Depression/Melancholy/Nervous breakdown during WWI

[Sarai_Porretta]

It would seem that the odds were against Olga from numerous angles, although certainly she was also a person enjoyed life and could have fun. For example, I have shown that photo taken during the AP house arrest period of the bald Grand Duchesses, seconds after removing their headdresses, and everyone always remarks on Olga's wonderfully silly grin!  

Plus the possibility that the idea for the girls to do this in the first place was Olga's! I recall reading that, as they were about to be photographed, on a signal from Olga all of the girls removed their hats and insisted on being photographed with their bald heads.

[bookworm8571]

I think the Grand Duchess lived in depressing times. It's hard to get a picture of a girl's personality from reading books, isn't it? Just from reading biographies, I'd say Olga is the daughter I liked most. She liked to read, she was a little shy, sometimes a loner, sometimes stubborn and strong-willed. I couldn't blame the poor girl for "sulking her mother" when Alexandra tried to tell her the way things should be. I get the impression from reading about her that Olga was considerably brighter than either of her parents.

[Janet_W.]

Sometimes parents are "a bit too close to the forest to see the trees" . . . to borrow from one of my own mom's frequently-voiced truisms!

And young people are often imbued with an idealism and a tendency to question that can really drive adults up the wall.

I think this was something of the situation going on with Olga and her parents, especially in her relationship with her mother.  Add to that all the tensions--social, political, etc.--and no wonder Olga had the sulks, etc.  

And yes, I agree that she was very, very bright. And had a lovely talent. If you've ever read that poem she wrote to her mother . . . well, it is perceptive, feeling . . . and it scans beautifully, too!    

[BobAtchison]

Janet:

The bridge with the structure on top is the Khrestovi Bridge - the Cross Bridge.

Bob

[Janet Whitcomb]

Bob, thank you so much for the specifics re: "Olga's Bridge."    I'm still looking for the reference to the actual incident and look forward to my "Eureka" moment!

[JediDeshka]

For in much wisdom is much grief,
And he who increases knowledge increases sorrow.
- Ecclesiastes 1:18

Another good quote from the Bible. I think this statement could easily reflect Olga's metality. Olga was obviously wise beyoned her years and could seemingly perceive events before they happened. I think that Olga's knowledge of everything that was going on around her caused her to worry about the future. I think we can all agree that ignorance is bliss, and if only Olga could ignore her thoughts of what could happen to her and her family. Would it have made a difference in her life as well as in her family's?

[Louise]

In General Count Grabbe's book on The Private World of the Last Tsar, there is a picture of GD Olga, where the author's of the book note her apparent depression or depressed mood.

It's on page 156 and on the next page, the young GD doesn't look much happier.

Louise

[Janet Whitcomb]

I wouldn't say Olga had a university prof's grasp of the situation, but Gilliard said that she asked questions, and we know that she also read a great deal--presumably newspapers in addition to school books and novels--so add that to her unique vantage point and what many observers have described as a strong intelligence, and I'm sure the general situation--compounded by war--caused her to be very conflicted and stressed.

[Louise]

I agree, Janet. For a sensitive young woman the whole dynamics of her entire family and the war would have caused great stress. Living with Alexei's disease, probably knowing how the extended family felt about their mother; Alix being reclusive, and "forcing" Olga and her sister into the war time hospital duties, plus the horror of the war must have played havoc on her psyche.

Are there any diaries from Olga that could shed any light on how she felt as her world was crumbling around her? Or how she felt during the angst filled teen years?

Louise

[Janet_Ashton]

Hi Janet,
"Olga made nonsence [sic], sitting on a tiny table, until she happily smashed it." -- Alix to Nicky, 2/16/15

Hi Jen
     I must admit I don't read the quote as a sign of Olga's depression or frustration. It seems a cheerful one to me: Olga was joking around, sitting on the table, and it broke under her weight.

I could be wrong, but that's the way I see it...

Janet

[bookworm8571]

That scene didn't sound like a depressed girl smashing a table in a rage to me either. Didn't one of the court ladies describe Olga as "the merriest of the merry" when she was in the mood?

I remember reading that the Danish royal family liked to rough house, play practical jokes that were often very physical, and enjoyed rather juvenile humor. It irritated some of the more urbane court hangers on.

The Greek royal family -- cousins through Tsarina Marie Alexandrovna --  and Queen Alexandra, wife of Bertie, and her family were described the same way. They were just a very fun-loving family who apparently didn't balk at prat falls! Olga and her sisters, being isolated from normal experiences, probably acted like little girls a little longer than would be typical.

I think Olga definitely did have a more serious, depressive side. Maybe she dealt with it by acting silly?

[TennPat]

I believe Olga N may have gotten some bad press. I'm rereading some of the reference to her. There are times when "Olga" is referred to in letters and I think it is really Olga A who is being referenced. For example in Alix's letter

Xenia telegraphed, that Olga is going to her for a few days, I am glad as it will do her no end of good, as her nerves seem to me rather down, ever since she came to Petrograd.
from letter 153, Nov, 1915

Olga A was having a lot of personal problems at that time and was also a nurse.

There are some other instances. I will try to find them

[Janet_W.]

I agree, Tenn, that it is difficult to keep "our" Olgas straight!  Context is the big clue, but occasionally even that is difficult to interpret.

Also, I agree with Bookworm re: the table smashing episode--it might well have been an episode of hilarity rather than rage.

And yes, it was only natural that the children enjoyed practical jokes and occasional rough-housing, not just because of their youthful high spirits, but also because their Danish forebearers were famous (or perhaps infamous?!) for that sort of thing!

Considering Olga, I think it a strong possibility that some--if not a great deal--of her perceived frivolity acted as sort of safety valve--i.e., a comparatively acceptable way of venting anxieties.

Finally, for those of you over the age of, say, 30   . . . think back to when you were a teenager or in your early twenties. Remember all those wild and crazy highjinks you pulled?!

Speaking for my current situation, I know that whenever I'm feeling overwhelmed or the least bit despressed, the very best thing is for someone to tickle my funnybone or inspire my sense of outrageousness and then I'm once again a giggling fourteen year old. In fact, in many ways I think I'm a far more giddy person these days than I was when I was fourteen!

That's why I think Olga could rightfully be described as "the merriest of the merry"--or sulky and a bit of a loner. Some people--i.e., Tatiana?--have moderate, balanced temperments . . . . others, such as Olga, have temperments like quicksilver!

[bookworm8571]

   Everyone has different facets to their personalities. Olga Nicholaievna was probably no different. She does sound like someone whose ups were very high and whose downs were very low, doesn't she?

  All of the girls sound like they probably had unexplored depths and may have had sensitive temperaments.

 Tatiana wasn't just the "Governess" who organized her siblings. She was also the sensitive teenager who broke down and sobbed when a man was shot in front of her in the theater. I think she was probably a sensitive girl too.

  Marie wasn't just a pretty, flirtatious kid with big eyes -- she was also the daughter who went alone with her parents into exile because the other girls deemed that she was steady enough to deal alone with Alix's nerves. In Alix's letters, Marie is the daughter who sounds most unsure of herself, most inclined to feel left out or used by the other girls. I remember in one of Marie's letters she asks if Olga might have her own room now since she is so big -- and then adds a P.S. "Olga didn't tell me to write this." LOL. So transparent, and so like a big sister to bully the little one. And then there's Marie's crush on the soldiers, and Alix's gentle response that so and so probably knows a little grand duchess mustn't feel that way about him and he wants to treat her as a little sister.

And Anastasia, poor bright, amusing little imp, has been overshadowed by the crazy woman who took over her name for 60 years.

They fell in love, they were disappointed in love, they nursed soldiers and if Olga locked herself in a closet and fell apart, who could blame her? If it helped them during those war years to laugh and break furniture and act silly, good for them.

[NAAOTMA]

As my two beautiful girls who are teenagers are frequently perched on something that they should not be sitting on, like tiny little end tables, the fact that a table broke under Olga (and her mother doesn't seem to be at all upset about it) sounds like teenage/young person stuff to me. So do her ups and downs. Whenever my girls "sulk" or ignore my well-intentioned and wisdom-filled advice (!) I always comfort myself by thinking "well, Alix did not have any better luck with her girls!"... And, as others in this thread have pointed out, most especially Bob, who in the world would not have been crushed under the pressures this family was experiencing from every quarter? As for the vomiting in a towel, considering what was going on in that hospital, she was very brave not to just run out the door.  I have sometimes wondered why Alix insisted on exposing herself and her children to the worst of the hospital experiences. I think she had a strong streak of her mother Alice in her-duty, and doing the worst task out of duty. She could have been a figurehead at a charity, but she chose to do the hardest work with great heart. I am sure she wanted her children to see the reality, and do their duty. It must have been very very hard  for them to handle. Screaming nightmare material. Alix seems to have had the true heart of a nurse, and been lifted up by her hospital work despite its hard physical and emotional aspects. She did have the wisdom to come to accept that Olga did not share that trait. Melissa K. (still shaking my head over teenage girls in the 21st Century as well as the 20th Century!)