alexandra. I think she went a bit mental in the end.   

Alexandra was always convinced that she was right about everything. this made her very difficult to deal with. I think she was more than "a bit mental". She obviously had some kind of personality disorder, and this turned out to be very unfortunate for both her marriage and for Russia.

Grand Duchess Elizabeth, who was largely responsible for Alix marrying Nicky, was treated horribly by her sister for some time.

Offline macristo

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #677 on: January 08, 2011, 06:58:56 PM »

First of all, I want to apologize because English is not my native language. Secondly, it seems that this subject is abandoned. But, as I discovered it a few days ago, I would like to write my comments. I am really shocked by the title of the link, how can a person who does not know another one "hate" her. You can like her or not. Concerning the specific case of Alexandra, I think she had virtues and defaults, as everyone of us.
"She was depressive and shy": may be if she would have known Prozac, as many of us, she would have been a better Tsarina, wife, mother, etc, etc.  But she didn't.
"She was obsessed with the health of his son": I wonder what would any of you had done if you had a boy who is lying in bed, bleeding, whose cries of pain were listened through the whole palace, a boy who could die at any moment, a boy who says to you "Mammy, I want to die because the pain is too hard".
“She was THE reason of the Russian Revolution”: my God!!!!! What a plain idea!!!! Take a book, read a little, as we say in Spanish “books don’t bite”!!!
We cannot understand the attitudes of people of other times, other countries, other cultures, other origins, they are different to us.
As in the case of Marie-Antoinette and Louis XVI, I think that it is very easy to say what they should have done, when you know the end of the story. Living the moment is not that easy. They were not better or worse than other kings of their time, they just were in the wrong place, in the wrong moment. And they knew how to die, with dignity and honor. We should have more pity and respect when speaking about people who paid such a big price for their mistakes.
And last, but not least, I find the attitude of King George of England towards his “dear cousin Nicky” one of extraordinary cowardice and lack of honor. “He betrayed his cousin with a kiss”.

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #678 on: January 08, 2011, 10:18:40 PM »

First of all, I want to apologize because English is not my native language. Secondly, it seems that this subject is abandoned. But, as I discovered it a few days ago, I would like to write my comments. I am really shocked by the title of the link, how can a person who does not know another one "hate" her. You can like her or not. Concerning the specific case of Alexandra, I think she had virtues and defaults, as everyone of us.
"She was depressive and shy": may be if she would have known Prozac, as many of us, she would have been a better Tsarina, wife, mother, etc, etc.  But she didn't.
"She was obsessed with the health of his son": I wonder what would any of you had done if you had a boy who is lying in bed, bleeding, whose cries of pain were listened through the whole palace, a boy who could die at any moment, a boy who says to you "Mammy, I want to die because the pain is too hard".
“She was THE reason of the Russian Revolution”: my God!!!!! What a plain idea!!!! Take a book, read a little, as we say in Spanish “books don’t bite”!!!
We cannot understand the attitudes of people of other times, other countries, other cultures, other origins, they are different to us.
As in the case of Marie-Antoinette and Louis XVI, I think that it is very easy to say what they should have done, when you know the end of the story. Living the moment is not that easy. They were not better or worse than other kings of their time, they just were in the wrong place, in the wrong moment. And they knew how to die, with dignity and honor. We should have more pity and respect when speaking about people who paid such a big price for their mistakes.
And last, but not least, I find the attitude of King George of England towards his “dear cousin Nicky” one of extraordinary cowardice and lack of honor. “He betrayed his cousin with a kiss”.


Hi, Macristo: I share 100% your opinions about Alix. She was a person with his virtues and defaults, like all of us, and the Fact.  she had her own political views and doesn’t agree with the political correct ideas that are accepted today by all people doesn’t mean she had a mental illness or something. We must also think that her behavior toward Alexei hemophilia is the common thing among parents of children suffering from  this awful sickness. Just read scientific publications about the issue. Alix was not an exception on it.

She also fighted for her girls were not contaminated by the depravation and decadence who was hitting Russian aristocracy. She wanted them fresh, innocent ( Beware! innocents doesn’t meant “idiots”) and responsible. I’m always amazed for she is criticized when trying to educate her children far from frivolity and living them some responsibilities. Some people relieves she was an hysterical woman for she brought her older daughters to work as nurses when the war began…They thinks that so young girls must be dancing and having fun rather than being confronted to badly wounded men   , bloody bodies and so on.

Alix had her defaults…who doubts it? But my opinion is that she was one of the less guilty of the Bursa of Revolution in Russia: Kyrill, the Yussupovs and other noblemen and women with a scandalous life, while Russian people was dying at the front, were, by far, more guilty of Revolution than Alix. She ignored a lot  of political issues, and believed that all things depends on our own will; she was rather ingenuous. But she was a righteous, honest Tsaritsa, and I think she deserves to be respected for it.

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Offline RHB

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #679 on: January 08, 2011, 10:26:26 PM »
I couldn't agree more! Was Alix a little too overprotective of OTMA... maybe but at the same time with how things seemed to have been going in Russia that wasn't so much of a bad thing! She had her reasons for doing the things she did (or even didn't do) I wouldn't doubt! It's always been my opinion on the saying "People judge what they just don't understand"... that it's not that people can't understand different people but they just don't WANT to!
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Offline Selencia

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #680 on: January 29, 2011, 02:35:16 AM »
I can understand why some people think that if Nicholas hadn't married Alexandra then perhaps things would have been different. Her as Empress really didn't help the situations and she was very close minded in her views. She was right and everyone else was wrong; and both her and Nicholas refused to accept change. Yes they were good parents, but they had another job to do which they did not live up to.

Offline PAVLOV

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #681 on: March 30, 2011, 06:28:12 AM »
If only she had not been so arrogant, and listened to advice given to her by so many people, including her own family, things may have turned out differently.

I recently read the King / Wilson book, which is crammed with very well researched details of the time leading up to the murder.

Right up until the end, in fact seconds before she died, she had attitude.  I remain firmly convinced that she had major emotional problems, and her attitude to the outside world was definately the result of her condition.

I think she was a very unhappy woman with many unresolved issues.

Perhaps, as mentioned, if they had Prozac in those days, things would have been different.
I have also read that if Hitler had popped 1 Lithium tablet every morning, the 2nd World War may not have happened.

We will never know. 

 

Offline TimM

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #682 on: March 30, 2011, 10:42:24 AM »
Alix was a worried mother with a sick child.  I can't even imagine what she was feeling.
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Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #683 on: March 30, 2011, 10:38:04 PM »
Alix was a worried mother with a sick child.  I can't even imagine what she was feeling.

Good said, Tim!

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Offline Kalafrana

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #684 on: March 31, 2011, 03:25:06 AM »
It's more complicated than that. Alexandra was already self righteous and convinced only she was right long before Alexei was born. The strain of having Alexei made these traits worse, but did not cause them.

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #685 on: March 31, 2011, 08:13:31 AM »
I agree with Ann.

Alexandra began her self righteous journey when she began to write in Nicholas's diaries even before the death of Alexander III or the wedding.

Offline Terence

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #686 on: March 31, 2011, 07:38:19 PM »
I agree with Ann.

Alexandra began her self righteous journey when she began to write in Nicholas's diaries even before the death of Alexander III or the wedding.

What is the source for that?  Sorry to show my ignorance, I've never heard of that.
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Offline bestfriendsgirl

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #687 on: March 31, 2011, 08:09:27 PM »
I first read of in in N and A, but it's been mentioned other places too.

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #688 on: March 31, 2011, 10:52:48 PM »
In every biography that I have read about Alexandra, she always begins her "helpful" comments in Nicholas's diaries in Walton on Thames when they visited Victoria and Louis in the summer after the engagement in Darmstadt.

At Livadia in the month that Alexander III died, she gave Nicholas the advice to have the ministers come to him first and not his mother.  She said (and I paraphrase) that they must remember who Nicholas is and will be.

I also remember that she quoted Marie Corelli in Nicholas's diary during the Walton on Thames visit.  "For the past is past and will never return.  The future we not.  Only the present may be called our own." 

That of course if nothing more than a romantic thought from a love sick girl to her fiance, ( some think she was forgiving him for his "little affair" with Mathilde Kschessinska) but she went on after that and wrote a lot more.  A lot of it was advice on how to act and how to react to others in his role of Tsarevich and then Tsar.

All of that was way before she could be excused for being the mother of a hemophiliac son.  Actually about 10 years before.

Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: Alexandra - Slandered and Hated
« Reply #689 on: April 01, 2011, 04:19:33 PM »

At Livadia in the month that Alexander III died, she gave Nicholas the advice to have the ministers come to him first and not his mother.  She said (and I paraphrase) that they must remember who Nicholas is and will be.

Please quote where she tells him to have ministers come to him not his mother. Are you saying that Marie Feodorovna was receiving ministers at Livadia in 1894 in lieu of the Heir?

I also remember that she quoted Marie Corelli in Nicholas's diary during the Walton on Thames visit.  "For the past is past and will never return.  The future we not.  Only the present may be called our own."  

That of course if nothing more than a romantic thought from a love sick girl to her fiance, ( some think she was forgiving him for his "little affair" with Mathilde Kschessinska) but she went on after that and wrote a lot more.  A lot of it was advice on how to act and how to react to others in his role of Tsarevich and then Tsar.

Quote, please, this "lot of advice".

All of that was way before she could be excused for being the mother of a hemophiliac son.  Actually about 10 years before.

Hopefully history isn't about making excuses for people. I detest the way people try to reduce women in particular to being nothing more than a parent (I don't mean that you are saying this, either!)

« Last Edit: April 01, 2011, 04:22:43 PM by Janet Ashton »
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