Author Topic: Tatiana & Cleopatra  (Read 53956 times)

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Tania

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #90 on: November 16, 2005, 12:02:43 PM »
LOL, as the old adage goes, 'never judge a book by it's cover', that is the same with people, the world over.

My mother's grandfather was 6'2 I believe, blue-eyed, blonde, and from Spain. Most people think people from Spain are dark complected, but as people areand certainly around the world, they are varied in every way.

But Cleo certainly had a brain and then some, didn't she?

Tatiana


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I do want to make it clear--I singled out Tatiana and Marie in particular, but Olga and Anastasia were also beautiful girls--and I agree, if they had not been so tragically murdered, I'm sure all 4 of them would have become really stunning beauties--they were certainly well on their way already!! And about Cleopatra--I agree we may never know her actual coloring, but as someone of mostly Greek ancestry she did indeed most likely have dark hair and eyes and olive skin (I went to the Greek Festival at the nearest Greek Orthodox Church a couple of weeks ago--I go every year altho I (regrettably!) have no Greek ancestry--and most of the hosts there are of Greek descent--and most of them are olive-complected brunettes--good-looking too I might add!!). I've also heard that Cleopatra likely had a few other bits of ancestry in addition to the (mostly) Greek-for example I believe she had a grandmother (?) who was a Syrian--and I would think a Syrian princess most likely would be a brunette! And as several have said--Cleopatra's main attraction was not a "perfect" face. The ancient (translated!!) descriptions I've read of Cleopatra emphasize her grace, her wonderful sense of style, a very lovely speaking voice, enormous charm and remarkable intelligence and education (she spoke for example numerous languages, fluently, including Egyptian--believe it or not, she was the first and only Ptolomaic ruler of Egypt who EVER BOTHERED to learn Egyptian!!!!) Cleo was not your classic beauty, but she was SMART and she had apparently an irresistible charm when she chose. Finally *pause for breath* I keep forgetting to watch HBO's "Rome" but what I've seen is good--would love to see their version of the Queen of the Nile!!!!  ;D


elfwine

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #91 on: November 16, 2005, 06:35:08 PM »
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I have to say that DON'T watch the movie with Eleonora Verela in it. This movie is SO incorract and bad!
It's an insulting for Cleopatra. In this movie they played her as a dumb woman  :P. And Cleopatra was not dumb!

Robbie???
What movie are you talking about?
I was referring to an HBO series - called ROME...Which is more historically accurate than the famous Liz Taylor flick!
And, while Cleo - in this series is only briefly in the main story...she is -- well-- not dumb...unusual...but not dumb.


elf

Offline RealAnastasia

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #92 on: November 16, 2005, 06:54:25 PM »
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I do understand that Cleopatera's people were GREEK but they had been in Egypt for quite some time - so anyone with pale white skin would certainly be at a disatvantage ...

PS All my helenic friends, male and female, are all very olive complected...for which they are greatly envied by many.

rs
PPS: Is anyone here watching the HBO series ROME? Rather an interesting Cleo in that one!

 ;)


Greek people are both, olive and blonde complected, since they have many different provinces. As well as in America, were there is rosy-skin people, black people and olie-skin people. There is the same in Italy, Spain , Argentina, etc...Generally, in Greece and Italy, the people who lives in North provinces are blonde (or reddish-haired) and the others who lived in the South are black haired, blck-eyed. This is not a general rule, however...Cleopatra 's family came from Macedonia, in te North of Greece, where people could have red hair and blue eyes. This was the case of the famous Mehmet Alí, the man who ruled Egypt in the XIX Century and modernized it. He was actually a Macedonian, with blonde hair and blue eyes.

And yes, the Ptolomés were in Egypt since many, many years,but they married between them, as noblepeople usually does, so they couldn't have so many "local blood" in their bodies. Besides, Egyptians that didn't belonged to the Imperial Family but were socialy well positioned, wanted to be light-skinned, as their rulers. You may easily notice it seeing the paintings that the Egyptians udes to put over the mummies (portraits of the dead)...In the paintings, there is light-skinned people...But if an anthropologic expert perform a test on the dead bodies, they discoveres that these people were really classical Egyptians, with African features.  ::)

RealAnastasia.

Offline Robby

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #93 on: November 17, 2005, 05:23:12 AM »
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Robbie???
What movie are you talking about?
I was referring to an HBO series - called ROME...Which is more historically accurate than the famous Liz Taylor flick!
And, while Cleo - in this series is only briefly in the main story...she is -- well-- not dumb...unusual...but not dumb.


elf


I dont mean the HBO movie...

And Cleopatra (ancestors) came from Macedonia (Sp?) to.
“Courage! I have shown it for years; think you I shall lose it at the moment when my sufferings are to end?” Marie Antoinette

Russian_Duchess_#5

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #94 on: November 17, 2005, 10:03:30 AM »
This subject makes me cringe, I mean, REALLY!! ::)
But, it seems that others believe that Tatiana would seduce gaurds innocently...if you saw Nicholas and Alexandra, the movie from 1971, Tatiana reveals herself to a gaurd.  :o Totally inaccurate!!

Sofi :)

Offline Romanov_fan

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #95 on: November 17, 2005, 10:10:32 AM »
 we don't know what she looked like, we can only speculate about things in biographies. Having read a few Cleopatra biographies, I think most say she was not the sexy temptress of legend. However, we don't want to come full circle and say she was ugly either.Of course, there is a meduim. ;)

Offline Margarita Markovna

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #96 on: November 17, 2005, 01:32:24 PM »
Yea...I don't think she was ugly but the truth is, we will never know. I don't think it's even likely to ever find her mummy.

Offline Robby

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #97 on: November 17, 2005, 02:00:54 PM »
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Yea...I don't think she was ugly but the truth is, we will never know. I don't think it's even likely to ever find her mummy.


Cleopatra's mummy is in the sea  ;).
“Courage! I have shown it for years; think you I shall lose it at the moment when my sufferings are to end?” Marie Antoinette

Offline Margarita Markovna

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #98 on: November 17, 2005, 02:33:34 PM »
Well it hasn't actually been located, I believe, but the chances are high it's in the sea. And the sea...let's just say it doesn't help preserve the mummy. ;)

Offline Robby

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #99 on: November 17, 2005, 02:40:53 PM »
Yup. I really don't think water preserve the body of Queen Cleopatra VII. Still wanted to know we're her children are: Cleopatra Selena, Ptolemues, and Caesarion.
“Courage! I have shown it for years; think you I shall lose it at the moment when my sufferings are to end?” Marie Antoinette

elfwine

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #100 on: November 17, 2005, 07:04:14 PM »
I agree - Tatiana was not a seductress or a spy.

   I really think that -other than the fact that both individuals were human beings and females- there's no other real connection between Cleopatera VII and Tatiana Nicholevna.

Offline Robby

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #101 on: November 18, 2005, 03:33:45 AM »
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I agree - Tatiana was not a seductress or a spy.

    I really think that -other than the fact that both individuals were human beings and females- there's no other real connection between Cleopatera VII and Tatiana Nicholevna.


Can't agree more!!
“Courage! I have shown it for years; think you I shall lose it at the moment when my sufferings are to end?” Marie Antoinette

Offline Romanov_fan

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #102 on: November 18, 2005, 10:18:51 AM »
When it all boils down to it, there is little connection. The chracters of these women were much different. Tatiana was reserved while Cleopatra was emotional and so on. In looks, Tatiana was exotic, and we will never be sure of the real face of Cleopatra, hidden behind History.What would either of these royal women think of this thread ;)

catt.sydney

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #103 on: November 19, 2005, 03:40:47 PM »
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I cannot locate any pictures of Cleo (with her weird pixie haircut) from ROME at the HBO ROME website...only pictures of her in a ceremonial wig! ARRRRG! :-X

It is a good image to compare with photos of Tatianna in short hair, though  - I agree.
Can anyone else locate the HBO ROME Cleo (wigless) pictures?


Hello,
   I must agree with Elfwine - the images of the young girl playing Cleopatra VII on ROME and the photos of Tatyanna with her hair cropped are remarkable. But these physical similarities are only similarities!
   I don't think that Tatyanna was in any way trying to seduce anyone or attempting to act as a spy ...The scene from N&A was simply a dramatic contrivance.
Remember not everything in a film is always meant to be factual.

call me catt

Offline Robby

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Re: Tatiana & Cleopatra
« Reply #104 on: December 07, 2005, 04:31:11 AM »
GREAT NEWS

Queen Cleopatra VII did not comitted suicide, throug a snakebite, nor a cup with poison water.
She has been murdred by Octavian (Later Emperor Augustus).

Pat Brown solved the case of Cleopatra.

Cleopatra was 39 at the time of her death.
“Courage! I have shown it for years; think you I shall lose it at the moment when my sufferings are to end?” Marie Antoinette