Author Topic: Help with Prince Sergei Borisovich Stcherbatov (or Scherbatow or Scherbatoff)  (Read 20656 times)

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Offline BingandNelsonFan

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Hi! I am hoping that some of you who are much more adept at the various spellings of Russian names may be able to help me. I am trying to find information on Prince Sergei Borisovich Scherbatoff. All that I know is that he was born on 21 Jan 1870 in St. Petersburg and that he died on 31 May 1919 at Kharkov. Having been trying to trace Russian family members for a year now, I realize that even those dates could be wrong. :) To die on that date was he fighting or executed/murdered?

I have his wife as Elizaveta Sergyevna de Plaoutine (1875 - 1921).

I have their children as:
Boris (17 Oct 1897-1921)
Elizabeth (05 Nov 1898 - ?)
Marie (05 Jan 1900 - ?)
Irena (02 Sep 1901 - 1921)
Dimitri (1903-1981)
Tatiana (1905 - 01 Apr 2000)

If anyone can add to this, particularly where and how Prince Sergei died or info on the two daughters, Elizabeth and Marie, I would be very grateful! Also, does anyone know what Prince Sergei's profession was? Thanks!

Regards,
Sarah

Offline BingandNelsonFan

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Shamelessly bumping this post in the hopes that someone can help me.  :-[

I seem to remember reading that Prince Sergei was one of five brothers. Does anyone know anything about his family? Also, I have a note saying that his wife, Lily Plaoutine, was shot at Smolensk with two of her children and an old aunt of her husband's. It appears that the Aunt's name might be "Maria" or "Mania"?

If anyone has anything to add here or suggestions as to how I could find some information, I would be very appreciative. Thanks!
Regards,
Sarah

Offline Превед

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Shamelessly bumping this post in the hopes that someone can help me.  :-[

I seem to remember reading that Prince Sergei was one of five brothers. Does anyone know anything about his family? Also, I have a note saying that his wife, Lily Plaoutine, was shot at Smolensk with two of her children and an old aunt of her husband's. It appears that the Aunt's name might be "Maria" or "Mania"?

If anyone has anything to add here or suggestions as to how I could find some information, I would be very appreciative. Thanks!
Regards,
Sarah

Here is a Russian site with extracts from a memoir written by Prince Sergey Borisovich's nephew Alexey Shcherbatov which describe the events you mention: http://magazines.russ.ru/nj/2003/233/sherbat.html
You get a pretty good translation with Google Translate.

The family name is traditonally spelled Scherbatoff or Scherbatow in the West, nowadays transliterated as Shcherbatov in English. In Russian it's Щербатов.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2015, 05:10:26 PM by Превед »
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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I seem to remember reading that Prince Sergei was one of five brothers.

Yes, see here: http://ru.rodovid.org/wk/%D0%97%D0%B0%D0%BF%D0%B8%D1%81%D1%8C:290108
Four brothers (Nikolay, Pavel, Boris and Mikhail) and one sister: Anna. The memorialist mentioned above must have been the son of Pavel.
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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So the ones assasinated in Smolensk were:
- Prince Sergey Borisovich Shcherbatov.
- His wife Princess Yelisaveta ' Lily' Sergeyevna Shcherbatova née Plautina
- Their children Princess Irina Sergeyevna Shcherbatova (17 years) and Prince Dmitry Sergeyevich Shcherbatov (14 years).
- Princess Khovanskaya (Хованская), probably the aunt of Prince Alexey Pavlovich Shcherbatov.

Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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So the ones assasinated in Smolensk were:
- Prince Sergey Borisovich Shcherbatov.
- His wife Princess Yelizaveta ' Lily' Sergeyevna Shcherbatova née Plautina
- Their children Princess Irina Sergeyevna Shcherbatova (17 years) and Prince Dmitry Sergeyevich Shcherbatov (14 years).
- Princess Khovanskaya (Хованская), probably the aunt of Prince Alexey Pavlovich Shcherbatov.

Except that this site: http://ru.rodovid.org/wk/%D0%97%D0%B0%D0%BF%D0%B8%D1%81%D1%8C:331391 gives 1919 as year of death for Sergey, 1921 for Yelizaveta and 1981 for Dmitry!
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline BingandNelsonFan

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Hi! Thanks very much! This looks like it is answering several questions. I have had info from someone on this board (a couple of years ago) that Prince Sergei was killed 31 May 1919 at Kharkov (which matches the second link that you gave). They also thought that Sergei and Lily's son, Boris, was killed in 1921 at Smolensk. They also said that Dimitry escaped and lived until 1981 (also matching the second link). Any thoughts?

Interestingly, the first link with the memoir, states that Sergei and Lily's daughter Elizabeth also escaped with her younger sister, Tatiana. This only leaves one child, Marie, unaccounted for.

Thanks for the suggestion of the identity of Princess Khovanskaya. Looking it up in English, I am only getting a very old painting. :)

The following is the Google Translation of a sentence or two from the memory. Does he mean that the family was buried up there and then turned into a cemetery where others were buried after later executions?
Uncle Sergei, a famous artist, he loved his estate near Smolensk, not far from the Goats mountains, and did not want to leave it. Gave them as "employees of British intelligence" Alexander Engelhardt. Goats on the mountain, with the execution of my relatives began GPU cemetery, where many years later were destroyed five thousand Polish officers.

Will continue to work on this and post as I come up with anything.
Sarah


Offline BingandNelsonFan

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One more thought . . .

The Princess Khovanskaya almost has to be a generation farther back somehow, because the notes that I have (written by the daughter of an English cousin of Lily Scherbatoff who knew the family) refer to the aunt as "old aunt" already by 1910.

Sarah

Offline Превед

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The following is the Google Translation of a sentence or two from the memory. Does he mean that the family was buried up there and then turned into a cemetery where others were buried after later executions?
Uncle Sergei, a famous artist, he loved his estate near Smolensk, not far from the Goats mountains, and did not want to leave it. Gave them as "employees of British intelligence" Alexander Engelhardt. Goats on the mountain, with the execution of my relatives began GPU cemetery, where many years later were destroyed five thousand Polish officers.

Possibly. "The Goat Mountains" refers to Козьи Горы / Kozy Gory, a hamlet in the Smolensk area, close to Katyn, infamous for the massacre of Polish officers in WW2. GPU (Gosudarstvennoye Politicheskoye Upravlenie - State Political Directorate) was the official designation of the Cheka 1922 - 1923. Apparantly some (all?) of the Katyn victims were buried in Kozy Gory.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2015, 06:20:24 PM by Превед »
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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One more thought . . .

The Princess Khovanskaya almost has to be a generation farther back somehow, because the notes that I have (written by the daughter of an English cousin of Lily Scherbatoff who knew the family) refer to the aunt as "old aunt" already by 1910.

Indeed, she must have been very old - this being the person: http://ru.rodovid.org/wk/%D0%97%D0%B0%D0%BF%D0%B8%D1%81%D1%8C:481669
Princess Anna Sergeyevna Khovanskaya née Shchberbatova, presumably born sometimes in the 1830s.
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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Alexey Shcherbatov must have meant тетя, aunt, in a very general sense of the word, as it seems like you have to go back several centuries to find a common Shcherbatov ancestor for them.
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline Превед

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Alexey Shcherbatov must have meant тетя, aunt, in a very general sense of the word, as it seems like you have to go back several centuries to find a common Shcherbatov ancestor for them.

Yes, last common ancestor (at least in the agnatic Shcherbatov line) is Prince Mikhail Vasilyevich Shcherbatov in the 16th century! That is some "great aunt"!
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline BingandNelsonFan

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Hi! Thanks for all the help. You are right about the "old" aunt. She was old, and that is some great aunt! I suppose, though, that the family must have been close.

I have found an old note referencing a blog entry at http://mitino-smol.blogspot.co.uk/2012/06/blog-post_6732.html
Sadly, this blog seems to have been removed. All that I have is the Google Translation of the entry, so it's a bit rough, but it said this:

Quote
Shcherbatova (eq. Plautin), Elizabeth S. (1875-1921), was shot along with his family and household, on charges of belonging to a "criminal counter-revolutionary organization People's Union defend our freedom."

book. Shcherbatova Irina (1901-1921), the daughter of the previous one, shot on charges of belonging to a "criminal counter-revolutionary organization People's Union defend our freedom."
Family Scherbatova ES, DS, TS Scherbatova (nee Plautin) Elizabeth S.. She was born in 1875. Princess (married Prince Sergei Borisovich Shcherbatova), 1919 - widow. Lived with his son Dmitri and daughters. May 14, 1921 - arrested with his son, daughter Tatyana and a second daughter, as a "counter-revolutionary conspiracy participants," and imprisoned. Soon available together with her daughters, son remained in prison. In 1921 - died. Russia Family Tree. www.vgd.ru / SCH / schrbatv.htm SARF. F. R-8419. Op.1. D. 276. Pp. 17, 50. Shcherbaty Dmitry. He was born in 1903. Prince (father, Prince Sergey Shcherbatov; Shcherbatova mother Elizabeth S.). Resided in Smolensk, studied at the Institute. May 14, 1921 - arrested in his mother and sisters, was sentenced to imprisonment in a concentration camp and sent to Kholmogorsky camp. October 3, 1921 - a case of "counter-revolutionary conspiracy" has been discontinued, but was not released. In November, taken out of the camp in Arkhangelsk to Moscow, November 23 placed in Vologda county hospital with typhus, Dec. 23 placed in the provincial hospital, died in late December. Russia Family Tree. www.vgd.ru / SCH / schrbatv.htm SARF. F. R-8419. Op.1. D. 276. Pp. 17, 50. Scherbatova Tatjana. She was born in 1905. Princess (father, Prince Sergey Shcherbatov; Shcherbatova mother Elizabeth S.). Lived with his family Smolensk. May 14, 1921 - arrested with his mother, sister and brother Dmitry as "counter-revolutionary conspiracy participants," and imprisoned. Soon available. Poulchila higher education. Art critic, artist copyist, a member of the Union of Artists and Architects of Georgia, Honored Artist of Georgia. In 2000 - died in Smolensk.

Some info that someone on this forum was nice enough to give me a year or two ago matched some of the above. So far, it has been all that I've had to go on, but it is always quite a job to sort out these Russian families as there seem to be four or five sides to every story --- instead of the usual two! Here is the info that I had:

Quote
Elizaveta, Irina and Dmitiri were arrested and accused of contra-revolutionary activities on May 14, 1921. Irina was shot shortly afterwards. Elizaveta died that same year, either in captivity or at home.

Some sources, like the memoirs of his cousin Alexei Shcherbatov, have Dmitri shot in 1921 as well, but he escaped, fled to Siberia, changed his name to Vasili Kuzmich Shcherbakov, became a well-known scientist and died in 1981. He had two sons and many (grand)grandchildren.

Their daughter Tatiana married Boris Vladimirovich Shevyakov in 1930, in Leningrad, both were talented artists, he an art conserver, she a copier of freco’s. Their daughter Vera was born in 1931. However, Boris was arrested and sent to Solovki camp in 1935, where he died some years later.
 Tatiana and her daughter escaped to Georgia (South of Russia), where she became well-known in her art. She died in 2000. Her daughter Vera became an archeologist and lives today in Dedovsk, close to Moscow.

No one seems to be mentioning Boris anywhere, except for Alexey Shcherbatov in his memoirs.
Sarah

Offline Превед

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Glad to help!

Some sources, like the memoirs of his cousin Alexei Shcherbatov, have Dmitri shot in 1921 as well, but he escaped, fled to Siberia, changed his name to Vasili Kuzmich Shcherbakov, became a well-known scientist and died in 1981. He had two sons and many (grand)grandchildren.
Incredible. And he has a Russian Wikipedia article: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A9%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B1%D0%B0%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2,_%D0%92%D0%B0%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%9A%D1%83%D0%B7%D1%8C%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%87 It says he was saved by the servants of his parents, that they sent him to Siberia, that he kept his true identity secret all his life and only told his children shortly before his death.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2015, 05:51:17 PM by Превед »
Берёзы севера мне милы,—
Их грустный, опущённый вид,
Как речь безмолвная могилы,
Горячку сердца холодит.

(Афанасий Фет: «Ивы и берёзы», 1843 / 1856)

Offline BingandNelsonFan

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Fabulous! Thanks for the link to the web page. I have saved all of that. It seems that there is no question what happened to Dimitry --- or Tatiana.

I have just found a listing for the Scherbatoffs in the 1939 edition of the "Nouvel Almanach du Corps Diplomatique: Ancien Almanach de Gotha"
I had no trouble reading the first part (and it seems to answer the question of what happened to Serge and his son, Boris):

Quote
1. Pr. Serge, ne a St-Petersbourg 21 Janv. 1870, a Kharkov 31 Mai 1919, att. au min. de l'interieur russe; m. a St-Petersbourg 12 Janv. 1897 a Elisabeth Plaoutine (noblesse hered. russe), nee a St-Petersbourg 2 Mars 1875, (fusillee) a Smolensk . . . . 1921, demoiselle d'honn. des Imperatrices de Russie.

Enfants: 1) Pr. Boris, nee a St-Petersbourg 17 Oct 1897, (fusille) a Arkhangel . . . . 1920, aspirant russe.
2) Psse Elisabeth, nee a St-Petersbour 5 Nov. 1898. [ . . . . ]
3) Psse Marie, nee a Florence 5 Janv. 1900. [ . . . . ]
4) Psse Irene, nee a Liban 2 Sept 1901, (fusillee) a Smolensk . . . . 1921.

But I cannot read the place of birth for Dmitry or Tatiana . . . and that is who I need. The place names just will not translate. Can anyone read French or figure where these place are? Here is the image of the page:



Thanks in advance!
Sarah
« Last Edit: February 14, 2015, 07:06:40 PM by BingandNelsonFan »