Obrenovich Family (except the Kings)

[Norbert]

Many thanks. Burkes Royal Families gives Milosh and Ljubica 4 sons and the 3 girls above...so, would help a lot to update this dynasty.

[Marc]

Yes,Jovan Nikolic,Baron von Rudna and Princess Jelisaveta(Savka) Obrenovic had issue...their children and grandchildren married into Austro-Hungarian nobility...Milosh's grandson Michail married Countess Marianne Kinsky von Wchinitz und Tettau,while Milosh's other descedants though his daughter Princess Jelisaveta are families von der Reuth,Counts Hardegg auf Glatz und im Machlande,Barons Duka de Kadar and among them is the present 9th. Fürst Alexander Sulkowsky von Bielitz!

Through his other daughter Petria Prince Milosh also had descedants...Princess Petria married Teodor Bajic of Varadia and some of Petria's graddaughters also married into Austro-Hungarian nobility...

Ljubica Bajic of Varadia married Baron Heinrich von Trautenberg,Bohemian nobleman of Franconian roots whose family can trase their ancestry up to 13th century...

Marija Bajic of Varadia married Baron Bela von Tallian who was a friend of Prime-minister of Hungary Baron Istvan Tisza and was also a member of his government in 1903 till 1905 and as such had a dispute with Generaloberst Karl Tersztyanszky von Nadas...

Prince Milosh had one legitimate daughter Princess Marija who lived from 1821-1823,but he had 9 illegitimate children and among them three Marija'a and one Maria Clara...

[Norbert]

mamy thanks...so, who can claim to be heir of the Obrenovics?

[nena]

As far I know, last Obrenovics died in nigth 29th may 1903---King Alexander and Queen Draga.
So, claims....?

[Norbert]

well Marc, perhaps you can share with us who these charactrs are.:  In Burkes we have Visnia + 1817  who marries Obren Martinovic + 1790 and she m 2nd Todoer Mihailovic + 18o2,

son by 1st m MILAN OBRENOVIC

issue by 2nd m MILOSH adopted the name OBRENOVIC  PRINCE OF SERBIA
Iovan 1786-1850 m1 Kruna Milhailovic + 1835 ( Obren dy 1826, Savka dy 1834) m 2 Anna Joksic + 1860 ( Stana m Todor Aleksic...issue ?.
                                                                                                                                                     Ermila m1 Nikola Cupic..issue ? m2 Tesa Nikolic..issue ?)

Yephrem 1790- 1856 m Tomasina Bogicevic:1) Milosh 1829-1861 m Elena Catargi div ..... + 1871 ( issue : KING MILAN OBRENOVIC IV)                                                             
                                                             2) Jelena  dsp 1895 m Constantin Hadia
                                                             3) Simka dsp1837  m Iovan Ghermani   
                                                             4)nka mur 1868  m Alexander Constantinovic : with issue (a) Alexander m Mileva Opujic, their dau was Natalia of Montenegro,b) Katarina m1 Milivoje Blaaznavac + 1873 issue Vojislav? Milena dy ) m2 Mihaijlo Bogicevic
                                                              5)Katarina dsp 1848                                                             
                                                              Stana  dsp 1842
 

[Marc]

Well,not so much info about all those caracters...Just one interesting this is that Anka Obrenovic(mother of Katarina,Prince Michael's cousin and bride to be) had an illegitimate daughter with her brother in law Jovan Ghermani whose daughter is also named Simona as Anka's sister(wife of Anka's lover Jovan Ghermani)-irony...She is the one who married a wealthy Romanian minister Lakhovari and became lady in waiting to Queen Carmen Sylva...

[Norbert]

thanxs marc,,,, so any information you can give us on the daughters of Petria Obrenovic,  Mariya and Ljubica, who must be heirs of the dynasty?

[Marc]

Well,the heirs to the dinasty would be male descedants of Prince Milosh's half-brother Jakov...Prince Milosh took his family name Obrenovich from his step-father(Martinovich Obren)...At that time in Serbia,your family name derived from your fathers name,so if your father was for example Konstantin,your family name would be Konstantinovich...Later,rules about family named changed and everyone kept their family name permanent!Prince Milosh is the son of Teodor Michailovich and Visnja Urosevich...His mother Visnja married later Obren Martinovich who raised Prince Milosh and his brothers Jovan and Jevrem(ancestor of Kings Milan and Alexander of Serbia)...So,Jakov's descedants are the only ones who are still living in the male line in Serbia...

[Norbert]

so how does Jakov  fit into the family tree  ( son of Obren Martinovic by another wife?) and do you have any details of his issue?  Marc , you are really filling in unknown details here...many thanks.

[Marc]

Yes,Jakov is the son of Prince Milosh's stepfather Obren Martinovic and Prince Milosh's mother Visnja...Obren Martinovic is Visnja's second husband!

[Norbert]

Yes,Jakov is the son of Prince Milosh's stepfather Obren Martinovic and Prince Milosh's mother Visnja...Obren Martinovic is Visnja's second husband!

thanks Marc,there is no mension of this brother in Burkes . Could you send us any details about him and his family. Very interesting to think that there is a living Obrenovic today.

[Marc]

They are living today under the surname Jakovljevic...there are not so much info about them except that they are found as the heirs to the Obrenovic fortune which Queen Natalia left to them in her will...

[Norbert]

if anyone has any details about the Jakovljevic family I would be very grateful. Interesting that they live in Serbia. I wonder if they communicate with Crown Pr Alexander?

[Marc]

No,they are not known in Serbia and they are commoners in every sence and live like that for more than 150 years!They don't have any connections or contacts!

[nena]

Norbert, I read one interview with one Jakovljevic Family member......
Here. Sorry, in Serbian, Ljubomir Jakovljevic.

Edit: I'll translate some parts of interview later......