Author Topic: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton  (Read 45084 times)

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Offline TimM

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #90 on: August 21, 2016, 07:06:16 AM »
Thanks, Greg and Janet, for these excerpts.

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #91 on: August 21, 2016, 12:19:05 PM »
Quote
I find amazing that so many people simply think that the transition to some kind of constitutional government could be easily done in Russia, had it not being for the "weak-willed" Nicholas II, the "silly" Alexandra and Rasputin, the "representative of the power of darkness". These same people would probably express doubt about the possibility of planting palm trees along the avenues of Sant Petersburg...

"It was stupid of the tsar not to do away with autocracy and become a constitutional monarch" is a view that ignores completely the situation in the Russian countryside, the little support for liberal politicians (and their dubious behaviour), the widespread terrorism, the revolutionary networks...


Yeah, but keeping the Autocracy didn't exactly help them either.  

Looks like Nicky and Alix were screwed no matter what they did.  


Autocracy (or rather, autocratic measures) MIGHT have saved the Russian monarchy. What caused the overthrow of the monarchy was the war. And what caused the (European) war was Russia's general mobilization. The tsar might have decided to resist any pressure and not to get involved in the Balkans whatever happened. The final decision depended on him and he blocked the order for general mobilization ONCE. At the second attempt he gave in.
After the murder in Sarajevo, in order for Russia not to be dragged into the war, Nicholas II should have had to apply a lot of autocratic measures:

1. Fire a lot of people: Foreign Minister Sazonov, Minister of Agriculture Krivoshein (one of the main hawks), Minister of War Sukhomlinov, chief of General Staff Yanuskevich, ambassador in Paris Izvolsky... and many senior officers in the army and the State administration. A real purge, but not like Stalin's: with a dismissal letter thanking them for their services to the motherland, a generous pension and maybe one medal or two.

2. Have a family talk with the Grand Dukes (specially with Grand Duke Nicholas, married to a Montenegrin princess).

3. Dissolve the Duma and rule by decree, as a temporary measure.

4. Impose strict censure.

5. Through the procurator of the Holy Synod let the bishops know that preaching about the suffering of "our orthodox brothers, the Serbs" was completely verboten.

6. Find a reliable statesman that could help him along the process. The most difficult part: Stolypin had been murdered, Witte and Nicholas disliked each other but maybe they could patch up their quarrel.

7. Sign a whole batch of laws to improve the lot of workers (for example: resurrect Zubatov's state-sponsored trade unions and make negotiation with a government-appointed mediator compulsory to solve conflicts between labour and factory owners). Lowering some taxes would also help.

Certainly not easy, but not impossible and it was precisely autocracy what allowed it.

If Russia had not mobilized, there would have been a short war between the Austro-Hungarian Empire and Serbia (with Bulgaria and Albania joining on the side of Austria towards the end, to get some spoils) instead a horrible world war, followed by a horrible Revolution, followed by a horrible Civil War, followed by a horrible Communist regime, followed by the rising of the horrible Nazi regime, followed by yet another horrible world war, the Holocaust, Hiroshima, the Communist occupation of half of Europe...

Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #92 on: August 23, 2016, 02:02:38 PM »
Chapter eight is the first of two whole chapters devoted to the coronation day itself, as we cast our eye over every rank of society involved, from the man at the centre of the ceremonies, to the diplomats and guests, to the onlookers and tourists.

https://coronationofnicholasii.wordpress.com/2016/08/23/extracts-from-chapter-8/

Shake your chains to earth like dew
Which in sleep had fallen on you -
Ye are many; they are few.

Offline rgt9w

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #93 on: August 24, 2016, 08:01:48 PM »
I was really surprised by the callous treatment of the victims of the Khodynka tragedy.  Given the numerous religious services the Imperial Family attended on a regular basis, I was shocked that there was no official service for those killed at Khodynka field during the coronation.

Offline Greg_King

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #94 on: August 24, 2016, 09:09:22 PM »
Indeed...they should have followed the advice of Dowager Empress Marie Feodorovna and the Minister of the Imperial Court and held (and attended) a memorial service - it probably would have gone a long way in demonstrating public sympathy with the victims.  But again Nicholas let himself be talked out of (and threatened out of) such a plan that may have helped ease the situation.

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #95 on: August 25, 2016, 03:59:00 AM »
I agree that a memorial service was an obvious and proper thing.

Any indication as to who talked Nicholas out of it, and on what basis?

Ann

Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #96 on: August 25, 2016, 04:28:56 AM »
Chapter Nine covers the second part of coronation day, as Nicholas is crowned and the onlooking world forms its own, various views of the young couple at the centre of everything. Dinner and public appearances follow, and there are some deliberate departures from convention in the name of increasing the imperial regime's visibility or popularity, as Mandell Creighton, Bishop of Peterborough, learns....

https://coronationofnicholasii.wordpress.com/2016/08/25/extracts-from-chapter-nine/
Shake your chains to earth like dew
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Ye are many; they are few.

Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #97 on: August 25, 2016, 04:54:11 AM »
I agree that a memorial service was an obvious and proper thing.

Any indication as to who talked Nicholas out of it, and on what basis?

Ann

"The uncles" felt that a service would detract from the "joyous" celebrations, and that Nicholas's visit to the hospital was enough to show sympathy. I don't think they really needed to do much talking him out of it, since nothing even got as far as the planning stage. When KR suggested such a service, Nicholas did not even reply. At every point, he was trying to avoid hectoring from his uncles. (Ella's enthusiastic espousal of her husband's viewpoint also throws a darker light on her character at this point in her life.)
It's interesting, on the other hand, to note how conservative Russia, as epitomised by senior officials and right-wing journalists like Alexei Suvorin, reacted to his decision. Many reactions were not what you'd expect.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 04:57:25 AM by Janet Ashton »
Shake your chains to earth like dew
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Ye are many; they are few.

Offline Joanna

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #98 on: August 25, 2016, 10:26:33 AM »
Court Painter – Mihaly Zichy (1827-1906)

Collection of paintings, drawings, etc in the Winter Palace including coronation years.

https://winterpalaceresearch.blogspot.ca/2016/08/court-painter-mihaly-zichy-1827-1906.html

Joanna

Offline TimM

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #99 on: August 26, 2016, 07:07:06 AM »
Those uncles really liked sticking their noses in, didn't they.

Too bad Nicky never worked up the backbone to stand up to them.
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Offline Janet Ashton

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #100 on: August 29, 2016, 06:35:52 AM »
Speaking of Khodynka.....
Chapter ten opens with the sense of anti-climax that envelopes the city when the coronation is over. But the most memorable of days have yet to come. As Nicholas cringes at the domestic dramas epitomised by his former mistress's starring role in the Coronation Gala, a far larger tragedy is starting to unfold elsewhere in the city, its real-life theme of peasant sacrifice far eclipsing that of the coronation's leitmotif opera, "A Life for the Tsar."

https://coronationofnicholasii.wordpress.com/2016/08/29/extracts-from-chapter-ten/
Shake your chains to earth like dew
Which in sleep had fallen on you -
Ye are many; they are few.

Offline TimM

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #101 on: August 30, 2016, 07:13:44 AM »
And the drama continues. 

I've always wondered something.  Alexander III died in 1894, yet Nicky was not officially crowned until 1896.  What took so long?
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Offline Kalafrana

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #102 on: August 30, 2016, 07:26:15 AM »
Bear in mind that Nicholas succeeded in November 1894, and a year of official morning then followed. Coronations don't tend to be scheduled in winter.

Alexander III succeeded in March 1881, but was not crowned until 1883.

Ann

Offline TimM

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #103 on: August 31, 2016, 06:52:52 AM »
Yeah, that makes sense.  Thanks for the info.
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Offline Kalafrana

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Re: A Life for the Tsar King/Ashton
« Reply #104 on: August 31, 2016, 01:46:26 PM »
Part of the delay in Alexander III's coronation was that Olga Alexandrovna was born on 13 June 1882. Marie F would not have appeared in public for some months before and after, pushing the earliest possible date for the coronation, given the desire for fine weather, to spring 1883.

Our present Queen succeeded on 6 February 1952, but was not crowned until 2 June 1952, between court mourning and the desire for good weather. In the event, it poured all day!

Ann