Crown Prince Alexander of Yugoslavia & family

[Robert_Hall]

The problem with that scenario, TampaBay, is that such a restored system would just create far more division than already exsists. Despite the "above politics" ideal, partisanship for candidates would inevitably flare. There are simply no unifying personages for such a proposal.
As has been demostrated in the Balkans, in every country, monarchy has failed to oil the stormy waters of politics.
Cheers anyway !

[TampaBay]

The problem with that scenario, TampaBay, is that such a restored system would just create far more division than already exsists. Despite the "above politics" ideal, partisanship for candidates would inevitably flare. There are simply no unifying personages for such a proposal.
As has been demostrated in the Balkans, in every country, monarchy has failed to oil the stormy waters of politics.
Cheers anyway !

I understand what you are saying I but do not agree.  

Here is why:

Discussion is good.

We are in a constant discussion on a world wide level bringing ideas together.  I am talking to you on a world wide forum right now.

We are not discussing Tony Blair or George Bush.  They are here today and gone tomorrow.  Monarchy is living History.  Monarchy is stabilization in a constantly changing world.  We on this forum discuss figures of history over 200 yeras old.  We do not discuss Jimmy Carter or Edward Heath or Helmut Kohl or Valerie Discard de Stant (spelling?)

The world is a better place because Monarchy has brought us all together and we exercise free speech and learn about each other.  

It really makes no difference if the Royals we discuss set or thrones or not.  Their intermarriage has related us all (even the USA) because we now all have something in common to discuss no matter how trivial.

TampaBay

 

[Marc]

Of course,I agree!I just don't want to discuss politics because this is not place for such things!

[Marc]

When I met Prince Dushan I was speaking to him about his ancestors in order to show him that I know much about them-and he was stunned by the fact that someone very young(I am 23) is even interested in that and belive it or not said that I know much more about HIS ancestors than he does!Sounds incredible but really true...He knows and talked to me much about his living relations...and their family relations!

[Eurohistory]

Even better...at the luncheon following the funeral in January of Grand Duchess Josephine-Charlotte of Luxembourg, the Duke of York turned to a royal lady seated next to him and point-blank asked: "now, how are we all related?  I simply do not know, I know we are, but no one ever told us how!"

Arturo Beéche

[Marc]

That is for me so sad,really...that one Prince doesn't know elementary things about his own ancestry!Well,it is different to ours,since their ancestry was the base of inheriting the throne and there for much more important!Perhaps he didn't(or still doesn't) know either that his ex-wife Sarah Ferguson is his distant relative...witch I bet she knew!

[Robert_Hall]

It is all very well to focus on the trivial and minuatae of royalty but when discussing the subject, you must remember you are discussing  by nature, a political institution.  Monarchy is a system of government and the rule of a land and it's people is not trivial. No amount of inter-familia  relationship can save a throne without the suport of the people. No military force, police, economy can keep unpopular rulers in power indefinitely.
The issue in Serbia is quite serious indeed.  The Karageorg [whether royal or not] are trying to fegain a place in the national life. There is a lot of animosty towards them there for many reasons. Of course they have supporters, but detractors far outnumber them. The country is the  very definition of "Balkan Politics" and if the family wishes to be taken seriously they must settle their own squabbles first.
From my own experience, I once met King Peter II many years ago. Despite my young age [I must have been 15-16] he struck me as a very sad, lonely man. Rather hollow. He did not impress me as someone who could rule a mob scene like Yugoslavia, democratically or otherwise.
And now, from afar, the family although cleaned up and shiney in a proper palace, still strike me as parvenus, looking for legitamacy. Perhaps the whole country is for that matter.
OK, I did my name dropping for this thread.
Carry on !

[chantal]

I was amazed with your recent discussion, even though I am French and monarchist by tradition and by thoughts and heart, I found that most of you were involved in a senseless discussion. As a Professor of History I do agree with wetzvonken in many of his points regarding the causes of the outbreak of what was called the Great War. Moreover, the consequences of that war are the reason for the recent war in the former Yugoslavia. I didn not find out that wetzvonken was blaming the whole Serbian Nation for the assassination of the Austrian Archduke, just the Government of Serbia its Secret Service and the Crown Prince and some terrorists supported by all of them. We can witness today that there is still a lot of reluctance to accept Serbia-Montenegro within the framework of the European Union. Furthermore Belgrade is not a candidate for the Union. Most of the political problems that we are facing nowadays were originated in the treaties of 1919, and the way that the Allies after the both World Wars had arranged the whole map of Central and Eastern Europe and the Middle East. I doubt that the Serbs will accept today a King of any dynasty, including the former Royal Family. In my humble opinion what they need today is more Democracy, and to learn how to leave in Democracy, and how to coexist with its neighbours no matter who they are. There leaders must get rid off all the extremist that they still have in Belgrade, those who had recently murder Zoran Djindjic, a wonderful person and statesman. I hope that the new authorities in Belgrade will be able to stop all kind of violence. Again I am convinced that there is no chance for a new monarchy in Serbia or in any other country. We must remember that in Bulgaria the former King Simeon of Saxe Coburg has been the Prime Minister, but did not get his throne back. The former King of Romania did not have any chance to be accepted. They still are too many former communist around in the Balkans.    

[Jane]

wetzvonken (aka chantal), did the first banning not sink in?  

[Robert_Hall]

Jane- ?  [I do not know who either party is/was/pretends to be]

[Forum Admin]

wetzvonken and chantal ARE indeed the same person whoever that may be. They both post from Buenos Aires, Argentina. For the record, though, wetzvonken was not banned, but rather deleted his/her own username, and now seems to have come back using another name.

[chantal]

In connection with your statement, this is partially truth, my good friend does not want to go on with the discussion, so I take his post. I am staying in Buenos Aires till October, when I go back to Europe. My complete name is Chantal de la Doucette and I am French. I will be working with my friend at the University, where he is teaching and I am teaching as well. He does not want to continue in the forum as a consequence of the disagreements with the rest of the forum in this particular matter. I hope that my friendship will not be a problem to intervene in your forum. Truly yours Chantal

[chantal]

I had discussed with Dr. Louis Wetzlär von Plankenstern about your message, and we both agree that the way that you had doubt about my person is shameful, and sounds insulting. I have been teaching history of Europe in Paris first, in London afterwards and now just for one year I am in Buenos Aires. But I never have had to face such outrageous behaviour from any one. Nobody in your discussions had revealed his or her name as we did as a proof of our good faith, with the very exception of Arturo. I do not have any more any interest in share my thoughts and knowledge with people who behave in such orwellian way. It looks that we are being spy just because we do not agree with some particular members. So lets say that none of us will participate any longer in any of your forums, even more we do not want to have anything to do with your web page, which is wonderful, but I can not say the same about the palace members that are blaming us to cover up our personalities. Shame on you, but what we can ask for a country that had violated all international laws so recently. In Europe the real Europe, the old one, and here in South America people has a very different conception about freedom, liberty and how to express your ideas without any kind of censorship. We will be deleighted if you bann us from your pages, but before we will renounce to be part of it.
truly yours Chantal de Ladoucette
Av Callao 1727, Buenos Aires (Mrs. Aldao Ocampo)

[LisaDavidson]

I had discussed with Dr. Louis Wetzlär von Plankenstern about your message, and we both agree that the way that you had doubt about my person is shameful, and sounds insulting. I have been teaching history of Europe in Paris first, in London afterwards and now just for one year I am in Buenos Aires. But I never have had to face such outrageous behaviour from any one. Nobody in your discussions had revealed his or her name as we did as a proof of our good faith, with the very exception of Arturo. I do not have any more any interest in share my thoughts and knowledge with people who behave in such orwellian way. It looks that we are being spy just because we do not agree with some particular members. So lets say that none of us will participate any longer in any of your forums, even more we do not want to have anything to do with your web page, which is wonderful, but I can not say the same about the palace members that are blaming us to cover up our personalities. Shame on you, but what we can ask for a country that had violated all international laws so recently. In Europe the real Europe, the old one, and here in South America people has a very different conception about freedom, liberty and how to express your ideas without any kind of censorship. We will be deleighted if you bann us from your pages, but before we will renounce to be part of it.
truly yours Chantal de Ladoucette
Av Callao 1727, Buenos Aires (Mrs. Aldao Ocampo)

Chantal: I am the Moderator of this particular section of the Forum. Neither myself nor the gentlemen who run this board have the intention of banning anyone. I realize that discussions can become passionate and emotional for us all. What I insist upon is civility. It is fine to disagree with someone, but everyone must remain civil. In this, I am backed up by the FA. Violators will be warned. So far, I have had no trouble with the Balkan Royal Topic area, and we hope to keep it that way.

[SSKENDER]

Hey everyone.

I was watching the greek channel ANT-1 on satellite the other day, saturday, which was showing a tv special documentary on Kosovo and the plight of the Serbian minority and the destruction to churches, etc.  

Both Crown Prince Alexander and Crown Princess Katherine were interviewed on the documentary.  Crown Prince Alexander was commentating on the situation in Kosovo and the world's neglect of the area, etc. etc.  Crown Princess Katherine, speaking in greek and very emotional, with tears on her eyes, also spoke about the Serbian people in Kosovo and their situation and the difficulties of their life.  The documentary showed the Prince and Princess delivering gifts to children, medical equipment to hospitals, etc, & commented on the Princess's foundation which uses her links to Greece to provide humanitarian support in the area.

Anyway, I thought I would pass this information on, as I thought it quite interesting, it was also interesting that a greek channel was interviewing royalty, especially one so closely related to the Greek Royal Family.  It showed the couple in a very good light.

(P.S. I am not expressing my view on the Kosovo subject, simply stating what the documentary was about and what was shown, etc. )

Thanks