Author Topic: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy  (Read 87014 times)

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Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #45 on: October 09, 2005, 10:55:28 AM »
Quote

It is in the U.S, at least! I don't know really about Ireland, sorry if I ofended you, Prince! ;)



About the names, Froilán is not that Basque, it is just more medieval, at least here in Spain. It was quite common in the 11th, 12th and 13th centuries, then it just disappeared in most families!


No, no, I was not offended at all! I just thought that I wouldn't have wanted to be named after a surname!  ;D Well, in the US, they seem to make up names as they go along!  ;)

That's odd . . .I was sure Froilan sounded kind of Basque. Just me deceiving myself I guess.  :P
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umigon

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #46 on: October 09, 2005, 10:59:01 AM »


Here are some Basque names with F, with translation in brackets:

Fani, Feleizia (Labiano), Finia, Frantsesa (Frances), Frantziska (Frances), Fede (Faith), Florentxi (Florence), Frantxa (Frances), Fruitutsu (Fructuosa)

Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #47 on: October 09, 2005, 11:00:35 AM »
Haha, now that you post those, I see that none of them resemble Irish, except maybe Fani, Finia and Fede.  ;D
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bell_the_cat

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #48 on: October 09, 2005, 11:02:48 AM »
Back to the girls.

In Holà! magazine the couples are often referred to as the Duques de Lugo/ Palma de Mallorca in the same way as Andrew and Fergie were the Duques de York. It's
certainly more convenient way of doing the story than referring to them as the duchess of Lugo and her husband Jaime....

Maybe this is why the confusion has arisen, as popular magazines are not interested in the legal niceties!

Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #49 on: October 09, 2005, 11:04:55 AM »
You're right Bell. Just as the late Diana, Princess of Wales, was often WRONGLY referred to in the popular press as 'Princess Diana'. Hmm, if only the Spanish court could clarify the thing. So, if the ducal titles are not actually theirs, presumably Jaime and Inaki have no right to the 'HE' styling either?
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Offline Lucien

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #50 on: October 09, 2005, 11:05:58 AM »
Quote

It is in the U.S, at least! I don't know really about Ireland, sorry if I ofended you, Prince! ;)



About the names, Froilán is not that Basque, it is just more medieval, at least here in Spain. It was quite common in the 11th, 12th and 13th centuries, then it just disappeared in most families!


Ah Thanks Umigon,I've always liked Froilan,as in a name,not in the "slight nuisance' this little boy sometimes appears.

Nice initiative to revieve medieval names btw.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Lucien »
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umigon

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #51 on: October 09, 2005, 11:06:20 AM »


Yes, that is what I was saying. And of course no one bothers to correct that! By the way, Cristina's duchy is of an invented place! I am being very punctilious (is this word correct?) today! 'Palma de Mallorca' really doesn't exist, as the true name of the city is 'Palma'. Of course, as in the other issue, no one bothers to correct these things!

Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #52 on: October 09, 2005, 11:08:19 AM »
I can confirm that punctilious is indeed a word.  ;D

Yes, I was in Palma, and of course it was just 'Palma'. Maybe the 'de Mallorca' kind of refers to 'in Majorca'.

Still, makey-uppy titles are not that uncommon - there is no such place as Wessex, the title of Prince Edward, QEII's youngest son.
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umigon

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #53 on: October 09, 2005, 11:13:25 AM »


Yes, I know, and here in Spain we have many surname noble titles (my uncle is the Duke of Calvo-Sotelo, which is just a surname!). But the title was meant to represent a Spanish territory and, being punctilious, there is no such territory in Spain called "Palma de Mallorca"!! ;)

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #54 on: October 09, 2005, 11:16:08 AM »
Hmm . . . Lugo is a place then I suppose? I've never heard of it, but I don't pretend to have a good knowlege of Spanish geograpy.  ??? I've heard of titles in the Uk being used like surnames - like 'Baroness Thatcher' etc, but I've never heard of a dukedom like that. A shame it is just a surname Umigon, or you would have a noble connection!  ;D
"How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?"
-Sherlock Holmes

"Men forget, but never forgive; women forgive, but never forget."

bell_the_cat

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #55 on: October 09, 2005, 11:18:40 AM »
Diana's brother is Earl Spencer which is a surname, not a place - otherwise he would be Earl of Spencer. Can't think of any Dukes like this, apart from Duke Ellington of course!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by bell_the_cat »

umigon

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #56 on: October 09, 2005, 11:18:57 AM »


Still it is a noble connection! He is a Grande of Spain, and his French mother is descended, through bastard lines, of Henry II of France and Catherine the Great if Russia!


Going back to topic, yes, Lugo is indeed a place. A province and city in Galicia, in northern Spain.

bell_the_cat

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #57 on: October 09, 2005, 11:45:14 AM »
No it's not a port - it is quite a small place in Galicia I believe, smaller than Palma.

I wonder if that bothers Elena.

Does Umigon know why exactly these places were chosen?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by bell_the_cat »

Madal

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #58 on: October 09, 2005, 01:39:31 PM »
In Pilar Urbano's book Queen Sophia; she explained Elena's name come from a Queen Sophia's doll. When she was a child, she had a doll called Eleni. And she gave the same name for her first daughter.

I believe, Cristina and Inaki's son Juan Valentin was called Valentin after San Valentin de Berriotxoa;  Inaki's father a greatgreatgreat .... uncle.

bell_the_cat

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Re: Titles, orders, royal law, regalia & rituals of the Spanish monarchy
« Reply #59 on: October 09, 2005, 05:15:06 PM »
Great stuff, Madal!

Does the book explain why the titles were chosen for Elena and Cristina?