Author Topic: Alexandra as Empress and Mother  (Read 122568 times)

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Bob_the_builder

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #195 on: May 19, 2007, 07:29:03 PM »
Quote
it sounds weird that she'd let them in to see their brother when he could die at any moment.

I disagree. I don't think it would be appropriate for Alexandra to hide how truly horrible his disease was from her children, so it seems natural in my opinion that she would allow them to see Alexei at his worst.

TheAce1918

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #196 on: May 19, 2007, 09:47:26 PM »
I don't think it would be appropriate for Alexandra to hide how truly horrible his disease was from her children, so it seems natural in my opinion that she would allow them to see Alexei at his worst.

I think the girls knew how serious Aleksey's condition was, especially after Spala.

Bob_the_builder

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #197 on: May 20, 2007, 12:51:21 AM »
I don't think it would be appropriate for Alexandra to hide how truly horrible his disease was from her children, so it seems natural in my opinion that she would allow them to see Alexei at his worst.

I think the girls knew how serious Aleksey's condition was, especially after Spala.
I do as well. They would have to be deaf, dumb, and blind not to hear poor little Alexei screaming. I'd like to think they were right there next to him comforting him until the arrival of Rasputin. :-\

Alixz

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #198 on: May 30, 2007, 07:27:14 AM »
Olga and David (Edward VIII later Duke of Windsor)  Hmmmmm!  How that would have changed history.  ;)

Would David still have had a wandering eye?  Or would marriage to a beautiful and savvy Russian Grand Duchess have made him quite content.

I wonder if this marriage would have been accepted by parliament.  After all, Victoria was gone and so was Edward VII.  I am sure that Kaiser Wilhelm II would not have been "amused".

Olga would have had to change her religion as her mother had before her.  It would have been a reversal of roles in one generation!  Would Alexandra have allowed it and would Olga have accepted it....   Hmmmmm    :-\

TheAce1918

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #199 on: May 30, 2007, 10:09:15 PM »
Alexandra might have supported it, and Kaiser 'Bill' would take the event with a grain of salt, I think.  And I doubt Olga would have accepted such a proposal.  England or not.  She was a patriot to her nation, and well, you simply just can't argue with that. But who knows?  ::)

Alixz

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #200 on: May 30, 2007, 10:44:55 PM »
Oh, I agree that Olga probably wouldn't have accepted the proposal.  But Kaiser Bill would not have liked an alliance of Britain and Russia through a marriage that would put a Russian Consort of the British throne.

The Kaiser always thought that his uncle King Edward VII was machinating behind his back.  This would have taken the proverbial cake.

I wonder though, since Alix had refused to marry Eddie (Albert Victor) would she have even considered sending Olga to marry David (Edward VIII)?

We know that Alix had a strong connection to Britain, some her happiest days were spent there.  But she had promised that her daughters could marry for love and if Olga did not love David, then there would be no question of the engagement coming off.

Wouldn't Queen Victoria have been proud, though.  Had she been alive to see it.   :D

Just a thought has anyone ever read in any biographies of David whether or not he ever considered Olga as suitable or if he was interested in her?  Most of what I have read concentrates on his premarital flings with married women (he was a commitment phobe) and, of course, Wallis Simpson.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2007, 10:47:43 PM by Alixz »

Offline azrael7171918

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #201 on: May 31, 2007, 05:48:06 AM »

We know that Alix had a strong connection to Britain, some her happiest days were spent there.  But she had promised that her daughters could marry for love and if Olga did not love David, then there would be no question of the engagement coming off.


Maybe it is just as well that neither Carol nor David worked out. Carol it seems had a marriage he was unhappy with and took up with a mistress. David was running around quite a bit. In fact at the time of Prince Charles marriage to the late Princess Diana the family was rather releaved that he was settling down because it was said at the time he was reminding family members of David.

So it is not just a matter of Olga accepting the marriage but if neither man was in love with her more than likely it would have become a miserable situation for everyone concerned.

Azrael

Alixz

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #202 on: May 31, 2007, 08:13:54 AM »
Oh, I agree with you.  By the turn of century, royal marriages were no longer tolerated by the wife just because of propriety.  Edward VII and Alexandra were from the old school.

George V and Queen Mary were truly in love as were George VI and Queen Elizabeth.  I have heard rumors that Prince Phillip has not been as faithful to Queen Elizabeth II.  (But I have no source just rumor.  You Brits would know more about that than I)

So I believe that Olga and any of the other daughters of Alix would not have had to marry a man she did not love or who did not love her.  The marriage requirements were changing as women began to advocate for themselves.

Bob_the_builder

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #203 on: May 31, 2007, 07:24:37 PM »
I don't think so. Alix always had her daughters' happiness in mind first.

Russophile

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #204 on: June 01, 2007, 06:51:55 PM »
IMHO, Alix wanted to keep their family together as much as possible. I would think she would have been very happy if all her daughters remained "spinsters". They seemed to be very happy in each other's company.
Very doubtful she would use them as pawns.

Offline Duke of New Jersey

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #205 on: June 01, 2007, 07:13:08 PM »
Yes, I agree with Russophile.  Alexandra would not have pushed her daughters into marriage.  I had always assumed that if they had the Russian Revolution never happened only one out of four of Alix's daughters would have married.  I don't know which one though.  There was always talk of one of them marrying Dimitri Pavolich to stay in Russia but who knows. 

There are a lot of chances of this in history:
-"The Aunts" of Louis XIV (daughters of Louis XV)
-Daughters of George III
+Others

The biggest thing would have been an inflated sense of self-importance.  Nobody would have been good enough (in their minds) for a daughter of the Tsar.  This is what happened to Marie Alexandrovna, even though she later married.  The same thing happened to the daughters of Louis XV, nobody was good enough for the daughters of the French King.  One of Louis XV's daughter did marry (Louise-Elizabeth married Philip of Spain, Duke of Parma) only because it was a way to pep up realtions with the Spainish Court. 

Maria Theresa, and Victoria to a lesser extent, were keen on using their daughters as tools of Foreign Policy.  Maria Theresa was/is quite famous (or imfamous) for that.  (But, they were by far not the only ones who did this.) 

-Duke of NJ


Offline dmitri

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #206 on: July 04, 2007, 11:43:21 AM »
I don't think Alexandra Feodorovna would have liked any of her daughters to marry at all. She controlled them so tightly. She never really let them have any freedom. I tend to feel quite sorry for them because of this. One wonders about Olga. Perhaps she might have married abroad just to be free of her Mother. We will never know. Certainly if she had married Carol I doubt that would have been very happy as he treated Helen extremely badly and ended up losing his throne to boot. An unhappy marriage to Carol though would have saved her the dreadful death in the cellar at Ekaterinburg. As to whether she would have been a carrier there is no way of knowing that. It is quite possible that none of Nicholas II and Alexandra's daughters were. Of course all of them could have been too or perhaps just one or two. There is no way of knowing. Certainly they did not all inheirit identical genes from their parents. What sibling ever does? Not all of Queen Victoria and Prince Albert's daughters were carriers. Victoria, later Empress Friedrich certainly wasn't. There is no real way of knowing about Helena as neither of her daughters ever had children. Louise never married, Alice and Beatrice were both carriers. As for Queen Victoria I doubt she would have been amused at all by her granddaughter. There is one famous letter before she died where she warned Alexandra about her inflexible attitude to the Russian people and Alexandra arrogantly replied back. Perhaps if she had listened, a habit she never learnt, she would not have ended up dead in the cellar in Ekaterinburg. Queen Victoria would have of course been deeply sad about Alexis  as she knew about her son Leopold and others within her family before her death. As for 1905 and 1917 she would not have been surprised. She always called the Russian throne unsafe. Remember she wanted Alexandra for Albert Victor, Duke of Clarence and Avondale. What a blessing for the British Monarchy that that marriage never occurred as they avoided the disease plus a woman not suited to be Tsarina or Queen anywhere. Queen Mary was a far superior choice for both British Princes. Perhaps Nicholas II might have listened to Queen Victoria thought he rarely listened to anybody. Certainly the deaths would have made her very sad. I doubt though that Queen Victoria, even though Kaiser Wilhelm II was hardly her favourite, have agreed to a war with Germany unless it had been forced on her. She was awake up to Kaiser Wilhelm II but Germany was close to her heart. All so many ifs. Perhaps Queen Victoria would have ensured all the Romanov Grand Duchesses married abroad just to escape Russia and its chronic instability. I wonder what Maria Feodorovna would have wanted for marriages for her granddaughters? That is something nobody knows.   

Offline anna11

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #207 on: November 16, 2007, 03:32:57 PM »
I read on one of those blog thingies that Alix once had a pillow fight with OTMA. Any truth in it? And does anyone have any info about it? lol


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Offline koloagirl

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #208 on: November 16, 2007, 07:21:59 PM »

Aloha from Kaua'i!

I remember reading this anecdote also -- but it wasn't on a blog -- possibly the Massie Nicholas and Alexandra book?

I don't know if there is any truth to it either - but it is something that has always stuck in my head -- it makes a wonderful image!

Janet R.
Janet R.

Offline clockworkgirl21

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Re: Alexandra as Empress and Mother
« Reply #209 on: November 17, 2007, 12:04:57 AM »
I've always heard that it's true, and I hope it is.  :) It would show that Alexandra wasn't as strict with her daughters as people tend to think.