Author Topic: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain  (Read 277755 times)

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SSKENDER

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #60 on: November 21, 2005, 10:41:17 AM »
If I can provide my own opinions on this matter, regarding Queen Sofia.

While by many, the Queen is considered cold, aloof, etc., one must take into account her upbringing and education.  

Do not forget that the Queen received a strict royal upbringing, one that was re-inforced in her everyday her duties as a Princess, as the daughter of a reigning King. She was instilled with Royal duty, Royal Duty, Royal Duty.  There was no leeway.  Furthermore, the situation in then conservative Greece, made it that the royal children were very sheltered, and were required to uphold certain ideals and certain codes of behavior.

For instance, as a teenager, her brother, then Crown Prince Constantine, was bad-mouthed, simply because he wanted to frequent the "bouzoukia" night clubs, that had become the rage in the 50s.

They say Juan Carlos is the total opposite, happy go lucky, funny, carefree, etc.  Quite frankly, as a child and adolescent, he didn't have the constraints that Sofia had, since he wasn't a Prince of a Reigning House, nor slated to take over the Throne of Spain till he was almost 30!  This is quite different from Sofia, who had to deal with Royal Life from the minute she was born, and mostly importantly, from the age of 8, when her father became King.

The fact that she puts duty above all else, her duty as Queen of Spain, her duty to the Spaniards, is highly commendable.  Even more so, her abilities as a very hands on mother.  

The very few traces of her truly personal non-Queen side that we are able to catch, clearly shows how truthful and warm the Queen can be.
I mean, look at her trips to Greece, when the Greeks flock around her, clearly in awe and charmed by her, as she walks around her fellow countrymen like she never left.  And this, in a country with people that turn all colors of the rainbow at the mention of her brother's name!!

In regards to Queen Frederica, that Nazi business is total non-sense in my opinion.  After all, she spent a lot of her youth in Austria, which was clearly out of the Nazi path until the forced Aunshluss, which didn't occur until 1938 anyway, and by that time, she was already married in Greece.
Like Marlene Koenig mentioned, all aristocrats had to be members of the Nazi party, or force losing their status and property, their liberty.  
Does anyone nowadays fault Putin for being a former KGB member?
It also neglects the fact that her father, Prince Ernst-August, consulted Queen Mary of the UK, who advised him to send Frederica to Italy, to get away from the Nazis.  
Read some of her letters to her parents, as the Nazis and Italians were invading Greece, and you get a sense of where her priorities lay.

Regards to all,

Eric_Lowe

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #61 on: November 21, 2005, 08:05:57 PM »
I agree everything you said about Queen Sofia. That she put duty beyond all things makes her acceptance of all her children's partners (especially Letizia) very moving. They are reported to be great friends. No Grand Duchess Augusta of Mecklenburg-Strelitz type of snobbery here nor was the Minnie of Denmark interference.

As for Frederica, her sense of being a strong woman and her redical politics put her into conflict with everybody (her relatives included). The Greek people  (Monarchist) still blame her for responsibility for the fall of the monarchy there. No her case was not cut and dry.

Offline Eurohistory

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #62 on: November 22, 2005, 10:27:44 AM »
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Eurohistory. First of all, i have not desqualifyed any member of this group discussion. But I have been called stupid openly. If we consider here princess sophie as an historical personnage., i have the perfect right to post my point of vue, as others do with other queenss of the past. These oppinions are not new, even they have been published and these books are legal. Unless I express pornographic, violent terms or insult directly (what i have not done) you have any right to delete anything in the name of the liberty of expression and oppinion. this was possible in the imperial Persia, however.All hateful my ideas are for you, your task as moderator is to prevent others from insults to me. Of course your own oppinion is respectful to me.

               Now. I have not said the prince had starved in Miame, just he was starving. It was a metaphore for signifying he had no money and serious economical problems. I know the material cause of his death. However, you did'nt know about the existence of Leandro, for when I named him, you started to speak of other Alfonsos. Only Umigon noticed that.

  I'm not so surprised as you assured i would be. I have heard your arguments before. Youcan not justify the nazi cooperation by tellig they were not unique. There were persons who never cooperated and flyed from Europe. Horrors and injustices commenced in the 30's.
althought the hell was at the end..

          I cant beleive what I heard, it's surrealistic. Farah Diva was a distant being surrounded by emeralds while iranian people suffered the misery. Her excess and ostentation have few examples of comparison in all the history. How she was hated by her people!She was another Imelda Marcos. she escaped the execution by miracle.What are you talking about??? :o :o

             How many hypocrisy. Eva Sanun was worse than Letizia for practising top-less. However the king likes it very much for he had a well known affair with one of the top-less "queens " of the 70's BR. That's what i call to be near the people.

               You can say all you want to argue (cigarette girl etc...) and you deny me the same right. Why? ???


                I am not obliged to speak of princess sopfia in different terms of another women for i don't regognise her as my queen, and i am in my right.


You are not in your right to insult.  As moderator I will delet your posts if I find them insulting and disrespectful.  You have so far referred to Queen Noor, Empress Farah and Queen Sofia in terms that border bad behavior.  You are advised of what I will do, plain and simple.

Discussing is one thing, insulting is quite another.  It is obvious here that you have a deep dislike towards HM, that is indeed yout "right," but what is not your right is to be insulting.

Arturo Beéche
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darius

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #63 on: November 23, 2005, 05:40:42 AM »
The Queen of Spain is a wonderful example of a modern Queen Consort. Those who see her as aloof have obviously not seen her interaction with the families of the dead after the Madrid bombings in their time of sorrow nor her friendly interaction with the press after the birth of the Infanta Elenor in her time of personal joy. I have no doubt however that she did her utmost to ensure the restoration of the Bourbons in 75 and could be ruthless in defence of the dynasty. In the words of her husband she is no doubt "a true professional".
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by darius »

Offline isabel

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #64 on: November 23, 2005, 11:41:42 AM »
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The Queen of Spain is a wonderful example of a modern Queen Consort. Those who see her as aloof have obviously not seen her interaction with the families of the dead after the Madrid bombings in their time of sorrow nor her friendly interaction with the press after the birth of the Infanta Elenor in her time of personal joy. I have no doubt however that she did her utmost to ensure the restoration of the Bourbons in 75 and could be ruthless in defence of the dynasty. In the words of her husband she is no doubt "a true professional".



Our Queen is a "true professional", i think it´s absolutly true. She is a woman too, we can´t forget this.

Perhaps she has her defaults, sure, but appart the professional (and a good one), she has been an excelent mother and wife.

I will never forget  her tears looking his husband, the King, in the funeral of his father D. Juan the Borbon.

As a spanish i am very proud to have a Queen as her.

Grand_Duke

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #65 on: November 23, 2005, 02:02:36 PM »
I like the Spanish RF very much: they all seem very nice and honest people.

I like and respect them more than the Windsors or the Grimaldis.

Don't forget the human behaviour the Spanish RF showed during the 11th March 2004 terrorist attack.


Offline Laura_

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #66 on: November 23, 2005, 03:04:06 PM »
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I like the Spanish RF very much: they all seem very nice and honest people.

I like and respect them more than the Windsors or the Grimaldis.

Don't forget the human behaviour the Spanish RF showed during the 11th March 2004 terrorist attack.



I totally agree with you!!!!!!they are better than the Windsors  and far better than the Grimaldis...maybe the Danish Royal Family "matches" them
Laura


crotalo

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #68 on: November 25, 2005, 04:13:52 AM »
Quote
If I can provide my own opinions on this matter, regarding Queen Sofia.

While by many, the Queen is considered cold, aloof, etc., one must take into account her upbringing and education.  

Do not forget that the Queen received a strict royal upbringing, one that was re-inforced in her everyday her duties as a Princess, as the daughter of a reigning King. She was instilled with Royal duty, Royal Duty, Royal Duty.  There was no leeway.  Furthermore, the situation in then conservative Greece, made it that the royal children were very sheltered, and were required to uphold certain ideals and certain codes of behavior.

For instance, as a teenager, her brother, then Crown Prince Constantine, was bad-mouthed, simply because he wanted to frequent the "bouzoukia" night clubs, that had become the rage in the 50s.

They say Juan Carlos is the total opposite, happy go lucky, funny, carefree, etc.  Quite frankly, as a child and adolescent, he didn't have the constraints that Sofia had, since he wasn't a Prince of a Reigning House, nor slated to take over the Throne of Spain till he was almost 30!  This is quite different from Sofia, who had to deal with Royal Life from the minute she was born, and mostly importantly, from the age of 8, when her father became King.

The fact that she puts duty above all else, her duty as Queen of Spain, her duty to the Spaniards, is highly commendable.  Even more so, her abilities as a very hands on mother.  

The very few traces of her truly personal non-Queen side that we are able to catch, clearly shows how truthful and warm the Queen can be.
I mean, look at her trips to Greece, when the Greeks flock around her, clearly in awe and charmed by her, as she walks around her fellow countrymen like she never left.  And this, in a country with people that turn all colors of the rainbow at the mention of her brother's name!!

In regards to Queen Frederica, that Nazi business is total non-sense in my opinion.  After all, she spent a lot of her youth in Austria, which was clearly out of the Nazi path until the forced Aunshluss, which didn't occur until 1938 anyway, and by that time, she was already married in Greece.
Like Marlene Koenig mentioned, all aristocrats had to be members of the Nazi party, or force losing their status and property, their liberty.  
Does anyone nowadays fault Putin for being a former KGB member?
It also neglects the fact that her father, Prince Ernst-August, consulted Queen Mary of the UK, who advised him to send Frederica to Italy, to get away from the Nazis.  
Read some of her letters to her parents, as the Nazis and Italians were invading Greece, and you get a sense of where her priorities lay.

Regards to all,



          Yes, I understand now. Simply, with all respect and consideration , we have not the same concept of Liberty in all senses, of choice and of priorities. I would prefer to die to put my arm in such a manner.

                As for you, Eurohistory. You can not understand the dolour of my family assassined in the spanish civil war and my politic family disapperared in Germany. This can not be deleted. You can not delete it.

I repeat. Sincerelly and respectfully. I would loose properties, status, and even life before justifying such a cooperation, and you must respect this as I underestand that everyone has his own morality.

It seems that you think i am insensible to terrorist recent events. But i suffer them as mines for I have my relatives shamefully interred and I dont know where.

you seems sensible to believe in tears. Please respect mines.

Offline Eurohistory

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #69 on: November 26, 2005, 06:11:51 PM »
Most of my father's grandmother's relations were exterminated in the Holocaust.  The last name disappeared in the male line after 1945 and in the female line after my great-grandmother's death in 1958.

Do I hate Germans for that?  No...I hate the ideology that brought a civilized nation to such brutality.

As sorry as I am for anyone losing relations in the circumstances here discussed, that does not excuse by any means channeling those dislikes and phobias to present-day people who had nothing to do with events which took place in 1930-1940.

Plain and simple...at issue here is the fact that disrespectful terms were used to refer to Queen doña Sofía as well as other royal ladies who have earned great respect.

End it please.  No more sob stories, no more irate ramblings against people, no more disrespectful terms.  Facts first and foremost.

ONE MORE POST ON THIS TOPIC THAT DEALS WITH NON-FACTUAL RAMBLINGS...AND I WILL DELETE IT...PLAIN and SIMPLE.

This is a discussion board about the Spanisg royal family, not a therapy session for people to use and abuse.

Arturo Beéche
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Eurohistory »
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crotalo

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #70 on: November 27, 2005, 05:01:10 AM »
Queen Sophia is certainly a Great Woman , discret, serious,professional. She is engaged to many humanitary organizations and cultural events. She is a very cultivated lady who speaks several languages. Excellent mother and wife. She is reserved and beloved by her subjects. Queen Noor is a person of an extraordinary quality, the Light of Jordania and Farah Diva deserves all the considerations for her dignity.

Do you agree with me? I would like to entertain this topic alive. But i'm affraid if we all agree we will be a little bored :'(

  FA, i feel abused. My liberty of expression is being threatened. I have read threads in bad terms of royals who are dead, (Catherine de Medicis, Hnry VIII etc etc)
However it is correct. But nobody feel angry. and deads deserve even more respect, for they can not defend themselves, you know. Politic, history is politic, monarchy is politic. Serious: History is serious, too serious. personal. history is too personal for we all do history:You are history, so i am.

         If you find something disrespectful here, delete, please. My "abuse" ends just where starts your perfect right of passing over. I don't oblige anybody to look for me. I would not accept to have a gratuite therapy for in that case you should to pay too the bill. you can not deny we have got quite fun ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by crotalo »

Jackswife

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #71 on: November 27, 2005, 06:00:29 AM »
 I don't think Juan Carlos could have chosen a better Queen: I'm sure there are those who don't agree but it seems Sofia has worked very hard alongside the King to create favorable feelings among Spaniards for the monarchy. (I think the King will be a hard act to follow but that's another thread) ;). As for Frederika, she unfortunately chose to back the  Nazi regime (as did some other royals at the time) but that is not Sofia's fault. I'm sure Sofia loved her mother very much but I can't see her approving or supporting her mother's bad decisions.

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #72 on: November 27, 2005, 02:56:24 PM »
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I don't think Juan Carlos could have chosen a better Queen: I'm sure there are those who don't agree but it seems Sofia has worked very hard alongside the King to create favorable feelings among Spaniards for the monarchy. (I think the King will be a hard act to follow but that's another thread) ;). As for Frederika, she unfortunately chose to back the  Nazi regime (as did some other royals at the time) but that is not Sofia's fault. I'm sure Sofia loved her mother very much but I can't see her approving or supporting her mother's bad decisions.


When Princess Friederike of Hannover was photographed sporting the Hitler Youth uniform she was in her teens.  Youngsters in Germany had to join these organizations or else.  The Hannovers, as with many other royals felt initially that Hitler and National Socialism would bring back the order the propserity Germany lost during the Weimer Republic.  Eventually we all know that was not the case and instead bigger ills were visited on this cultured nation.  Friederike did NOT "choose to back the Nazi regime."  In fact she, and all the Greek royals, were quite vocal in their opposition to Germany's meddling in Greece.

I would ask that if you are going to accuse Friederike of Hannover of being a Nazi, you herewith provide the evidence for such a claim.

I for one, would be most interested in seeing the sources that back your assertions, and I trust many more would also be most interested in the sourcing for these claims.

Arturo Beéche
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Eric_Lowe

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #73 on: November 27, 2005, 08:32:18 PM »
Yes I agree with Arturo, the case for her being a Nazi was not a strong one. Nobody seriously thinks she was  genuine, although she wore the uniform (although the association was an unfortunate one, as you remember when Prince Claus marries Queen Beatrix, the only sin they could find was that he was a member of the Hitler youth). No... Frederica's problems started when she involved herself with politics in Greece, a thing her daughter Sofia did not.

Offline isabel

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Re: King Juan Carlos & Queen Sofia of Spain
« Reply #74 on: November 29, 2005, 12:12:01 PM »
Absolutly agree with Eric and Arturo.

There is a very beautiful song of Jean Jacques Goldman, titled "If i was born.........", about the place and the times we are born.

Can we affirm that if we were born in Germany, in those times, we would never  wore a Nazi uniform? Are we absolutly sure?

I think it is very easy to judge 50 years later.

I can asure you that i am absolutly against the nazis, but i can´t hate all the germans for the madness of some of them.

About crotalo......my opion is that you can express your opinion about any royal, alive or death, but .....with respect please, the same idea can be told, politely (even if you are not agree with the person in question) or in bad terms.

I am spanish, i have lost several members of my family as you in the civil war, i don´t think that the Royal Family has any responsability in those terrible facts.

All the wars are terrible, but specially the wars between brothers. Also, a war is between two or more bands,  the responsability is only of one of them? In any case this topic is about an specific person, Queen Sofía of Spain, what´s the relation of her person and the spanish civil war?

If one person has done all he has can to instaure the democracy in Spain, this person is our King Juan Carlos, and we can´t forget that he has always have the support of Sofía in all his decisions.