Author Topic: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1  (Read 225264 times)

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Offline Angie_H

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #195 on: May 16, 2007, 11:40:02 AM »
Well if you do the Person pages here are the pages with pics of the IF on them
281
335
336
337
338
339
348
412
464
You got keep hitting the page numbers on top or the arrow keys but if you accidentally hit an entry you gotta start at the beginning again

Offline jmjjmjjmj

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #196 on: August 01, 2007, 11:06:25 AM »
I recently acquired in Paris a set of three original photographs of the Vladimirovichi in a folding leather display portfolio. The photographs can be dated to about 1885-6 because of the apparent age of their youngest child, G.D. Helena, who appears to be 3 or 4.

The photograph in the middle is of G.D. Vladimir and his wife. The one on the right is the Grand Duchess and her four children (the back was labeled in French with the names and titles and Vladimir spelled with a “W”).

The one on the left appears to have the three Vladimirovichi boys with two other male adults. The one in the white uniform looks to me like Tsar Alexander, though his beard is shorter than I have seen it otherwise. The other one I first guessed to be G.D. Pavel. However, the Hussar uniform he is wearing is not decorated with the cords that I have otherwise seen in pictures of G.D. Pavel. Also, the man in the photo has less hair on his forehead than I have seen in photos of Pavel.

The photos have an embossed old-style cyrillic word at the bottom, presumably the name of photographic studio. In transliterated Russian it appears to me to be: Levtuxii . Also, the leather portfolio has the following on the back: Tonnel, 12 rue de la Paix, Paris. I checked and there is no company of that name presently at the address mentioned.

The provenance of the photos is also somewhat of a mystery.

The dealer is reputable, someone I met originally on a previous trip to Paris eight years ago. He is almost 90 and of Russian origin, though he left Russia in the 1960s. He told me he purchased them around 1970 in Rome from a relative (variously granddaughter or niece) of the former governess of G.D. Olga, the dowager Queen of Greece who was a daughter of G.D. Konstantin Nikolaevich. He also gave me reason on at least one of my visits to conclude that they had originally belonged to the Olga herself.

The specifics differed slightly during the three times I visited him, but that can be understood given his age and health and the fact that his daughter was on one occasion prompting him to recite again the provenance.

One corroborating fact is that eight years ago he had for sale a large leather portfolio containing two oval glass-covered photographs of G.D. Pavel and his first wife, Alexandra of Greece, who was Queen Olga’s daughter. (I foolishly delayed my decision to purchase it for a month during which it sold to someone else). He told me that all his Russian imperial artifacts came from this one purchase).

All that being said, why would Queen Olga’s governess (or perhaps more likely Queen Olga herself) have had three photos of the Vladimirovichi? Perhaps it was normal for members of the Imperial Family to share photos back and forth.

Any help identifying/confirming my identification as well as speculation on their provenance would be very much appreciated.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975315042

Offline Svetabel

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #197 on: August 01, 2007, 11:12:31 AM »
The man at left looks very much like GD Friedrich Franz III of Mecklenburg-Schwerin, brother of GDss Maria Pavlovna.  The little boy at left is more likely GD Kirill, the other little boy is then GD Boris.
The man at right is a mystery though, but he and the man in the hussar uniform not the Romanovs definitely.

Offline jmjjmjjmj

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #198 on: August 01, 2007, 11:38:33 AM »
Thanks for your help.  It might make sense that the men are relatives of Maria Pavlovna.

Here are copies of the photographs:

 http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212293/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212233/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975211991/

The photos in their casing:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212195/

The writing on the back:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212055/

Has anyone ever come across these photos before?

Offline Svetabel

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #199 on: August 01, 2007, 12:32:53 PM »
Thanks for your help.  It might make sense that the men are relatives of Maria Pavlovna.

Here are copies of the photographs:

 http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212293/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212233/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975211991/

The photos in their casing:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212195/

The writing on the back:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975212055/

Has anyone ever come across these photos before?

Actually I've never seen the pics. Thanks for sharing! :) Little Elena is just lovely :D

Offline jmjjmjjmj

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #200 on: August 02, 2007, 02:57:29 AM »
what can i say they were in a tinted shop window for probably about 35 years....

Offline jmjjmjjmj

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #201 on: August 02, 2007, 03:00:14 AM »
Is it possible brown/sepia is the original color of the photos?

Offline Svetabel

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #202 on: August 02, 2007, 11:50:28 AM »

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10824665@N03/975315042

The second man at right is more likely Duke Paul Friedrich, another brother of GDss Maria Pavlovna.

Compare, this is Duke Paul Friedrich



I am not a great expert on the military uniforms but they look almost the same (I mean the uniforms in the photos and the men of course  :) )

Offline jmjjmjjmj

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #203 on: August 02, 2007, 04:32:05 PM »
Wow, Svetabel, you're the greatest.  I really appreciate your help.  Same for Grandduchessella.  It is wonderful to have a complete story for the photos.

I have no intention of selling these, but I am wondering if there is anywhere where one might find more about recent prices for original photos.  (I realize condition is a major question, but anything would help in guaging reasonableness.)

Thanks again for your help.

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #204 on: August 02, 2007, 08:04:30 PM »
Wow, Svetabel, you're the greatest.  I really appreciate your help.  Same for Grandduchessella.  It is wonderful to have a complete story for the photos.

I have no intention of selling these, but I am wondering if there is anywhere where one might find more about recent prices for original photos.  (I realize condition is a major question, but anything would help in guaging reasonableness.)

Thanks again for your help.

You could start out with Ebay, though I'm sure there are more specific sites that could help. Checking out some of the prices for various antique photos, not just royals, might give you an idea for your own items. It would be helpful to know, if only for insurance purposes.
They also serve who only stand and wait--John Milton
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Offline Eric_Lowe

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #205 on: August 02, 2007, 08:05:54 PM »
That really depend on subject matter. Some subjects are hot while some are not... ::)

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #206 on: August 02, 2007, 08:07:01 PM »
It can give him a general idea--that's why I said a place to start.
They also serve who only stand and wait--John Milton
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Offline Svetabel

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #207 on: August 02, 2007, 10:17:18 PM »
Wow, Svetabel, you're the greatest. 

Thanks again for your help.

You are welcome. :) The photos you have are really rare, thanks for sharing again.

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #208 on: August 03, 2007, 04:18:57 PM »
That really depend on subject matter. Some subjects are hot while some are not... ::)

In case anyone's wondering, a single photo of the Vladimirs (entire family) that wasn't in tip-top shape (and had no royal provenance apparently) went for over $500. I'd get some insurance on those photos asap!  :)
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Offline ashanti01

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Re: The Vladimirovitchi - discussion and pictures Part 1
« Reply #209 on: August 10, 2007, 11:47:48 AM »


There is a wonderful photo from the same sitting with only Vladimir and Miechen and their bulldog :)

Is the pic?