Discussions about Russian History > Imperial Russian History
Why was Alaska sold?
Belochka:
--- Quote ---Now, it's easy to say, as a westerner and/or American, that of course the Sovs were lying about this, and there are of course plenty of reasons to believe they were!
--- End quote ---
Both my parents and I were taught by Soviet pedagogues that Alexander II sold Alyaska. A topic which we discussed around the table when I was young. If anything this commercial action would have highlighted the stupidity of this decsion on geo-strategic terms.
There was a debate on the Bill in Congress which voted in June 1868, months after the Americans took possession of Alyaska:
113 in favor of payment to Russia, 43 against and 44 abstaining.
The delay was attributed to the fact that there was an attempt to impeach Johnson at the time.
The sale was negotiated by Baron Edouard de Stoeckl.
LisaDavidson:
I really hope this Forum can remain a welcome place for all. If it becomes too politicized, we lose that.
Dashkova, I realize you were taught differently in Soviet schools, but the fact remains that Alaska was sold to the US, and there is a treaty to back this up. And, while the US government has made mistakes, I think it highly unfair of you to say the US government lied to its citizens to the degree that the USSR lied to its people.
As an American, I cannot sit back and allow that statement to remain unchallenged. You are certainly welcome to hate the United States, I just respectfully request you take it elsewhere. It has no place here.
Dashkova:
--- Quote ---I really hope this Forum can remain a welcome place for all. If it becomes too politicized, we lose that.
Dashkova, I realize you were taught differently in Soviet schools, but the fact remains that Alaska was sold to the US, and there is a treaty to back this up. And, while the US government has made mistakes, I think it highly unfair of you to say the US government lied to its citizens to the degree that the USSR lied to its people.
As an American, I cannot sit back and allow that statement to remain unchallenged. You are certainly welcome to hate the United States, I just respectfully request you take it elsewhere. It has no place here.
--- End quote ---
Excuse me, but where exactly have I stated that I hate the U.S.? Does it not occur to you that I TOO AM AN AMERICAN. I am a 14th GENERATION AMERICAN, as a matter of fact which I can prove in spades. *I* was personally never taught anything in Soviet schools, as I never attended any of them. I do know a great many people who did, however, and was *****simply**** reporting what they told me. In my opinion ONLY, the "truth" they were told is absolutely NO better than the "truths" that have been told to me, as an AMERICAN citizen, by my own government.
Of the great many treaties that the US has signed over the years with nations within (meaning the American Indians) and without, EVERY single treaty was broken, in many cases before the ink was even dry.
As I stated earlier, being married into a POW/MIA family for nearly 20 years I learned a LOT about how the US government deals and does not deal in truth to its own citizens.
VERY close to the sorts of lies the USSR told to its citizens. The propaganda apparatus of both countries in question have many remarkable similiarities.
How this equates to HATE of the US is QUITE beyond me, as you were the one who put those words in my mouth.
Distrust of the US government? Dislike of the US government? YES, as any *thinking* American citizen would have. It's called being VIGILANT and honest about those (whether appointed, born to it, or elected) who DO lord over us and control what is and what is not told to the populace.
Dashkova:
--- Quote ---Dashkova,
How do you explain that Alaska gained Statehood in 1959?
Why did the Soviets not reclaim "their" territory during the Cold War, especially since there were a number of U.S. military bases located along the coast?
??? ???
--- End quote ---
*IF* (and of *course* it's an IF) there is any truth to the "lease" agreement, it *does* make sense that the late 50s would be a good time to make Alaska "officially" a state, since the centennial of "Seward's Folly", in 1958, was at hand.
Elisabeth:
I think it's always a mistake to compare the United States and Russia/the Soviet Union in terms of political history and human rights. Russia always falls short in these categories, which give a warped view of its overall contributions to humanity. Obviously, whatever crimes the U.S. has committed (slavery being one outstanding example) the Constitution is such that it guarantees an evolution of ideas and historical realities, such as we never witnessed in the Soviet Union at least. So.... in my opinion, what would be more productive for thoughtful discussion is a new thread, or even chapter/forum, addressing the Russian arts. Because one might just as easily argue, why are the Russian arts (literature, music, ballet, etc.) so demonstrably superior to those in the United States - ? If you want to compare. But I think a thread on the Russian arts is in and of itself a worthy topic, comparisons aside (comparisons, in my opinion, come cheap anyway!).
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