Title and surname of the Greek Kings

[lovebird]

i dont understand why these people call themselves greek royalty; first they have no descendants from the orginal  ancient greeks; therefore, they should not  steal the culture,and ethnicity of another.
Sounds fair don't  take somthing doesn't belong to you.
royalty  is  history , we dont need them to feed off us ; they do nothing for us.
period.
democracy rules.
NOW THATS GREEK.

[Forum Admin]

lovebird has been terminated as a forum user for violation of the rules regarding conduct and language.
FA

[Aliard]

She also failed to realize that the modern greeks have no relation to the ancient ones, and are merely slavs helenized by the Byzantines during the middle ages. This egomaniacal nationalism is getting a bit tired.

[SSKENDER]

She also failed to realize that the modern greeks have no relation to the ancient ones, and are merely slavs helenized by the Byzantines during the middle ages. This egomaniacal nationalism is getting a bit tired.

Unfortunately, your statement is quite incorrect and objectionable.
In short, modern ethnologists accept the theory that the modern Greeks are descendants of the Ancient Greeks, with significant contributions from the Venetians, Slavs, Vlachs, and Turks.
And you neglect the fact that by the end of the Byzantine Empire, it was in fact in all but name, a Greek state.

[Robert_Hall]

I too, take offence at "merely slavs".  This is most objectionable.

[Aliard]

I in no way meant that being a Slav was a negative thing; I am half Bulgarian myself. However, it IS true that modern Greeks are far more Slavic than anything else; Greece was conquered and settled by Slavs in the Middle Ages. They were Hellenized by the Byzantines, but that does not change their ethnicity. The fact that the Byantine Empire was greek in culture is irrelevant; most of the ethnically greek byzantine elite fled to southern Italy with the fall of the Byzantine Empire; the pontic Greeks of northern Asia Minor fled to Ukraine after the Smyrna disaster. I fail to see why it is "offensive" to state that Modern Greeks are not related to ancient Greeks; all this belief does is spread egomania within the country, which is already a stereotype they are subjected to by the rest of Europe.

[Robert_Hall]

I personally take no offence to your very good analysis of present day Greek racial derivation.  In fact, I would tend to agree with you there. I took offence at "merely slavs". It does reek of terms used for more sinister reasons.

[Balkaneer]

Unfortunately, your statement is quite incorrect and objectionable.
In short, modern ethnologists accept the theory that the modern Greeks are descendants of the Ancient Greeks, with significant contributions from the Venetians, Slavs, Vlachs, and Turks.
And you neglect the fact that by the end of the Byzantine Empire, it was in fact in all but name, a Greek state.

You are correct although I would replace "Turks" with "Albanians."   There is no imaginable mechanism by which Turks became Greeks; Muslims did not become Christians.  However, there were Christian Albanians who intermarried with Greeks.  It would be more accurate to say that many Turks are in fact Islamicized Greeks.

[Balkaneer]

I in no way meant that being a Slav was a negative thing; I am half Bulgarian myself. However, it IS true that modern Greeks are far more Slavic than anything else; Greece was conquered and settled by Slavs in the Middle Ages.

Untrue.  Sure, there were Slavic incursions in the middle ages, but that does not mean that they completely displaced the native demographic element as you are trying to suggest.   In the south of Greece it was more or less a minor incursion that did not even get to the islands.  Toward the northwest of Greece there may be a stronger Slavic influence, but even there it was not strong enough to overturn the language (except perhaps in the NW-most edge of the country).

In sum, the modern Greeks are basically descended from the native ancient Greek inbitants of the place with some Slavic, Albanian, Vlach, Latin, Semitic etc. injections over time.   This is the common sense position that most of science supports.   Your theory is of the extremist 19th c. sort that only people with an agenda still purvey.

They were Hellenized by the Byzantines, but that does not change their ethnicity.

The Slavs who entered the Greek peninsula were Hellenized over time.  This, however, does not mean that all Greeks are Slavs, or that most of their genetic make-up is Slavic.

The fact that the Byantine Empire was greek in culture is irrelevant; most of the ethnically greek byzantine elite fled to southern Italy with the fall of the Byzantine Empire;

So?  How about the rest?  Did Russians cease being Russians because the elite fled in 1917?

the pontic Greeks of northern Asia Minor

Many did, and many have since gone to live in Greece.  But most Pontic Greeks have been in Greece since the 1920s.

fled to Ukraine after the Smyrna disaster.

The Smyrna disaster was in 1922, and most of the Greeks from there fled to Greece, not Ukraine.

I fail to see why it is "offensive" to state that Modern Greeks are not related to ancient Greeks;

It's not offensive, it's just untrue.

all this belief does is spread egomania within the country, which is already a stereotype they are subjected to by the rest of Europe.

This betrays a very condescending attitude.  That some Greeks are too patriotic for you (is this a royalist board or a communist one??) does not justify your attempts "to remedy" the situation by trying completely to Slavicize their history and genes.

[Reaper_the_pure]

Again we see a pointless racism against Greeks.  Just because FYROM is not recognised as the real macedonia which is in greece, there is no need to lie about greeks again like some 19th century German or English anthropoligists who have since been totally dismissed as trying to make there own cultures more prominent.  

People from FYROM are slavs.  You are not in anyway connected to The Ancient Macedonians.  Your language, culture and features is that of a slav race that descended into the Balkans as early as the 13th century.  Dont be ashamed of being Bulgarian!  That is who you are in language religion and and genetics.  Please leave Greece alone, the balkans wars are over and you lost, don't now attempt to steal greek culture.

Yes slavs and Albanians came into Greece, far more Romans and then Venetians colonised though, and with a deeper impact.

the Greeks are no longer a pure race, but never were.  Read your history!  They were a dark race that died there hair blond with lemon juice to look more like there slav/ germanic slaves who they nicknamed ''xanthos''  or ''blondies'' in the 5th Century BC.

However the Greeks or Hellens as we prefer are descended from the ancients.  We have our language that we protected from muslims who settles in anatolia and converted many greek tribed who are now Turks.

I miss the Romans!  They had there defects, but they never tried to steal Greek culture like FYROMs do.  They accepted the Greeks were the dominent culture in the Balkans and Greece still is.  

To Hitler, those FYROM slavs or anyone who deals in eugenics (the idea of an original master race) let me say this.  Greece gave you the power of arguement, science, education systems, a modern european life-style  ...everything besides advanced plumbing and the arch (Romans)  The descendant were not totally killed and replaced, lol.  The slavs Germans and english can't handle this and never will.  The Greeks are still in greece, slightly more mixed in the north, but still hellenes - the race chosen and made favorites by Pallas Athena.

That is Purity file

[Maria_Pavlovna]

I see it like this.

If you are Greek, your Greek.

If your want to be Greek, your Greek...etc...


If you want to be a monkey, then your monkey. ( joke   )

[Reaper_the_pure]

My mother-in-law was a blonde, blue-eyed Greek from Sparta; her brother also was blond and blue-eyed, and they didn't use lemon juice.

My grandfather was from sparta and was blond and blue eyes, that has nothing to do with the fact that 5th century athenians were a dark race of mixed merchants, jews, eygptians, ect ect.

Thankyou for your pointless comment on your mother in law being from sparta and not using a 2500 yearold technique to die her hair that is blond anyway ;)

Genius :P

[Maki]

Sparta a generation ago was less likely than Athens, Piraeus, Thessaloniki, etc., to have the native gene pool altered by non-natives.  While most of the physical evidence from ancient Greece (vase paintings, etc.) show dark-haired Greeks, there are many references in ancient literature to blond (xanthe) natives.  The reference to bleaching hair with lemon juice was a response to an earlier posting.  I think sarcasm is uncalled-for in this kind of forum and request that you answer courteously if you answer at all.

[Maria_Pavlovna]

I'm 50 %  Italian  and other %s Irish, Scotish, British, Swedish and German and maybe even Greek ( i think sense Italians never say they have othe blood in them and Greece is close to Italy and believes in the Greek / Roman Gods).

I look more British and Irish then my twin sister who looks more Italian then I. What does looks have to do with it?

Funny thing is I look more like Anastasia of Russia, then my own mother.

[Reaper_the_pure]

@MAKI

Sorry but could not understand your post due to the fact that your english is quite poor in structure,  Either way I was talking about 5th century Athenians.  Yes ofcourse there are blonds in Greece too.  Most slavs are fair, I still fail to see your point.  Most the slavs that did settle in greece settled mainly in the south.  Either way your point has nothing to do with my arguement replying to the FYROM arguement that begun this pointless thread.  I am trying to re-educate a slav about Greece and Greeks, not listen to stories about your mother in law's hair colour from Sparta.  I think you are missing the picture./ and we are talking at cross purposes no offence taken.