Olga's Letters

[Inok Nikolai]

 Still, I'm happy to have them at least in French, rather than don't have them at all!

I quite agree: they did a great service by putting the letters into French and publishing them.

Now, if only we could use the original Russian texts to translate directly from them into English!

[Sunny]

 Still, I'm happy to have them at least in French, rather than don't have them at all!

I quite agree: they did a great service by putting the letters into French and publishing them.

Now, if only we could use the original Russian texts to translate directly from them into English!

 Still, I'm happy to have them at least in French, rather than don't have them at all!

I quite agree: they did a great service by putting the letters into French and publishing them.

Now, if only we could use the original Russian texts to translate directly from them into English!

For me it would be enough to have the original Russian - but i understand that's the point.

[blessOTMA]

Olga letter from April 1918

From the Southey auction catalog.

For the record, this letter is, in fact, from Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicholaevna (to Z. S. Tolstaya's daughter), and *not* from Grand Duchess Olga Nicholaevna. We alerted Sotheby's to that fact, but the catalogue had already been printed and distributed.

The handwriting is definitely Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicholaevna's, and the contents reflect the mind of a younger girl, not of someone G. D. Olga's age.

Sotheby's made that mistake because Grand Duchess Anastasia Nicholaevna, in signing this note, did not bring the "tail" of the capital initial "A." all the way down to the line, so it appears at first glance to be a loop, making the letter look more like an "O.".

Wow! Thank you for that information!  Perhaps I missed the mention of it , but do you have a time table for your publication? It's a dream come true!

[Inok Nikolai]

Orthodox Word's source is a book called Pis'ma Tsarstvennikh Muchenikov iz Zatocheniya. It's not a book I'm familiar with, and does not seem to be in print. I *might* be able to interloan a copy from University of Michigan, but hopefully someone here will have one and save me the trouble...

I only saw this posting just now.

 To save you looking further, I can tell you that Pis'ma Tsarstvennikh Muchenikov iz Zatocheniya is simply a later edition of the original Pis'ma Tsarskoi Sem'i iz Zatocheniia. After the glorification of the Imperial family, two more editions of Mr. Alferieff's book were published in Russia itself by the Monastery of the Transfiguration (on Valaam Island in Lake Ladoga, northeast of St. Petersburg).

Those two later versions (editions two and three of the original collection) contain some additional letters, but are basically the same book as Mr. Alferieff's. The one major difference is that in the later editions the members of the Imperial family are treated as already canonized saints, which is also reflected in the slightly altered title of those versions: "Letters of the Royal Martyrs from Captivity".

[Inok Nikolai]

The biggest problem with these letters is that Princess Eugenie and Nicholas Komstadius did not always fully understand the rather cryptic text and abbreviations of the original Russian, and thus, both the French translation itself and the footnotes contain errors and misconceptions. This is evident if one attempts to reconstruct the Russian text from the French translation. Then too, researchers now have access to much more information concerning the sixteen months of the Imperial family's imprisonment than Princess Eugenie and N. Komstadius did twenty years ago.

Members of this forum who also read French, and have a knowledge of the events of 1917-18, can themselves, no doubt, detect some of these errors in the French versions of these letters.

See, for example: http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=17035.msg503069#msg503069

[Inok Nikolai]

As far as I've been able to determine, the first publication of Olga's quote was in the July 1968 issue of Православная Жизнь (Orthodox Life). Unfortunately the article does not state who the letter was written to, when it was written, nor does it quote any other portion of the letter for context.

This is one of many questions which I wish that I had asked dear Mr. Alferieff while he was still alive!

In his book Mr. Alferieff featured this excerpt, supposedly taken from a longer letter from Grand Duchess Olga Nicholaevna:

Фрагменты письма:
(Тобольск)

Отец просит передать всем тем, кто Ему остался предан, и тем, на кого они могут иметь влияние, чтобы они не мстили за Него, так как Он всех простил и за всех молится, и чтобы не мстили за себя, и чтобы помнили, что то зло, которое сейчас в мире, будет еще сильнее, но что не зло победит, а только любовь...

As you know, this excerpt has become famous and has been cited many times, both in print and on the Internet.

Since Mr. Alferieff gave Правосланая Жизнь as his source for the quote, I had always assumed that the original printed source would contain an explanation of the primary source for this letter. Thus, I never asked him about this matter at the time.

But years later, when I finally checked that issue of П. Ж. (July 1968, No. 7, pp. 3-4), I saw that no further source is listed. I am not doubting the authenticity of the extract at this point, but I had always expected that the full letter, from which it was taken, would one day surface. In the course of our many years of research, this has, alas, not happened. I did look at all the issues for П. Ж. for 1968, in case a source was mentioned elsewhere, but none was.

Do bear in mind that in issue No. 7 that excerpt is followed by two authentic letters from captivity: one from Grand Duchess Olga Nicholaevna to her aunt, Grand Duchess Xenia Alexandrovna; and the other one from Grand Duchess Maria Nicholaevna to Z. S. Tolstaya. (If that means anything.)

As I said, I wish that I had addressed this question to Mr. Alferieff and the editors of П. Ж. at that time! Recently I did write to the fathers at Holy Trinity Monastery in Jordanville, New York, to ask them to look into this matter. They said that they would, but, of course, most of the fathers involved with that publication have passed away already years ago.

To avoid any possible confusion, let me point out that Holy Trinity Monastery publishes *two* magazines called "Orthodox Life" — one in Russian, and one in English. But they are totally separate journals, with differing content.

(BTW: The quote itself is a paraphrase of a passage from St. Paul's Epistle to the Romans 12:17-20.)

Another piece to the puzzle:

The poet Serge Bekhteev, brother of Zinaida Tolstaya, put that excerpt from Grand Duchess Olga Nicholaevna' letter into verse while living in Nice, France, in 1941.
http://soulibre.ru/Отец_всем_просит_передать_(Сергей_Бехтеев)
http://www.tsaarinikolai.com/tekstit/Sergej_Behteev1.pdf

That fact at least tells us that the excerpt must have been well known enough in émigré circles by 1941 for it to be put into verse.

Thus, we have moved back two decades in our quest to find the letter itself, or the first publication of the excerpt.

So, the search continues...

[Sarushka]

The poet Serge Bekhteev, brother of Zinaida Tolstaya, put that excerpt from Grand Duchess Olga Nicholaevna' letter into verse while living in Nice, France, in 1941.
http://soulibre.ru/Отец_всем_просит_передать_(Сергей_Бехтеев)
http://www.tsaarinikolai.com/tekstit/Sergej_Behteev1.pdf

That fact at least tells us that the excerpt must have been well known enough in émigré circles by 1941 for it to be put into verse.

Thus, we have moved back two decades in our quest to find the letter itself, or the first publication of the excerpt.

Very interesting.

Is it possible that Sergei Bekhteev was the original recipient of the letter that contained that quote?

[Sunny]

Very interesting, Inok Nikolai, thanks!!!

BTW: The quote itself is a paraphrase of a passage from St. Paul's Epistle to the Romans 12:17-20.

I had imagined it myself: the way of speaking seemed to me something from the Gospel. That's why i first thought that "father" was referred to the Lord and not to Nicholas.
I saw it as something religious, and you showed me i wasn't completely wrong, so thanks!

BTW for those who aren't religious:
Rm 12, 17-20 says:

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly; never be conceited. 17 Repay no one evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all. 18 If possible, so far as it depends upon you, live peaceably with all. 19 Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of God; for it is written, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord." 20 No, "if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him drink; for by so doing you will heap burning coals upon his head." 21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

I took the English text from here: http://www.bibleontheweb.com/Bible.asp; i have 4 Holy Bibles at home, 2 in italian, 1 in original Greek and 1 in Latin, but none in English, so i just copied down.

[Inok Nikolai]

I wonder if the letter was originally in English? ...she says she can't remember the word for a religious item...I think if she was writing in her usual Russian, she most likely would have...of course Olga and her  sisters spoke English with their mother ....  but then again at this time, often the use of a  language besides Russian was banned.    

http://forum.alexanderpalace.org/index.php?topic=3034.msg501492#msg501492

As mentioned earlier (see link above), these letters *were* written in Russian.

And it's not that surprising that Grand Duchess Olga Nicholaevna could not remember the precise name for a liturgical object used by the priest only once a year during the Paschal services.

It is called a "trisvechshnik" or "trekhsvechnik": трисвещник; трехсвечник.

It's a three-branched candlestick with an icon of the Resurrection mounted on it. The priest holds it while censing the church during the Paschal services. Often it is decorated with ribbons and flowers in addition to the icon and candles.

It can often be seen in photographs of the Paschal services in Russian Orthodox Churches.

Here are some seen on line:
http://tinyurl.com/7h52hx6

(Note that it should not be confused with the two and three-branched candlesticks held by an Orthodox bishop whenever he serves in church.)

[blessOTMA]

And it's not that surprising that Grand Duchess Olga Nicholaevna could not remember the precise name for a liturgical object used by the priest only once a year during the Paschal services. It is called a "trisvechshnik" or "trekhsvechnik": трисвещник; трехсвечник.

Thank you!   

[Sunny]

It is called a "trisvechshnik" or "trekhsvechnik": трисвещник; трехсвечник.

I know Russian but find it hard to pronounce; i'm not surprised, now, that Olgacouldn't remember the name.

[Olga Maria]

More letters!!! : DDD
Could we all help each other translate all these (including the links to the letters of Tatiana, Maria and Anastasia?)

[Antonina]

More letters!!! : DDD
Could we all help each other translate all these (including the links to the letters of Tatiana, Maria and Anastasia?)

All of them (and the most part of GD's letters published in web) are from the "Royal sisters of mercy". Unfortunately they are not new, but it's nice that Olga's letters are separated from other's))

[blessOTMA]

Indeed..it's very  nice seeing them listed with the dates and since they are online 
one can google translate them at one's own pace...or as a group

Thank you Shammie!   

[Sunny]

More letters!!! : DDD
Could we all help each other translate all these (including the links to the letters of Tatiana, Maria and Anastasia?)

I have just had a look at the link you gave for >Maria's letters and was wondering if in the site i would find also the other sisters' letters... here's the answer. Wow!

All of them (and the most part of GD's letters published in web) are from the "Royal sisters of mercy". Unfortunately they are not new, but it's nice that Olga's letters are separated from other's))

I have a downloadable version of RSOM and i had ahard time dividing the letters... having all of them there, each girl her owns is priceless for me.
I've an idea of translating them all, and give you an english version. It will be a very long task (i'm the kind of person who needs to change the way of passing freetime) but i'll do!