Author Topic: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?  (Read 26617 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline yussupov29

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 54
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #30 on: March 30, 2010, 12:58:20 AM »
That would be censorship indeed, we must not be precious about things however distasteful we may personally find them. The ongoing fascination with AF and Rasputin, is of historical intrest. It all nonsense of course but new comers to this story of tumultuous change and an epoch full of historical giants need to be able to discuss why AF would not and did not have lovers. We should also remember that Saints are human being elevated by God because of there suffering and defense of faith usually. AF was a flesh and blood women, a sinner like all of us, then a devoted mother, then an Empress Consort and finally a saint and martyr!! You may wish to change the order according to you opinion of her. I have a soft spot for AF, I like to think I understand her a little.

But we must be free to discuss whatever we need to, free expression of views and opinions!!! We must also accept that others may not agree with us at all.


Thank you I agree with you! In my opinion nor the subject nor the way it's talked about here is distasteful.

For me AF is not so much a martyr, but a person of historical interest.

Offline violetta

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 936
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #31 on: March 30, 2010, 01:18:59 AM »
i think that first of alll we should be guided by our goog tastewe are a historical forum,not a TABLOID PAPER

Offline Kalafrana

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 2912
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #32 on: March 30, 2010, 03:31:28 AM »
In my opinion we are discussing the subject with good taste. I think everyone is agreed that there is no evidence that Alexandra had any physical relationship with anybody except Nicholas.

In my opinion she behaved extremely foolishly in relation to Rasputin, but in all the circumstances, including what we know of her character, it is unlikely in the extreme that she had any physical relationship with Rasputin. I do not say she couldn't possibly have, but that is because I never or almost never say that something is completely impossible (the lawyer in me).

Ann

Offline yussupov29

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 54
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #33 on: March 30, 2010, 04:04:43 AM »
Maybe some members have a different definition of good taste!

The (im)possible intimate relation between AF / OTMA and Rasputin was part of the nasty propaganda against the IF. So far it is of historical interest for me. I'am not interested in the "dirty details".

Offline Grand Duchess Valeria

  • Graf
  • ***
  • Posts: 270
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #34 on: March 30, 2010, 04:48:01 AM »
Nobody is interested in "dirty details" here, I think. But we have to consider, that some people are new in this forum and have never heard anything or a lot about the IF, Alexandra, Nicholas and Rasputin. Some have only heard the gossip. Shouldn't we "guide" them through this difficult and complex theme and tell them the truth as to let them stand alone with the lies?
And when he shall die, // Take him and cut him out in little starres, // And he will make the Face of heaven so fine, // That all the world will be in Love with night, // And pay no worship to the Garish Sun.

Offline violetta

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 936
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #35 on: March 30, 2010, 06:35:53 AM »
In my opinion we are discussing the subject with good taste. I think everyone is agreed that there is no evidence that Alexandra had any physical relationship with anybody except Nicholas.

In my opinion she behaved extremely foolishly in relation to Rasputin, but in all the circumstances, including what we know of her character, it is unlikely in the extreme that she had any physical relationship with Rasputin. I do not say she couldn't possibly have, but that is because I never or almost never say that something is completely impossible (the lawyer in me).

Ann


i do agree that some people in this forum gave very precise answers to a question HOW MANY LOVERS DID SHE HAVE? is there any point in continuing this discussion as soon as we all agreed that alexandra feodorovna`s only love was her husband?

Offline yussupov29

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 54
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #36 on: March 30, 2010, 07:13:26 AM »
A precise anwser to a precise question.
Can't see what's wrong about it? It's a fact that there were and still are these rumours around. It's a part of history. And for me it's seems pretty ok to talk about it. Of course with respect and the intention to find the truth.




Alixz

  • Guest
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #37 on: March 30, 2010, 10:16:56 AM »
As a moderator - I see no reason to close this thread.  If FA wants to, then he will.

I know that he feels without a doubt that Alexandra had no other lover but her husband.  He also feels that OTMA were never violated by Rasputin or by anyone else even during their imprisonment and transport from Tobolsk to Yekaterinburg.

However, Alexandra herself led to the starting of such rumors by the way that she wrote to Rasputin.  Rasputin himself let the letters become public and he also boasted about "the old girl" and what he could do with her.

We are here to discuss any topic that interests us, but I also believe that we should be directing those with questions to the sources of the information that we have access to and that we have researched.

What conclusion they come to is their own.

Offline AGRBear

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 6611
  • The road to truth is the best one to travel.
    • View Profile
    • Romanov's  Russia
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #38 on: March 30, 2010, 11:44:36 AM »
When Alexandra had not produced a male heir for Nicholas II,  she was placed under a great deal of pressure.

It was about this time, a rumor, and let me stress that it was a rumor since proof has not surfaced up to this time,  that Alexandra was asked to take a "lover" who had proven his ability to have male children.

Such an  idea would not have shocked anyone in the Romanov circle.  It would  not have been the first time this kind of problem was solved by and "outsider".  The best known person to have solved this problem was Catherine II " the Great".

Knowing Alexandra's love for Nicholas II, as well as her pride,  such a suggestion would have caused her  terrible distress.  Especially if it came from her mother-in-law or one of her friends.  And, we do know that she had a "false pregnancy" around this time period but we can only assume this was caused through stress of wanting to provide her husband an heir.

I've read only  one name  for this  "royal duty" which, I assume, has managed to surface through various "rumors".  His name was Orlov.   Only his last name has been mention and never his christian name.  Through research, there were several Orlovs who were within the "inner group" who could have been possibly suggested for such a "royal duty".  

As far as I know, no one  has proof that  Alexandra ever had a "lover" or "lovers" during her marriage.

We do know,   Nicholas II was the father of his son and heir, Alexei, according to the DNA tests on the royal remains.

AGRBear
« Last Edit: March 30, 2010, 11:47:30 AM by AGRBear »
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Alixz

  • Guest
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #39 on: March 30, 2010, 01:23:07 PM »
The title of this thread has been changed to reflect a question of other lovers and not an assumption that there were others in Alexandra's life besides her husband.


Hey, Bear - Long time!

Offline AGRBear

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 6611
  • The road to truth is the best one to travel.
    • View Profile
    • Romanov's  Russia
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #40 on: March 30, 2010, 08:15:37 PM »
Hey Alixz.

Been really really busy.

Hope to find some free  time so I can pop into a few threads.

AGRBear
"What is true by lamplight is not always true by sunlight."

Joubert, Pensees, No. 152

Constantinople

  • Guest
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #41 on: March 30, 2010, 10:18:43 PM »
The fact that Alexandra was not a social person and had refused to hold balls did not help her public reputation.  To have someone like Rasputin visiting the palace even a few times was a disaster when you understand what he had been up to at his residence.  Alexandra did not understand how negative her actions were to the Russian monarchy and if she had ceded some part of the powers that the monarchy held instead of demanding that her husband preserve the autocracy for Alexei, perhaps Russia would have had a different history.   My feeling was that Alexandra did not have other lovers but that some of her actions led others to believe she may have.  For a woman as unpopular as her to give this ammunition to her enemies was foolish and almost as bad as taking lovers.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2010, 10:04:36 AM by Alixz »

Offline ..dlnec1

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 28
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #42 on: April 02, 2010, 04:59:06 PM »
I am so pleased that others shared my point of view. This story and its historical importance is so vital. I love passing on what I have learnt and the opinions I have formed about NII and AF and the family. I have always loved the retelling and reevaluating of the facts and the new information since the fall of the wall and Bolshevism have been fantastic. When I first began to explore the life of AF, there were only a few books, very few were had the whole story.

I was however lucky enough to meet Lord Mountbatten, he told me a two separate occasions that the family all died together and I always believed him. He was gentleman and what ever they say about him, he was so kind and took the time to speak to a small boy of 9 and later 11 about his Aunt and how much he loved her and his cousins. He did say to me and I remember his words, "My aunt was wonderful mother and I loved her dearly, but she could be as mad as a hatter sometimes".

I teach and I have always believed in getting students talking, reading and involved ion the story then they learn. So lets always remember no topic is distasteful, it maybe a topic that upsets us or is hard to deal with, but lets be brave and talk about them and we can then offer help to others just starting out with this piece of history. Its a duty you know to pass on what you have learnt.

Offline Michael HR

  • Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 645
  • Imperial Corps Des Pages
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #43 on: April 03, 2010, 06:19:55 AM »
I am so pleased that others shared my point of view. This story and its historical importance is so vital. I love passing on what I have learnt and the opinions I have formed about NII and AF and the family. I have always loved the retelling and reevaluating of the facts and the new information since the fall of the wall and Bolshevism have been fantastic. When I first began to explore the life of AF, there were only a few books, very few were had the whole story.

I was however lucky enough to meet Lord Mountbatten, he told me a two separate occasions that the family all died together and I always believed him. He was gentleman and what ever they say about him, he was so kind and took the time to speak to a small boy of 9 and later 11 about his Aunt and how much he loved her and his cousins. He did say to me and I remember his words, "My aunt was wonderful mother and I loved her dearly, but she could be as mad as a hatter sometimes".

I teach and I have always believed in getting students talking, reading and involved ion the story then they learn. So lets always remember no topic is distasteful, it maybe a topic that upsets us or is hard to deal with, but lets be brave and talk about them and we can then offer help to others just starting out with this piece of history. Its a duty you know to pass on what you have learnt.

Did not Lord Mountbatten keep a photo of one of the Grand Duchesses on a table for the rest of his life, but I cannot remember which. He was always against Anna Anderson as I recall. Wish I had met him he must have know so many little facts.
Remembering the Imperial Corps Des Pages - The Spirit of Imperial Russia


Offline ..dlnec1

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 28
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
    • View Profile
Re: Did Alexandra Have Other Lovers?
« Reply #44 on: April 03, 2010, 08:41:00 AM »
I am told it was a photograph of Marie Nicoleavna.