Author Topic: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortipo  (Read 125480 times)

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Offline tatianolishka_

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #150 on: November 07, 2009, 06:44:48 PM »
Ah, back to my favorite topics after so long - Imperial Pets!

I love the fact that we have new evidence into the bulldog's name - Ortipo/Artipo. Whatever his name was, he must've been a much-loved pet right until the very end.

In response to a question awhile back regarding the fate of the dogs at Ipatiev, it is known that Joy survived (Alexei's spaniel). Beyond that there is much room for speculation. A quote from Yurovsky states that Ortipo (as I shall now on refer to the pup as) was barking like mad in the house, and ended the dog's life by stabbing it with a bayonet. The "dog's death for a dog" quote was also related to this. The remains of Jemmy, Anastasia's Cavalier King Charles, were discovered during an investigation some time after the murders. The dog was identified by one of the childrens' tutors (Gilliard or Gibbes, forgive me as I'm a little rusty on my facts), however the rate of decomposition did not match up to the date of the murders. There is a disturbing photo of the dead dog that exists somewhere, which I hope not to see anytime soon.

Yet anyways, thank you very much for keeping this thread alive in my absence and I hope that all the new members have been able to learn a little about the dogs of the IF - a subject very dear to my heart!

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #151 on: November 07, 2009, 07:42:35 PM »
I believe at least two of the executioners' statements mention Anastasia carrying a dog to the cellar. I don't remember which ones at the moment, but I'll try to remember to post their names next time I run across the info. Strekotin may have been one of them.
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Offline nena

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #152 on: November 07, 2009, 07:49:30 PM »
Good memory!

With them came Yurovsky, Nikulin, Medvedev, and Ermakov, the last one I knew from the Dutov Front. All of the arrested ones were dressed in the usual manner, and were clean and neat. The Tsar carried his son in his arms. Anastasia carried a little dog. The ex-Empress leaned on the arm of her eldest daughter, Olga.
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Offline blessOTMA

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #153 on: November 08, 2009, 12:32:30 AM »
I only have it in French. It's actually not my book and I only have some excerpts that Sarushak sent to me, because she knew I speak French.

The letter is very, very long. As I said, she covers 7 days and Olga wrote a lot. More, I don't know if I can post my personnal translation on the forum. Maybe, Sarushka could tell me if I can or cannot ?

Was this letter of Olga's ever posted else where in AP form? The idea of Ortino fighting with a pig,
cracks me up. Ortino was a character . But it would be a very interesting document generally of course.

"Give my love to all who remember me."

  Olga Nikolaevna

Offline nena

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #154 on: November 08, 2009, 04:16:56 AM »
I think it comes from a French book about Tsarevich Alexei, if I recall correct.
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Offline Sarushka

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortipo
« Reply #155 on: November 08, 2009, 06:42:48 AM »
I think it comes from a French book about Tsarevich Alexei, if I recall correct.

That's right. There are a number of Tobolsk letters in Le Tsarevitch, enfant martyr that haven't been published elsewhere.
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Offline blessOTMA

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #156 on: November 08, 2009, 05:37:23 PM »
Alexi's diary and letters when the family  was  seperated??!!
 wow!
Amazing this book has what others don't. 

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Offline RHB

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #157 on: November 08, 2009, 07:01:38 PM »
Good memory!

With them came Yurovsky, Nikulin, Medvedev, and Ermakov, the last one I knew from the Dutov Front. All of the arrested ones were dressed in the usual manner, and were clean and neat. The Tsar carried his son in his arms. Anastasia carried a little dog. The ex-Empress leaned on the arm of her eldest daughter, Olga.

Which book is that? And if it happens to be FOTR what page i may have missed that skimming through before actually reading it right away (if it isn't FOTR then you needn't have to answer the 2nd question).

Thanks!
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Offline Sarushka

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #158 on: November 08, 2009, 08:28:02 PM »
Good memory!

With them came Yurovsky, Nikulin, Medvedev, and Ermakov, the last one I knew from the Dutov Front. All of the arrested ones were dressed in the usual manner, and were clean and neat. The Tsar carried his son in his arms. Anastasia carried a little dog. The ex-Empress leaned on the arm of her eldest daughter, Olga.

Which book is that? And if it happens to be FOTR what page i may have missed that skimming through before actually reading it right away (if it isn't FOTR then you needn't have to answer the 2nd question).

Thanks!


I'm 99% sure I have that testimony in Russian in Ispoved' Tsareubiits.
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Offline Olga Maria

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #159 on: November 11, 2009, 09:44:50 PM »
This was interesting from Sarushka's post
Lili Dehn gives a similar alternate spelling: Artipo. Dehn is by no means a scholarly source like The Complete Wartime Correspondence, but she (like Vyrubova) would have heard the dog's name spoken by the IF themselves, so I find her approximation particularly compelling evidence.
I’ve read a bit ago that in Russian, an “o” will have an “ah” sound if it’s accented. Thus, I think now that the first “o” in Ortipo is accented that’s why Lili Dehn [who didn’t speak Russian, so probably, she doesn’t know the spelling] spelled Ortipo as “Artipo” in her memoirs.  Ortipo’s name in Cyrillic might be spelled as Оьртипо.

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Offline matushka

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #160 on: November 12, 2009, 06:25:54 AM »
Lili Dehn didn't speak Russia??? Are you sure???

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #161 on: November 12, 2009, 07:22:46 AM »
Lili Dehn didn't speak Russia??? Are you sure???

Apparently Lili Dehn spoke Russian somewhat poorly as a child. Despite being born in Russia, her family spoke French at home. I don't know how fluent she became as an adult.

It's possible that while writing her book she chose to spell the dog's name the way it would sound to English readers, rather than transliterate it literally.
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Offline Sunny

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #162 on: December 05, 2011, 08:42:01 AM »
I know the problem of the correct spelling of the name has already been long discussed, but i've noted that russian sites spell it ORTINO, with a N not a P.
I don't want to rise the question again, just stating it out because it could be interesting to know.
Take a look here, if you understand Russian: http://www.liveinternet.ru/users/tatasoz/post144624543/ (Thanks BlessOTMA to have segnalized me the site!)
Near the end you can read:

Татьяна и Анастасия Романовы с бульдогом Ортино 
Tat'jana and Anastasija Romanov with bulldog ORTINO.
Please visit my site
http://thelostworldofnaotmaa.wordpress.com/

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Offline blessOTMA

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #163 on: December 05, 2011, 09:01:48 AM »
Sunny, I may have told you of that site, but I had not seen that post! Thank you! Nicholas is smiling in one of the elephant feeding photos and he looks like he did as a boy! He faces was so expressive when he smiles

"Give my love to all who remember me."

  Olga Nikolaevna

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Tatiana's French bulldog, Ortino
« Reply #164 on: December 05, 2011, 03:47:57 PM »
I know the problem of the correct spelling of the name has already been long discussed, but i've noted that russian sites spell it ORTINO, with a N not a P.

It's not surprising, since the Russian N and P are so similar and Tatiana's handwriting is so difficult. That's why Lili Dehn's spelling was the deciding clue for me.

What we really need is to see the dog's name in someone else's handwriting. Maybe Helen A. can help with that. I know she has a number of photocopies of Olga's letters and diary entries.
THE LOST CROWN: A Novel of Romanov Russia -- now in paperback!
"A dramatic, powerful narrative and a masterful grasp of life in this vanished world." ~Greg King