Did Nicholas II Have any Illegitimate Children

[Phil_tomaselli]

Has anyone come across any references to Nicholas having a illegitimate son known as Simeon Samsonov, or come across any references to a Mrs Marsden in connection with the family?

Phil Tomaselli

[helenazar]

Has anyone come across any references to Nicholas having a illegitimate son known as Simeon Samsonov....

Where did you get this information?  

[Phil_tomaselli]

It's come up in connection with an aborted rescue attempt for Nicholas in 1917.  I'm working on an article on it but, if nothing comes of that, I'll put the whole source text on the site for all and sundry to pick over.

Phil Tomaselli

[otmafan]

I am pretty sure that this is nothing accurate. I wouldn't pay attention to it.

[Belochka]

Nikolai II being a pious man was always faithful to his wife and family.

[Phil_tomaselli]

Not disputing that, but he married aged 27(?).  absolutely no dalliances before the wedding?  The rest of the Russian aristocracy seem to have been at it like knives.  No mistresses, courtesans, ballerinas etc in the cupboard?

[rskkiya]

Phil....
   Nicholas did have a mistress before he married Alixandra, the ballet dancer Mathilde Kchechinskiya, (sp ) and although this enterprising woman did take at least two other Romanovs as lovers and did have an son out of wedlock, there is no evidence that she had any offspring by Nicholas.

rskkiya

[lexi4]

Has anyone come across any references to Nicholas having a illegitimate son known as Simeon Samsonov, or come across any references to a Mrs Marsden in connection with the family?

Phil Tomaselli

You've got my attention here Phil.  I would like to know more.

[bluetoria]

When Nicholas was engaged to Alix he told her about his affair with Matilda K. (whose surname I can't spell!!) & Alix said she appreciated his honesty. If he were prepared to tell her about Matilda, he would surely have told her about anyone else & there is nothing to suggest that he ever did...so it sounds like this alleged illegitimate child is yet another of those 'secret children' who keep appearing all over the Forum...

I dare say sooner or later one of Queen Victoria's & one Ella's will crop up!!  

[Svetabel]

And what about an illegetimate daughter of Nicholas?
Well, there was a TV-program on our cental Russian channel about Mathilda K. Some insignificant russian politician (actually I do not remember his name) claims himself a descendant of Nicholas.The claimant told a story "of vital importance" that in fact Mathilda's niece Zelina (or Celina)was her daughter from Nicholas.Frankly I did not hear any weighty argument of such proofs.
Complete nonsense.  

[Forum Admin]

Don't forget, Nicholas was in a VERY different position as heir to the throne with respect to any offspring. He was WELL aware of this, and in fact was reminded of it constantly by his "handlers" in the Court.  He knew better than to get anyone pregnant before marriage.

[AGRBear]

Knowing what a person should do is one side of the coin.

On the other side of the coin is what a person does.

Getting women pregnant was a constant problem from Tsar on down to the peasant.

I remember a story about young village women, who had won various titles like  Queen of the Grapes, being sent off to be honored by the royals only to return pregnant, so, the various communities refused to send their young women to St. Petersburg.

I think people who think it only happen to peasants in those times are a little naive.

One of the reasons the royals dated ballerinas was because these ladies couldn't afford to get pregnant and knew how to deal with one if it did occur.

The other reason the royals rowed across the river to the gypsy islands was to get more than just a few bottles of wine and watch some dancer swinging her hips.

I do not know if Nicholas II had any children out of wedlock.  I would not be surprisesd if there isn't one or two "love" children.

Hasn't anyone wondered about the kitchen boy, Leonid Sednev, and why he was chosen to remain with the IF?  Wouldn't it be ironic if the boy was Nicholas II's bastard and was the one saved because he was a peasant?  Of course, that is a WILD speculation, but wouldn't it be something if he were.  Anyone know of any  photographs of Leonid?

[AGRBear]

The Tsarevich and his family were imprisoned in their own palace in Tsarskoe Selo soon after his father had to give up the Russian throne.  Their beloved home was no longer a private place and not nearly as clean.   Add all this to whatever deprivations and hardships Alexei Nikolaevich had borne due to his illness, and whatever isolation from the world rendered him somewhat of a lonely boy....

Very few friends remained in Alexei's circle after March 1917.  Two boys, his best friend Kolya Derevenko and a palace servant, Leonid Sednev, were the young prince's last peers.  Both of them accompanied the Imperial Family to Tobolsk on the last day of July 1917.   Kolya Derevenko got a second to last letter from Alexei probably just before his final illness and the journey he took with his sisters to rejoin his parents and Maria Nikolaevna in Yekaterinburg.  Leonid Sednev was sent away from the Ipatiev House the day before the Tsarevich and his family were murdered.

The only girl that even remotely figures in any prince and princess story involving Alexei was Princess Ileana of Romania.  The two little royal children met before the First World War, when the royal families of Russia and Romania got together in Costanza and Prince Carol of Romania meant to propose to Olga Nikolaevna.  Little Ileana was four years younger than the Tsarevich - still a boyish prankster at his age, but coming up with his own innocent proposal to her, no doubt in order to make things right.

[AGRBear]

Couldn't find anything on Simeon Samsonov.

Wilson and King on p. 54 mention a General Alexander Samsonov's Second Imperial Army marching into the forests at Tenenberg where they "were mowed down by enemy artillery".... Samsonov was so "humilated that he rode off into the woods and shot himself".

AGRBear

[lexi4]

Phil,
I haven't been able to find anything either. But I don't think I would dismiss it.