Author Topic: Empress Elisabeth, Part I  (Read 352952 times)

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Offline MarieCharlotte

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #435 on: July 22, 2007, 11:26:39 AM »
Was it Elisabeths or Franz Josephs wish to name their children like that?

As far as I know, nobody asked Elisabeth how she wanted to name her first three children. She only chose the name Marie Valérie.
Ich aber breite trauernd aus
die weiten weissen Schwingen,
Und kehr' ins Feenreich nach Haus -
Nichts soll mich wieder bringen.


Elisabeth

Offline britt.25

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #436 on: July 23, 2007, 04:59:02 AM »
Was it Elisabeths or Franz Josephs wish to name their children like that?

As far as I know, nobody asked Elisabeth how she wanted to name her first three children. She only chose the name Marie Valérie.

It must have been hard for her, was it simply decided over her head by her husband and/or her aunt and mother- in -law Sophie? I fear so.  :-\
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #437 on: July 23, 2007, 05:06:26 AM »
Indeed ! That prompt her to take off...away from it all. I think she was the first Austrian Royal to gain independence from the court system.  ???

Offline Nika

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #438 on: July 30, 2007, 04:40:41 PM »
Hi, perhaps it'll sounds silly, but when I look closely to this two pictures I noticed that Sissi and Sophie have the same hand gesture, pulling out the finger. I rember I've seen a picture with some Sissi's staff after her death, and between them there was a little pendant with a hand, with the same finger's gesture. Did you ever think about it? Is this mean something? Or maybe it's only my too big imagination  ???

« Last Edit: July 30, 2007, 04:42:20 PM by Nika »

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #439 on: July 30, 2007, 07:45:23 PM »
No...Sisi's sisters all like to copy Sisi from dress to the way she walked. In fact Maria Sofia was often mistaken in photos for Sisi.  ;)

Offline dmitri

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #440 on: July 30, 2007, 11:20:17 PM »
Yes Sissi was the orginal and the best. As for the title of the the book mentioned initally in this thread I had to laugh. What was anarchistic about Sissi? I never saw any evidence of her throwing bombs. The closest she came to an anarchist was being murdered by one.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #441 on: July 31, 2007, 12:20:41 AM »
Maria Sofia did rode up her horse in the midst of firing at Gratea.  ;)

Offline britt.25

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #442 on: October 08, 2007, 07:47:35 AM »



I found this picture in one of my books, and I would like to know, if anybody could tell me more about the reationship of the people to each other. How was the relationship of Leopold II., father in-law of crownprince Rudolf, to Franz Joseph and Sisi, and did Sisi come along with Henriette etc?
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline Princess Susan

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #443 on: October 08, 2007, 01:02:45 PM »
I would like to know more details about their relationship as well. But according what I read in Marie Valerie's diary, relationship between these two families wasn't very warm. At least Marie Valerie didn't see in belgian royal couple nice people. She wrote, that King was very unsympathetic and Queen freezing cold.
Anyway Leopold II. wasn't nice man in common and propably not many people could considered him for sympathetic person.

Offline britt.25

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #444 on: October 08, 2007, 01:24:25 PM »
I already expected something like that, because I knew that Leopold II never allowed his other daughter Clementine to marry Victor Napoléon, whome she loved so much, as he was a Bonaparte prince, and she had to wait until the end of his life to marry him. It seems Leopold did not have much understandig for his own children. About Henriette I don't know, but yes, I have also heard, she was rather a cold person, too, but maybe also as a result of being married with such an patriarchalic person..??
So I would imagine that the relationship to the Habsburg relatives might have been difficult as well. But I don't know it. I only know, none of Leopolds children did have a happy maariage. On the picture they look rather distanced, only Stephanie seems to smile (why??), but surely such pictures are nor reality.
It fits to the things, which Marie Valerie wrote about that...thanks for the info...
Has anybody more??
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline pouvoir aux canard

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #445 on: October 08, 2007, 03:11:47 PM »
here a painting of Fançois-Joseph (a painting now in France - I guess presented to Napoléon 3 after the visit of F-J to the parisian Great Exhibirion in 1867)





Your most devoted
Mr Canard

P.S. I have been obliged to work Sunday and to-day so I will continue the other threads ( journeys, mistresses, nicknames) to-morrow

Offline britt.25

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #446 on: October 09, 2007, 01:37:14 AM »
here a painting of Fançois-Joseph (a painting now in France - I guess presented to Napoléon 3 after the visit of F-J to the parisian Great Exhibirion in 1867)





Your most devoted
Mr Canard

P.S. I have been obliged to work Sunday and to-day so I will continue the other threads ( journeys, mistresses, nicknames) to-morrow


It's very nice, but why was it presented to NIII after that exhibition?
And do you maybe know more on the relationhsip of NIII and family with Sisi and FJ, and also about the belgians?
As I once wrote, Eugenie and Sisi seemed to come along quite good with each other...
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline pouvoir aux canard

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #447 on: October 09, 2007, 01:59:49 PM »
Yes, my dear Eric Lowe, you are right, I would have wrote something more on the painting. A very beautiful one, and not common , of the austrian emperor...
So the title is François Joseph, empereur d'Autriche, à cheval.  
the painter is Otto von Thoren (1828-1889) (I did no more research on the painter)
the painting is from 1866 and belongs to the French State. He is in Paris, Musée d'Orsay.

Now my dear dear Britt, WHY ? it was a common practice between sovereins to exchange paintings as gifts particularly for a visit. This painting was painted  in 1866 and now is in France, as a gift of F-J to Napoléon 3 , as a thank for inviting him in France. to the Great Exhibition of 1867...
This habit is one of the reasons why paintings of Non French Sovereigns are remaining in french museums and castels. (the other one is that Napoléon 1er stoled some thousands of paintings from europeans castels and collections !)

About Sisi  and Eugénie, remember my dear that I am not a specialist of these two marvellous empresses. On my point of view, anyway, they do not have had close relationships before the late eighties of the eighteen century, where they met on the Cote d'Azur, without any official duties (as Eugénie was no more a sovereign an Sisi was deeply depressed). I guess they met regularly but not often. (each year? each two year?). Before that time they met in SALZBURG (on july 1867?) (you know the day I suppose ) for very few days and in rather sad circumstances (Maximilian was killed in Mexico, the two empires had huge economic problems, etc). People though (hoped) in a competition between them but they had a good understanding.

Unfortunately, I have lo leave the Forum
best thanks and regards to Eric and Britt


your Mr Canard

Offline XJaseyRaeX

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #448 on: October 14, 2007, 10:48:37 PM »
Some pics of Sisi with family :



Sisi with Archduchess Sophie, Archduke François-Charles, her husband Franz
Josef and her childs Gisela and baby Rudolf


Sisi with Gisela and baby son Rudolf ; In background, a portrait of the missing
child Sophie


Sisi with childs Gisela and Rudi and the Family of Franz Josef


Sisi, Franz Josef and their 3 children in the park of the Castle of Gödollo
in Hungary

i always thought that the first picture was of the little Archduchess Sophie and Gisela was the baby?


I am.

Offline Princess Susan

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Re: Empress Elisabeth, Part I
« Reply #449 on: October 15, 2007, 10:30:49 AM »
You are right, Cambria. On first picture are realy Sophie and Gisela- two eldest daughters of imperial couple.
I know this picture very well from many books.