Author Topic: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz  (Read 74082 times)

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Offline Svetabel

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2007, 01:07:28 AM »
Interesting find! Recently I've seen a group photo of the Mecklenburg family (dated the 1905-1606 years) and found Duchess Marie in it! Not so great  a find  :) but this points that Marie was not a complete outcast in the family. Also in the photo her husband Paul Friedrich, her children Maria Antonia and Heinrich Borwin (very handsome young man).

Offline Marc

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2007, 09:44:57 AM »
Sorry to ask this,but why was she ''treated'' as an outcast?Because of her hobby's?Because of the fact that she was catholic or because of the presumption that she was not ''royal'' enough for a Mecklenburg-Schwerin duke?

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #32 on: November 14, 2007, 02:30:28 AM »
Sorry to ask this,but why was she ''treated'' as an outcast?Because of her hobby's?Because of the fact that she was catholic or because of the presumption that she was not ''royal'' enough for a Mecklenburg-Schwerin duke?

Marc, I really wished I knew the truth. I guess you've read the whole thread...I don't  think that her hobby made her an outcast, nothing special in the archeology as many Royal persons loved to dig. I repeat that my main source on Duchess Marie is still "the Secrets of the Gotha" where is said Marie was too frivolous and thus was sent to a gloomy castle in Styria. My personal opinion is that "frivolous" is not a reason for such actions as Grand Duchess Anastasia Mikhailovna of Mecklenburg-Schwerin, f.e., was a notorious frivolous lady. But probably Marie's Catholocism and the Windischgraetz roots weren't a reason for happiness among the Mecklenburg family. Possibly she was whimsical in her ways (cranky) and was not able to get along well with her husband's family...

Offline Marc

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #33 on: November 14, 2007, 09:04:14 AM »
Thank you Sveta,I have read the whole thread...I was always wondering how the Mecklenburg family looked upon a marriage with a Windisch-Graetz princess...although tecnically equal,but I supose not in the eyes of a family!

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #34 on: February 03, 2008, 11:26:40 AM »
A rare photo of Duchess Marie as a little girl among her siblings and father.





Standing (behind Furst Hugo-Alfred): Princess Olga (1853-1934) and Princess Alexandrine (1850-1933)
Sitting: Furst Hugo-Alfred Windisch-Graetz (1823-1904)
On the floor: Princess Marie, and her brother Hugo-Wierand (1854-1920).

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #35 on: February 04, 2008, 03:28:45 AM »
Any Information on the marriages of her son please? There seems to be some confusion over the family tree of  Lily Oelrichs. In some genealogy she is the sister of Blanche O. ( the actress) and hense grand daughter of Teresa Mrs Hermann O. the silver mine heiress , builder of "Rosecliff" and sister in law of Vanderbilt . In other editions she is a cousin. Was Heinrich Borwin a playboy looking out for rich american Heiresses?

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #36 on: February 04, 2008, 05:05:48 AM »
Very interesting! I agree the term frivolous is odd.

Offline Svetabel

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #37 on: February 06, 2008, 01:21:12 AM »
Any Information on the marriages of her son please? There seems to be some confusion over the family tree of  Lily Oelrichs. In some genealogy she is the sister of Blanche O. ( the actress) and hense grand daughter of Teresa Mrs Hermann O. the silver mine heiress , builder of "Rosecliff" and sister in law of Vanderbilt . In other editions she is a cousin. Was Heinrich Borwin a playboy looking out for rich american Heiresses?

That's an interesting point on Heinrich Borwin! Though in fact I didn't dig out much on Heinrich as I am interested more in his mother Duchess Marie.

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #38 on: February 06, 2008, 09:29:20 PM »
Any Information on the marriages of her son please? There seems to be some confusion over the family tree of  Lily Oelrichs. In some genealogy she is the sister of Blanche O. ( the actress) and hense grand daughter of Teresa Mrs Hermann O. the silver mine heiress , builder of "Rosecliff" and sister in law of Vanderbilt . In other editions she is a cousin. Was Heinrich Borwin a playboy looking out for rich american Heiresses?

That's an interesting point on Heinrich Borwin! Though in fact I didn't dig out much on Heinrich as I am interested more in his mother Duchess Marie.

In 1912, a rather sensational court case was brought against him and his wife Mrs Elizabeth Pratt Tibbits.  He married (and divorced) an American woman 25 years his senior. Her American children sued in court to be named in charge of her investments (she was very wealthy) believing that the Duke would run through her money.  I don't know what the outcome was but it dragged on long enough for HB to have divorced his 2nd wife. Two years after his divorce her married Natalie 'Lily' Oelrichs Martin whom he divorced in 1921. That same year he married  Karola von Alers.

Heinrich Borwin also visited a wealthy the Peter & Lily Martin in their homes in New York and San Francisco. Peter D. Martin, internationally known polo player, and Lily married around 1901 and the wedding was a lavish affair with various Astors, Vanderbilts and the Duke & Duchess of Marlborough present. Natalie/Lily was the daughter of Charles May Oelrichs and sister of Blanche Oelrichs (who served as her maid of honor at her first wedding) but I don't know if it's the actress--Blanche married Leonard Thomas and later wrote under the nom de plume of "Michael Strange"--both the Oelrichs girls were considered great beauties. Blanche later married the famous actor John Barrymore and they had a daughter, Diane Blanche Barrymore. The Martins spent a good deal of time in Paris where they were tremendously popular though Peter Martin reportedly suffered from mental illness. In 1913, Lily hosted Duchess Marie Antoinette in Paris and Heinrich Borwin called on her when he visisted San Francisco, renewing the aquaintance he had prior to her widowhood.

It definitely seems that HB had an affinity for rich American women, particularly widows.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2008, 10:34:06 PM by grandduchessella »
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Offline Vecchiolarry

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #39 on: February 06, 2008, 10:31:32 PM »
Hi,

I know this is totally off topic - but didn't Blanche Oelrich marry John Barrymore and produce Diana Barrymore as their daughter?
I seem to remember my grandmother telling me that Blanche called herself 'Somebody(?) Strange' and was indeed a very strange person.  I'm not sure if she committed suicide but I think she died young......

Sorry to get off topic.

Larry

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #40 on: February 06, 2008, 10:36:05 PM »
Yes, she did marry him--I just updated my post as you posted yours.  :) So, were it not for the timing of the marriages, John Barrymore and Duke Heinrich Borwin would've been brothers-in-law. (Perhaps then Grand Duchess Vladimir, nee Marie Mecklenburg-Schwerin, could've given him tips on how to play Rasputin later on.  ;) ) Blanche married thirdly NY attorney Harrison Tweed. She published an autobiography in 1940, "Who Tells Me True", I wonder if there was anything of her sister's marriage in there. She was also rumored to have a relationship with Mercedes de Acosta. Definitely a family colorful enough for this branch of the Schwerin clan.

Here's Blanche

« Last Edit: February 06, 2008, 10:42:25 PM by grandduchessella »
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Offline Svetabel

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #41 on: February 07, 2008, 03:00:00 AM »
Any Information on the marriages of her son please? There seems to be some confusion over the family tree of  Lily Oelrichs. In some genealogy she is the sister of Blanche O. ( the actress) and hense grand daughter of Teresa Mrs Hermann O. the silver mine heiress , builder of "Rosecliff" and sister in law of Vanderbilt . In other editions she is a cousin. Was Heinrich Borwin a playboy looking out for rich american Heiresses?

That's an interesting point on Heinrich Borwin! Though in fact I didn't dig out much on Heinrich as I am interested more in his mother Duchess Marie.

In 1912, a rather sensational court case was brought against him and his wife Mrs Elizabeth Pratt Tibbits.  He married (and divorced) an American woman 25 years his senior. Her American children sued in court to be named in charge of her investments (she was very wealthy) believing that the Duke would run through her money.  I don't know what the outcome was but it dragged on long enough for HB to have divorced his 2nd wife. Two years after his divorce her married Natalie 'Lily' Oelrichs Martin whom he divorced in 1921. That same year he married  Karola von Alers.

Heinrich Borwin also visited a wealthy the Peter & Lily Martin in their homes in New York and San Francisco. Peter D. Martin, internationally known polo player, and Lily married around 1901 and the wedding was a lavish affair with various Astors, Vanderbilts and the Duke & Duchess of Marlborough present. Natalie/Lily was the daughter of Charles May Oelrichs and sister of Blanche Oelrichs (who served as her maid of honor at her first wedding) but I don't know if it's the actress--Blanche married Leonard Thomas and later wrote under the nom de plume of "Michael Strange"--both the Oelrichs girls were considered great beauties. Blanche later married the famous actor John Barrymore and they had a daughter, Diane Blanche Barrymore. The Martins spent a good deal of time in Paris where they were tremendously popular though Peter Martin reportedly suffered from mental illness. In 1913, Lily hosted Duchess Marie Antoinette in Paris and Heinrich Borwin called on her when he visisted San Francisco, renewing the aquaintance he had prior to her widowhood.

It definitely seems that HB had an affinity for rich American women, particularly widows.

Wow, very interesting! As always a lot of info from you, grandduchessella ! Thanks.

So seems that Heinrich Borwin was really a hunter for wealthy American women, and this could be explained by his position in the Mecklenbourg-Schwerin family, being only a grandchild of a Grand Duke and thus not very rich.

Offline Vecchiolarry

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #42 on: February 07, 2008, 08:08:08 AM »
Hi,

Thanks Ella for the update on Blanche.
I just remembered her other name:  Michael Strange

And yes, wouldn't it have been interesting fun to have Meichen giving tips to John Barrymore.  The mind boggles!!

Larry

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #43 on: February 28, 2008, 05:15:34 PM »
An affinity for American women or their money?

Naughty Heinrich Borwin!

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Offline Svetabel

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Re: Duchess Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin,nee Windisch-Graetz
« Reply #44 on: July 29, 2008, 12:19:21 PM »
Interesting find! Recently I've seen a group photo of the Mecklenburg family (dated the 1905-1606 years) and found Duchess Marie in it! Not so great  a find  :) but this points that Marie was not a complete outcast in the family. Also in the photo her husband Paul Friedrich, her children Maria Antonia and Heinrich Borwin (very handsome young man).

Here's the photo of 1905-1906 years:



First row: from left to right - probably sisters of Duchess Marie - Alexandrine and Olga (Olga had married Count Mocenigo), GDss Maria Pavlovna-elder, GDss Alexandra of Mecklenbourg-Schwerin, Duchess Marie

Second row (standing): ???, Heriditary Prince Adolf Friedrich of Mecklenbourg-Streltz,, GD Vladimir Alexandrovitch, Duchess Maria Antonia (daughter of Duchess Marie), GD Friedrich Franz IV of  Mecklenbourg-Schwerin, Princess Charlotte Reuss (nee Duchess of Mecklenbourg-Schwerin), Princess Alexandrine of Denmark (sister of GD Friedrich Franz IV), Duke Paul Friedrich (spouse of Duchess Marie), Duke Heinrich Borwin (only surviving son of Duchess Marie).