Parents of Princess Zenaida - Nikolay Borisovitch and Tatiana Alexandrovna

[Yelena Aleksandrovna]

I just find a pair of paintings of Tatiana, please add photos if there are.

[Svetabel]

Prince Nikolay

[ashanti01]

I always believed Zenaida resembled her father, however after seeing the last photo posted by Svetabel I think it was actually Tatiana who looked like her father. Very similar features IMO.

[Yelena Aleksandrovna]

Tatiana Alexandrovna

[Éole]

What is exactly Tatiana de Ribeaupierre family background on her father's side?

From what I've found (and it's quite interesting) Tatiana Alexandrovna de Ribeaupierre's family is the same (Ribeaupierre in French, Rappolstein in German) to which belongs King Maximilian I of Bavaria's great grandmother, Katharina Agathe of Rappoltstein (married to Christian II, Count Palatine of Zweibrücken-Birkenfeld). It's an Alsacian family. Some Erbachs and Waldecks married in this family from what I can see. But the thing is that according to it's article on French Wikipedia the male line died out in 1673 and the next Count of Rappolstein was Katharina's husband the Count Palatine of Birkenfeld. We also know that Tatiana's brother only died in 1871 after having married a princess Trubetskoy.

The line I found (I don't know about its reliability):

Alexandre, comte de Ribeaupierre b. 1783  m. Ekaterina Mikhailovna Potyomkina
Jean François, Graf von Ribeaupierre   m. N
Marc-Etienne, comte de Ribeaupierre  m.  Elizabeth Coster
Johann Jakob von Rappoltstein, Graf von Ribeaupierre b. 12.02.1598 m. Anna Claudina, wild-und rheingräfin von Kyrburg (Katharina Agathe's parents)

[Marc]

Interesting,I would put the same question...couldn't find anything in genealogy sites that confirms that this family is the same...if it is Ribeaupierre branch must have been some "forgotten" line of the same family separated few centuries ago and therefore "lost" in genealogy sites until they married someone "of significance" and their name reappeared...if you find something more,inform us :-)

[Éole]

I tried to find more information on the Ribeaupierre's lineage but it was not really fruitful. Though I did find many references to a line of Ribeaupierre landlords that would have survived at least until the Revolution.

But here is some more info on Tatiana's brother and sisters, probably not exhaustive:

Sophia Alexandrovna, comtesse de Ribeaupierre b. 1812  m. Vassili Pavlovitch, count Golenistcheff-Koutouzoff
Ivan Alexandrovich, comte Ribeaupierre b. 1817  m. Sofia, princess Trubetskoy

While doing research the Ribeaupierres, I found about another daughter of Alexandre de Ribeaupierre and Ekaterina Mikhailovna Potyomkina, called Marie (Maria) who according to this record (http://books.google.ca/books?id=dh0XAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA29&lpg=PA29&dq=noblesse+Ribeaupierre&source=bl&ots=u8ii9Udaih&sig=0IIg6tYBe85aVzKDfeTD2wTdDdQ&hl=fr&ei=JCe9S4aNIYGB8gb4ls2rCA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CBMQ6AEwBjge#v=onepage&q=Ribeaupierre&f=false) married in 1849 Marie-Joseph-Antoine de Brassier de Saint-Simon-Vallade (b. 1798).

[Svetabel]

The 1st Ribeaupierre who served in Russia was Jean Ribeaupierre aka Ivan Stepanovitch - he was killed in Russian-Turkish War in 1790. This Jean Ribeaupierre was married a noble Agrafena Alexandrovna Bibikova, btw a relative of famous Kutuzov.
Their son Alexander was a great fave at the Imperial Court till 1799 year when he was sent to Vienna. Before that Emperor Pavel I wanted him to marry his mistress Anna Lopukhina, but Anna was against such alliance and Alexander went to Vienna.
In 1809 he married Ekaterina Mikhailovna Potyemkina and his title he got only in 1856 after many years in Russian goverment employ.
His children were: Mikhail,Ivan, Anna, Sophia,Maria and Tatiana.

If one can read Russian there's an article about Alexander Ribeaupierre:

http://dic.academic.ru/dic.nsf/enc_biography/106623/%D0%A0%D0%B8%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%BF%D1%8C%D0%B5%D1%80

[ashdean]

The 1st Ribeaupierre who served in Russia was Jean Ribeaupierre aka Ivan Stepanovitch - he was killed in Russian-Turkish War in 1790. This Jean Ribeaupierre was married a noble Agrafena Alexandrovna Bibikova, btw a relative of famous Kutuzov.
Their son Alexander was a great fave at the Imperial Court till 1799 year when he was sent to Vienna. Before that Emperor Pavel I wanted him to marry his mistress Anna Lopukhina, but Anna was against such alliance and Alexander went to Vienna.
In 1809 he married Ekaterina Mikhailovna Potyemkina and his title he got only in 1856 after many years in Russian goverment employ.
His children were: Mikhail,Ivan, Anna, Sophia,Maria and Tatiana.

If one can read Russian there's an article about Alexander Ribeaupierre:

http://dic.academic.ru/dic.nsf/enc_biography/106623/%D0%A0%D0%B8%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%BF%D1%8C%D0%B5%D1%80

In the journals of catherine and Martha Wilmott...the early Ribeaupierre family is mentioned..sadly I do not have my notes to hand.

[Éole]

Nice info, thanks. And more is always welcomed!

[Éole]

I found more information on Tatiana's family. This line I found is apparently not linked with the Rappoltsteins.

These Ribeaupierres would descend from Jacques-François Deribeaupierre (whose brother Marc-Étienne also left descendants who were later ennobled). Jacques-François would be Ivan Stepanovitch/Jean Ribeaupierre's great grand-father. Both brothers were bourgeois from Grandson (I made a quick researched and found it was in Switzerland).

[Naslednik Norvezhskiy]

The line I found (I don't know about its reliability):

Alexandre, comte de Ribeaupierre b. 1783  m. Ekaterina Mikhailovna Potyomkina
Jean François, Graf von Ribeaupierre   m. N
Marc-Etienne, comte de Ribeaupierre  m.  Elizabeth Coster
Johann Jakob von Rappoltstein, Graf von Ribeaupierre b. 12.02.1598 m. Anna Claudina, wild-und rheingräfin von Kyrburg (Katharina Agathe's parents)

The descent from Johann Jakob, Graf von Rappoltstein aka Jean-Jacques, comte de Ribeaupierre seems rather unlikely as it was precisely his lack of sons that led to Rappoltstein passing to the Palatine Wittelsbachs, through his daughter's marriage to one of them.

If he had a son, it must have been an illegitimate one. But more likely is it that the Russian De Ribeaupierres are descended from a way more junior line which settled in Switzerland, or most likely, not related to them at all.

Though I guess descent from the Lords of Rappoltstein, whom the Holy Roman Emperors had invested with das Pfeiferecht, the Right of Piping, a benefice that included supervizing, taxing and protecting the vagrants, vagabonds or travellers of the emperor (pipers, jugglers, fortune-tellers, singers and other travelling entertainers), including crowning a King of Pipers, would have been perfect for Felix Yussupov!

[Carolath Habsburg]

Unmarked and clearer version of a picture previously posted here

[Yelena Aleksandrovna]

Tatiana Alexandrovna
Click

Is one copy of the other? Wich one is the original?

[ashanti01]

That is the original one. The one where she is wearing the tiara is the copy.