Author Topic: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II  (Read 134257 times)

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Offline Hector

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #195 on: January 18, 2012, 04:10:23 PM »
I was more wondering why Nicholas II let Cyril and Victoria Melita back into Russia during World War I? I read somewhere Cyril was let back in because of the succession, but why not just forget about Cyril since Nicholas II had Cyril's younger brothers or baring them (it was somebody to do with their mother being a Lutheran, right?), he had Grand Duke Dmitri Pavlovich (who didn't get exiled until 1916, right?).


Nicholas didn't need to make Boris third-in-line after he removed Kirill from the succession. That was automatic. In just the same way, when Savannah Phillips, the most recent British royal infant, was born, she went into the succession automatically, immediately behind her father and in front of her Aunt Zara, without any formal declarations.

Ann

Offline TimM

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #196 on: January 18, 2012, 04:37:02 PM »
Well, then, maybe that's the guy they should pick.
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Offline QueenEna1887

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #197 on: January 18, 2012, 04:38:09 PM »
Even so I  doubt Prince Michael will become Czar, he cannot inherit the throne either for he's descended from a Senior Grand Duke in the female line and his shared great-grandmother along with Maria Vladimirovna the Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna nee Duchess of Mecklenburg-Strelitz was not a member of the ROC until 1908.  So Mikey is inelligible. So what if he resembles the last Czar that makes no difference for he isn't him/

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #198 on: January 18, 2012, 05:11:20 PM »
I think Nicholas did not want to punish Kyril too much as he is still a Romanov and furthermore married a granddaughter of a Tsar (Alexander II). It would be easier to keep the peace in the family. It was not until later that even Paul & Misha was forgiven together with their divorced non-royal wives.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #199 on: January 18, 2012, 05:14:43 PM »
I think therefore one of the descendants of Sandro & Xenia would satisfy the Church rules since they were both born of Orthodox parents.

Offline QueenEna1887

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #200 on: January 18, 2012, 06:19:55 PM »
Could be like Prince Andrew Andreevich who lives in Inverness, California.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #201 on: January 19, 2012, 05:56:43 PM »
The eldest great grandson of Sandro & Xenia ? If his wife became Orthodox before the wedding, he is eligible. Tsar Alexander III once said that he actually prefer Grand Dukes to marry commoners who are Orthodox than Royals who are not and will not convert.

Offline QueenEna1887

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #202 on: January 19, 2012, 08:28:20 PM »
Well he is the surviving grandson from Sandro and Xenia's eldest son...but he's married three times. I dont know if his wife ever converted to Orthodoxy.  Or any of the other wives before him. We know Prince Michael of Kent is out of the question for he is a Protestant born royal and not Orthodox.

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #203 on: January 20, 2012, 02:16:07 AM »
Frederick Forsyth's book is a good read, but I'm not sure the idea is meant to be taken too seriously!

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #204 on: January 20, 2012, 10:09:25 AM »
Yes. But he did built up enough good will in Russia and was more in tune with the general Romanov family than Maria ever did. I do cringe when I think with so many male Romanovs living that they try to foster a Hohenzollern to rule in Russia...

Offline Marc

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #205 on: January 20, 2012, 10:21:32 AM »
I do cringe when I think with so many male Romanovs living that they try to foster a Hohenzollern to rule in Russia...

Don't forget that their family also started to rule by fostering...

Real Romanovs died out with Empress Elizabeth who did foster a Holstein-Gottorp Prince to rule in Russia...
« Last Edit: January 20, 2012, 10:24:24 AM by Marc »

Offline QueenEna1887

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #206 on: January 20, 2012, 10:55:10 AM »
There are no true Romanovs I can agree with that but Prince Georgiy belongs to the Hohenzollern household he has nothing to do with the Romanovs.  By law his mother was married to a German prince and he was born a German prince.   He has nothing to do with the Romanovs as his mother, grandfather, and great-grandfather had no claims to the throne.....I wish Margarita would have revealed the name of the document she mentioned that wasn't to be opened until after Alexander II's death and the other document Alexander III proposed to protect his son's succession rights and the title of her book she wrote it in.

Offline Robert_Hall

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #207 on: January 20, 2012, 01:17:27 PM »
The Grand Duchess Marie [as she prefers to be caalled] is a very well respected and indeed liked in certain religious circles in Russia. Sh is very involved in the  Church, especially with charitable  programmes. And, she is accepted by the Putin administration as well as the Patriarch.
 Having said that, her so-called "claims" are a a conundrum. She is  "officially"  the "Curiatrix" of a nonexistent throne. And, she claims to be head of a non accepting family.
 Even the  "Roamnov" family association  makes  no claims to a throne that does not exist. It is just a family association much like any other.
 All this nonsense about "legitimate" claimants is just that, rubbish.
  To be pedantic, however, considering Romanov precedent,  Marie's son,. Georgi, is just as legitimate as any, despite his  Hohenzollern  heritage.  His father converted to Orthodoxy, after all  and was granted Imperial titles by Marie's father. For whatever that is worth.
 As has been mentioned, all these ancien rules are not in force. They are obsolete and  no longer valid. Stupid, pretentious vanity.
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Offline QueenEna1887

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #208 on: January 20, 2012, 06:51:18 PM »
Maria Vladimirovna has no rights to the throne and in 1992 she declared herself Head of the Imperial House in technicality she is not.  She and the members of her family have no claims to the empty throne and her son is a Hohenzollern his father converting to orthodoxy was completely useless as she and no one in her line had rights to the throne. She is NOT a grand duchess, the ukase written by Tsar Alexander III in 1885-1886 strictly states that the titles Grand Duke/Grand Duchess are titles strictly for sons and daughters and grandsons and granddaughters of an emperor, she was neither and Cyril's succession rights were lost when he betrayed the Czar.  It doesn't matter who later on converted to ROC....from what I hear Maria Vladimirovna's parents were not even married in the ROC but in the SOC, her mother was a noble and not a royal which was another violation of the law.  Her great-grandmother did not convert to orthodoxy until years later by then it was too late for she already had her children and heirs to the throne must be born to Orthodox mothers...plus the documents Margarita mentioned that are on file....you can say she has rights all you want but in reality she does not and her son does not belong to the Romanov dynasty.....plus the Russian government does not really acknowledge her as the Head of the Imperial House...not necessarily.  Her claims are silly and farcical.

Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: Grand Duke Kyrill, his wife Victoria Fedorovna and children, Part II
« Reply #209 on: January 21, 2012, 12:57:39 PM »
I think the last indisputable head of the family was Maria's father. After that there is no bullet proof candidate. The document in the Kremlin further pushes her claim as family rules DO apply and the central part of Maria's claim.