Author Topic: Stabbing of Rasputin in 1914  (Read 23029 times)

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Offline Belochka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2008, 11:36:15 PM »
I'm running across some discrepancies regarding the date Rasputin was stabbed by Guseva:

In lieu of that, I'm curious about what others' opinions would be regarding the validity of the sources I've laid out here. Whose date do you believe, and why?

Such a pity that you failed to read my published biography about Rasputin from a modern Russian perspective. If you take the time to read through it your concerns should be amply satisfied.

The link is:


http://www.facesofrussia.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=17&Itemid=1

You assumption is patently incorrect. I have indeed read your article, which in fact spurred my question. I noticed you reported the date of the stabbing as 29 June, which conflicted with other sources I'd recently read and prompted me to investigate further.

Then why did you not quote me as well, since that was where you first noticed the date, which initiated your inquiry? 

Obviously it can be seen that other than Moynahan, whose source was impeccable, the other contemporary writers were largely in conflict with each other.


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Offline Belochka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #16 on: February 05, 2008, 11:50:17 PM »
... I'm frankly amazed that so many authors in both Russia and the west seem to have botched the dates. Radzinsky, whom I would expect to be adept at juggling OS/NS dates, perpetuates the myth that the two events happened within a day of one another. Even Bokhanov and the predominantly Russian team responsible for Love, Power and Tragedy seem to use an unfortunate mixture of OS and NS throughout the book, thus making it unclear whether they interpreted Spridovich correctly.

Which is precisely why it always ideal to find the primary documents or as second best find authors who have cited from those key documents.


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Offline Sarushka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2008, 12:09:32 AM »
Obviously it can be seen that other than Moynahan, whose source was impeccable, the other contemporary writers were largely in conflict with each other.

It appears Radzinsky also used that same source -- Guseva's testimony as recorded by the deputy prosecutor of the Tobolsk distict court.
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Offline Belochka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2008, 12:27:15 AM »
Obviously it can be seen that other than Moynahan, whose source was impeccable, the other contemporary writers were largely in conflict with each other.

It appears Radzinsky also used that same source -- Guseva's testimony as recorded by the deputy prosecutor of the Tobolsk distict court.

Radzinsky has faulted with other documents placed before him. Knowing which authors are most reliable is the key to one's investigation to find where the truth lies.


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Offline Sarushka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2008, 12:31:35 AM »
Radzinsky has faulted with other documents placed before him.

Indeed, and most unfortunate too, as he is one of the few Russian authors on this topic whose publications are accessible to the west.
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Offline Belochka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #20 on: February 06, 2008, 12:41:12 AM »
In your preliminary posting on this thread you had failed to declare that you used my biographic notes to base your inquiry. You failed to respond to my previous question concerning the matter. Please explain what it is that are you attempting to demonstrate here? Thank you in advance.


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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #21 on: February 06, 2008, 08:53:39 AM »
I
It seems to me that the most solid indicator would be the date of Alexandra's telegram to Rasputin. However, I've never seen the text of that telegram resproduced. Has anyone else?


30 June 1914:
"Profoundly saddened at what has happened, we pray fervently."

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #22 on: February 06, 2008, 09:42:52 AM »
I
It seems to me that the most solid indicator would be the date of Alexandra's telegram to Rasputin. However, I've never seen the text of that telegram resproduced. Has anyone else?


30 June 1914:
"Profoundly saddened at what has happened, we pray fervently."

Thank you!

Am I correct that this is Alexandra's answer in response to the news of the attack on Rasputin?

Do you also have  the telegram she sent before the stabbing -- the telegram Rasputin received just prior to the attack? I believe that would have been in regard to Aleksei's accident while boarding the Standart.
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Offline Sarushka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #23 on: February 06, 2008, 09:52:25 AM »
In your preliminary posting on this thread you had failed to declare that you used my biographic notes to base your inquiry. You failed to respond to my previous question concerning the matter. Please explain what it is that are you attempting to demonstrate here? Thank you in advance.

I did not fail to declare your article as the source of my inquiry -- I chose not to. Frankly, I do not enjoy our exchanges and thus I deliberately chose more neutral sources to frame my question in hopes of avoiding your involvement and the possibility of further antagonization. In that, I clearly failed; I had not anticipated the possibility of bruising your ego.

I also have a clear impression that you think I started this thread as a veiled attempt at challenging your research. Let me assure you that is not the case, and that once again I am offended by your insinuations and assumptions. I needed correct information regarding these dates for a project of my own. I have obtained that information, and due to the fact that we clearly do not communicate well, I do not plan to visit this thread again.
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Offline Forum Admin

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #24 on: February 06, 2008, 10:07:34 AM »
I
It seems to me that the most solid indicator would be the date of Alexandra's telegram to Rasputin. However, I've never seen the text of that telegram resproduced. Has anyone else?


30 June 1914:
"Profoundly saddened at what has happened, we pray fervently."

Thank you!

Am I correct that this is Alexandra's answer in response to the news of the attack on Rasputin?

Do you also have  the telegram she sent before the stabbing -- the telegram Rasputin received just prior to the attack? I believe that would have been in regard to Aleksei's accident while boarding the Standart.

The June 30 telegram was sent officially by "The Imperial Family" as a whole.

Alexei's fall on the Standart, as reported by Spiridovitch was on July 1 OS, thus two days AFTER Rasputin was stabbed.  There is no mention as to who sent the telegram to Rasputin on the day he was attacked. 

Offline Belochka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #25 on: February 06, 2008, 08:41:56 PM »
In your preliminary posting on this thread you had failed to declare that you used my biographic notes to base your inquiry. You failed to respond to my previous question concerning the matter. Please explain what it is that are you attempting to demonstrate here? Thank you in advance.

I did not fail to declare your article as the source of my inquiry -- I chose not to. Frankly, I do not enjoy our exchanges and thus I deliberately chose more neutral sources to frame my question in hopes of avoiding your involvement and the possibility of further antagonization. In that, I clearly failed; I had not anticipated the possibility of bruising your ego.

I also have a clear impression that you think I started this thread as a veiled attempt at challenging your research. Let me assure you that is not the case, and that once again I am offended by your insinuations and assumptions. I needed correct information regarding these dates for a project of my own. I have obtained that information, and due to the fact that we clearly do not communicate well, I do not plan to visit this thread again.

Why does this OT disrespectful posting remain while my inoffensive response was deleted?
 







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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2008, 10:32:58 PM »
Sarah was answering your question above. That's why. Margarita, you really must "lighten up" simply because your article was not cited publicly.  Sarah was not making some public slight of you because she didn't mention your article. I had hoped to just let it all go, but  you couldn't.

Offline matushka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #27 on: March 13, 2008, 07:25:28 AM »
Sarushka, this quotation from Maria Feodorovna's diary wil perhaps interest you. She was at that time in England.

30.06/ 13.07 1914
(...) All the evenings' papers are full of news about the assassination attempt agains R. who nevertheless didn't die, he was only wounded by some woman.

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Date of assassination attempt?
« Reply #28 on: March 13, 2008, 08:47:00 AM »
Thank you matushka! It's helpful to know how quickly the news spread.
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