Alfonso de Orleans, Infante of Spain and Beatrice of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha

[Eric_Lowe]

And you mean the title of Infante of Spain does not ? As the son and grandson of an Infante (through marriage to an Infanta of Spain), Ali had 2 dozes of Spanish royal blood and as royal as the Spanish Royal Family. I think he thought of himself more Spanish than French. 

[REMI]

Well...The titles of Infante in Spain and Duke of Galliera is good enough for Ali & Bee.

You're right indeed! As proof, don Alfonso left his title of duke de Galliera in 1937 to his son don Alvaro who, due his morganatic marriage with Carla Parodi Delfino, had no title, was neither infante of Spain nor prince. I am not sure that the title of Duke de Galliera (italian title) is recognized in Spain.

REMI

[REMI]

Of course , sorry Remi. I didn't know where he died, Burkes had " nr Orleans", so many thanks.
So to return to my question (if you will kindly bear with me). Why didn't the Royal title pass to Antonio who would still be a French Prince?

I don't think that Antonio would still be a French Prince. He was an infante of Spain. He was considered as a foreign prince by the head of House of Orléans. Consequently, the title of duke of  Montpensier could not pass to Antonio.

REMI

[Norbert]

I see, interesting that he was not commpensated with a Spanish Dukedom. many thanks

[Norbert]

And you mean the title of Infante of Spain does not ? As the son and grandson of an Infante (through marriage to an Infanta of Spain), Ali had 2 dozes of Spanish royal blood and as royal as the Spanish Royal Family. I think he thought of himself more Spanish than French. 

Indeed the title and style of Infante of Spain is extremely important, but it would only be for the imediate members related to the Royal House. I think they would consider what their descendants would have to use in the future. The Italian King helped out with this Galliera dukedom which is not recognised in Spain.

[Eric_Lowe]

Well...With or without the French title, Ali & Bee were respected and invited to all the European royal family events. Bee declined in her later years due to ill health, but Ali 's face was visable in a lot of family and official events...

[Norbert]

as I said before , I'm surprised that Beatrice and Alfonso didn't want something grander to pass onto their descendants. Today they are French princes living in Spain with an Italian title which is not recognised .

[REMI]

Norbert, why do you persist saying that the Orleans Borbon are French princes? They are neither princes, nor french. The descendants of Alfonso et Beatrice are only Spanish aristocrats.

REMI

[Eric_Lowe]

Well...They are decendenents of 2 Infantas and deemed Spanish in almost every way. However in her lifetime, Bee still thought of herself as a British Princess (She was born in England while her father was still Duke of Edinburgh). When GV wanted to create Georgie a duke after he married Marina, he thought about the title of Duke of Edinburgh. He write to Missy to see if she would mind. Her reply was that she wished he wouldn't since she and her sisters still thought of themselves as the "Edinburgh girls". George was created Duke of Kent instead.

[Marie-Mathilde]

I'm terribly confused about the Duke and Duchess of Galliera's son's titles. I know its not the most important of things, but it is doing my head in! When their eldest son, Alvaro, was born the Gallieras were in a sort of exile in Coburg and their baby son, i think, had no official title. When Alonso was born, they made him an Infante and a Royal Highness. However when Ataulfo was born he was made el Príncipe de la Casa de Borbón also a Royal Highness. But I see them mostly with the titles of Princes d'Orléans-Borbón also with Royal Highness. If anyone has a definitive answer on their titles and styles on the three of them? Thankyou.

I used these as my references ^ : http://www.heraldica.org/topics/royalty/infantes.htm

[Eric_Lowe]

Alfonso or Ali was an Infante since his mother (Eulalie) and grandmother (Luisa) were Infantas of Spain. When he married Baby Bee in Coburg, he was in disgrace and titles were taken away from him. That is when the confusion started...

[Marie-Mathilde]

Yes Eric that is where all the confusion started...! Royals virtually always take their titles from their father, through the male line. The Duke was made an Infante because, like you said his mother was. He also had a Italian dukedom (galliera). Here is the male line:

King Louis Philippe of France
               I
Antoine, Duke of Montpensier
               I
Antonio de Orleans-Galliera y Borbón
               I
Infante Alfonso, Duke of Galliera
               I
Alvaro, Alonso and Ataulfo

You can now see why everyone is going on about a french title.

[Eric_Lowe]

I think that is because the Spanish titles are not automatic but by the wishes of the Monarch. Like the Duke of Cardiz's son Luis Alfonso should have been made a Spanish Duke & an Infante. But because the title of Duke of Cadiz was only lifetime stipulated by the monarch. Juan Carlos (probably due to the bad relations with the decendents of the Don Jaime line) decided to deny his nephew a Spanish title. That is why Luis Alfonso reverted back to his French title.

[Eric_Lowe]

That book is a must for all Baby Bee fans and fans of the Edinburgh sisters & Ena.

[Maria_Pavlovna]

what is this book called?