Maria II of Portugal and her family

[YaBB_Jose]

She must have been famous because Prince Ernst II of Saxe gave her the title of "Countess of Edla".

Some sites say that she already had the title when she arrived to Portugal, others say that she was named Countess only when she married Fernando.

Does anybody know more about her title?

I always read that the title was bestowed on her on D. Fernando's request ; not because of her artistic gifts   .

If Alice was really D.Fernando's daughter, that would have explain much about prude D. Pedro's behaviour towards his father.
But I don't think he ever wrote about it.
And there's no mention of her either by D.Luis or D.Carlos.

Thanks for posting the link to Chalet da Condessa.
I found that site yesterday on Copernico but I could not open it.

It was really a romantic place.
What a shame that it burnt.
On the links I posted above, all said that the Chalet will be rebuilt. Let's hope so, and specially, let's hope it will have a proper surveillance that would prevent hooligans to use it for satanic rites and other things.

[Callasboy]

Hello everyone,

Well it seems that we have a lively discussion going on here. It's always a pleasure to read your comments.

The countess of Edla wasn't an actress. She was an Opera singer who visited Portugal as part of an Opera company visiting several Portuguese cities. In Oporto she wasn't very well received, however in Lisbon, where men seemed to be a lot more appreciative of her physical attibutes, she was extremely well received. One of the men she managed to impress was no other than D. Fernando.

Even though heartbroken with the death of his wife, Queen D. Maria II, and having to dedicate himself to his family, he was a big fan of chorus girls, and spent a great deal of time backstage at the Opera. Some reports of the time claim that he almost lived there...hehehehe.

The countess however, Elise Hanzler at the time, wasn't the sort of woman to settle  for what she probably saw as being a quick fling. She was known to spend the night at the Palace with D. Fernando and then leave to go across the river where she kept another lover. While living in Oporto she had a relationship with a musician called Miguel Angelo Pereira who gave her 2 sons.

After 1863 when D. Luiz assumed the throne, D. Fernando started to assume the relationship causing a tremendous scandal. The king wanting to legalize the situation, as a way of controling damage, contacted the bishop of Viseu hoping that there would be way of giving Elise some sort of title so that a morganatic marriage wouldn't be so scandalous. The bishop however point blanc refused to give his blessing, pointing out to the king that he could even loose his crown as a consequence of it. She finally receives the title of countess through the influence of Ernest II of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha.

After they got married a very interesting episode took place where the throne of Spain was offered to D. Fernando, causing her to almost become queen of Spain.

Even after they got married while D. Fernando would be invited to all sorts of events, she woudn't be included in the invitation. As a consequence D. Fernado started attending only official ceremonies, making very clear the fact that if invitations weren't extended to his wife he would decline them.

[YaBB_Jose]

Hello everyone,

After they got married a very interesting episode took place where the throne of Spain was offered to D. Fernando, causing her to almost become queen of Spain.

Apparently the spanish diplomats were so busy trying to solve the mess that Queen Isabel II caused that they hadn't realised that D. Fernando got married to Elisa.

When they came to Lisbon to offer the throne to the king he asked them what would be his wife's position in court and they were flabbergasted as they ignored the king's marriage.

They asked a time to sort out her status - never as queen - and D. Fernando, who was not that interested in becoming King of Spain, swiftly declined the offer.

[YaBB_Jose]

A new book was just published about Elise Hensler.

Called "A Condessa de Edla" it is the first work of Teresa Rebelo, published by Editorial Atheneia

ISBN 989 622 031X

I took a brief look and it seemed very interesting with lots of photos and pictures of D.Fernando, the Countess, the RF, Elise's descendants, etc.

[YaBB_Jose]

Sorry, wrong editor.
It's Aletheia not Atheneia
http://genealogia.netopia.pt/livraria/livro.php?id=488

[alixaannencova]

Hello

I wonder if any one knows of any really good books in English about Maria II and her family? I would love to find something in English as I do not speak Portuguese!!!

Also are there any 'coffee table' books about the House of Braganca and their homes? I want to learn more about this fascinating Royal family and their beautiful Kingdom!! 

[dmitri]

Guide Books are available in English in most of the former Royal Palaces in Portugal. I picked up one at Ajuda Palace, Queluez Palace and the Pena Palace in Sintra. I also picked up a great book on the former Portuguese Crown jewels and also one on Queen Maria Pia. I wish I could have picked up biographies in English but they were sadly only in Portuguese. They are not so good at catering for foreigners.

[Norbert]

you are so lucky. The Ajuda was closed and Queluz was sterile in atmosphere. I enjoyed the Pena Castle which was described in 1980 as an" example of vulgar decadance of the former tyrants"

[dmitri]

The Ajuda Palace can sometimes be closed for State Dinners. The republic still uses the large State Dining Room. It is normally open. It was largely redecorated by Queen Maria Pia. She lived there until shortly before being forced to flee with the onset of the 1910 revolution. It is really worth a visit. A wonderful tram takes you up there from the city.

[YaBB_Jose]

The Ajuda Palace can sometimes be closed for State Dinners. The republic still uses the large State Dining Room. It is normally open. It was largely redecorated by Queen Maria Pia. She lived there until shortly before being forced to flee with the onset of the 1910 revolution. It is really worth a visit. A wonderful tram takes you up there from the city.

And until February, you can visit the Hermitage exhibition at D.Luis Galeria - part of the palace.
Palácio is the most sumptuous, yet unfinished, royal palace of Lisbon.
When King D.Luis died, his son D.Carlos decided that he would not have his Mother moving from a palace she loved so much and that she personally redecorated with such passion, so he lived in Belém Palace, nowadays the official residence of the President of the Republic.
This one opens one day per year at the National Monuments Day and sometimes one day in April (National Holiday).
On Sundays you can watch the Changeing of the Horse Guards cerimony.

[Norbert]

Why do these Republics keep all the ceremony of the former monarchys....changing the guard etc? And the president lives in a Royal palace?

[YaBB_Jose]

The official explanation for Presidents to live in Royal Palaces is that ... they are available and it is easier to protect the president in a palace than in its own residence/flat.

Many of our presidents don't actually live in the palace but it is their official residence, i.e., they work and entertain their visitors there.

I know that the King and Queen of Spain once had dinner at former president Sampaio flat in Lisbon.
That should have caused some chill to the security.

There is a nice (and true) story that one of the first presidents (1st republic 1910/26) refused the official driver and car, and went to work in Belém Palace by tramway.
Those were the days :-)

[Norbert]

At least the soviets were true to their creed and invented new ceremonies . I find it daft to surround the Republican President with the grandeur of it's royal heritage. It just does not work at any level. I agree the French president is ridiculous to maintain the Elysee and be chaperoned with guards dressed in imperial uniforms....I understand the security but to maintain a court in a Royal Palace at public expense, whats wrong with putting some guards outside their family home.

[DonaAntonia]

Princess Maria Anna






Her daughters Mathilde and Maria Josepha






Her son Frederick William




Her grandson Frederick Christian




It sure is wonderful to see descendents of Braganzas who believed in Democracy! King Carlos did not die without any relatives except for his mother, brother, wife and sons, all of which have no issue. He was part of an enlarged family and this particular aunt was always close to him. Princess Maria Anna married Prince Georg of Saxony in 1859, at the Necessidades Chapel, in Lisbon. Unlike people generally think, she did not renounce totally to her succession rights. Her marriage agreement did say that, in the case of her brothers having no issue, she would again assume her rights to the Portuguese throne. That was the constitutional and democratic law still practiced in 1910, when Portugal became a Republic.

[DonaAntonia]

Princess Maria Anna photographed in Lisbon, 1859, by court photographer F. A. Gomes.