Author Topic: Nikolai Tyrova? A Short Lesson in Russian  (Read 8580 times)

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Offline G_Lermontov

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Nikolai Tyrova? A Short Lesson in Russian
« on: August 05, 2008, 02:02:26 AM »
My knowledge of the Russian language is near zero.  I've been listening to a couple of different audio files (Nicholas II being introduced by a Russian army officer and the canonization ceremony in Moscow in 2000), and in both, he is clearly referred to as something approximating "Nikolai Tyrova".  I've tried online Russian English dictionaries, but nothing is coming up.  I'm probably transliterating it wrong.  It's probably something simple, but I've tried looking up the Russian word for "the second" or "two", and they don't sound like "tyrova".  Any ideas what "tyrova" means?

« Last Edit: April 26, 2009, 03:58:29 PM by Alixz »

Offline Helen

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2008, 03:58:32 AM »
They probably said 'Николай Второго', which is the genitive of 'Николай Второй' (Nicholas the Second). The first and third 'o' in 'Второго' are unstressed, which in the Russian language means they are pronounced differently and may sound more like an 'а' than an 'o'. The 'г' in word endings like '-ого' is also pronounced differently than at the beginning of a word.  English is not my native language, but I guess 'Второго' may sound like 'vtyrova', 'vtarova', or something similar to American or British people if the initial 'В' ('v') in 'Второго' is pronounced less clearly.
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Offline Svetabel

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2008, 04:05:02 AM »
In Russian Nicholas the Second sounds like " Ni-ko-lai Vto-roi". The genitive of " Ni-ko-lai Vto-roi" sounds like "Ni-ko-laya Vto-ro-go". Probably you've heard "Vtoroi" as Tyrova.

Offline nena

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2008, 08:55:26 AM »
Genitive in Russian---isn't you use it when we want to say from anybody? Example: nominative means name of person,or object;

nominative: Nikolai
genitivive: from/od Nikolaya

Am I correct?
I think in Russian there is 6 changes of a name--I don't know English word of that -nominative, genitiv, dative, acusative, etc.,. Names came from Latin language, I guess; nomen-name...
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Offline Helen

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2008, 12:03:24 PM »
Yes, you are right: the second case is the genitive or possessive case.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive)
« Last Edit: August 05, 2008, 12:05:00 PM by Helen »
"The Correspondence of the Empress Alexandra of Russia with Ernst Ludwig and Eleonore, Grand Duke and Duchess of Hesse. 1878-1916"  -  http://www.bod.de/index.php?id=296&objk_
"Grand Duke Ernst Ludwig and Princess Alix of Hesse and by Rhine in Italy - 1893"

Offline Romanov_Fan19

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2008, 04:42:42 PM »
G_Lermontov ,
Tell Me where did you see his Canonization who was involved Clergy ect ect and is there some form of Sermon

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2008, 06:00:51 PM »
Yes, genitive in Russian denotes possession. For example, "Ipatiev's house" is expressed literally in Russian as "the house of ipatiev." But the word "of" doesn't exist in Russian, so the ending of "Ipatiev" changes to the genitive case to show ownership: "dom Ipatieva."
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Offline G_Lermontov

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2008, 09:41:35 PM »
Thanks for all your help, everyone.  I believe it was the genitive of Nicholas the Second that I heard.

Quote
G_Lermontov ,
Tell Me where did you see his Canonization who was involved Clergy ect ect and is there some form of Sermon

Unfortunately, I only saw about a minute of the canonization ceremony.  Here is the youtube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rl7VnQeu8OQ

It's at the very end of the video.  The majority of the clip is a collection of (sometimes graphic) images of the murder in Ekaterinburg from various films, so be warned.

If someone wanted to translate exactly what is said at the end, it would be pretty awesome... 

Offline nena

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #8 on: August 06, 2008, 07:39:54 AM »
Different versions: Dom Ipatieva, also can be trsnslated as Home of Ipatievs-in English.
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Offline Ilias_of_John

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Re: Very simple (possibly dumb) Russian language question: Nikolai Tyrova?
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2008, 01:48:01 AM »
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rl7VnQeu8OQ
It's at the very end of the video.  The majority of the clip is a collection of (sometimes graphic) images of the murder in Ekaterinburg from various films, so be warned."

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« Last Edit: August 19, 2008, 01:51:28 AM by Ilias_of_John »
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Offline Превед

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Re: Nikolai Tyrova? A Short Lesson in Russian
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2013, 02:00:26 PM »
It would be good pedagogy to refer to Russian sovereigns like this:

Nikoláy Pérviy (NI)
Nikoláy Vtoróy (NII)
Aleksándr Trétiy (AIII)
Iván Chetvyórtiy (Ivan Grózhniy / the Terrible IV)
Pyotr Velíkiy (Peter the Great)
Yekaterína Vtoráya / Velíkaya (Catherine the Second / the Great)

It really shows that Russian, as an Indo-European language, is not that alien. E.g. первий / perviy has the same p-r combo as Latin primus. четвёртый / chetvyórtiy the same q/k>ch - t - r combo as Latin quartus.
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