Author Topic: The Curse of Hesse  (Read 25807 times)

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rita

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2005, 02:49:20 PM »
Thomas, I think, that is a special of the rhine main area. Here is not a people everybodys darling, in this area it is: she belonds to us, she is a part of the area.

stepan

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2005, 03:52:12 PM »
The author Viktor Alexandrov doesen´t give any source for this allegation or any clue from where he got this information. So I think it´s only a rumour or slander from an unreliable source somewhere. And noone here seems to have heard about it so I can´t believe it´s true.

bluetoria

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2005, 06:12:35 PM »
Quote
Thomas, I think, that is a special of the rhine main area. Here is not a people everybodys darling, in this area it is: she belonds to us, she is a part of the area.


Welcome to the forum rita  :). How wonderful for you to believe she 'belongs to you.' I'm sure she would be deeply touched.

I wonder, Stepan, if this story came about through the mentioned of her 'coming to us behind a coffin' as she arrived in Russia at the time of Alexander III's death. Stories such as this were probably very likely to have spread and become 'urban legends.' Poor Alix.  :(  

anabel

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #18 on: September 04, 2005, 07:25:40 AM »
Quote
I agree that the Hessians seemed to suffer one tragedy after another, but - merely speculating  :) - it would be interesting to compare them with any other large family over several generations. Perhaps their situation as not to different from other people's. Do you think??

I don´t wan´t to be precocious, but there is said to be a curse on the ducal Bavarian house, too. A monk said to Empress Elisabeth of Austria, who, as you all know, was a born Duchess in Bavaria, that in the time of 100 years her family should die out (which didn´t seem likely then, as both Carl Theodor (2) and Max Emanuel (3) had sons. However, the curse became true and the head of the ducal house nowadays is an adopted Prince of Bavaria, who has "only" girls himself.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by anabel »

bluetoria

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #19 on: September 05, 2005, 06:07:19 PM »
It didn't sound precocious, anabel  :). Do you think maybe all royal Houses could be said to be cursed? If you look at most of them they had their fair share of tragedies...looking back at grandduchessella's list perhaps because they were royal, people just decided it must be a curse.

Offline trentk80

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2005, 12:25:37 AM »
Perhaps because they were royals people decided it must be a curse like you said, bluetoria, but on the other hand their share of tragedies was uncommon to say the least. Just take look at empress Alexandra's life: she lost two siblings and her mother when she was 6 years old, she was hated by her husband's family, she was hated by most of her subjects, she gave birth to an haemophiliac son, she was very ill, she lost her throne, and finally she was executed with her husband and children. Now if you also take into account the tragedies of Ernie, Ella, Irene, etc. it's too much to say it's just a coincidence! I don't know if there was a curse, but they were too tragic to say it was a mere coincidence.
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Offline Rosamund

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #21 on: September 06, 2005, 02:34:46 PM »
It could be said that the tragedies carried on into recent times as Alix's nephew, Lord Mountbatten, was assassinated by the IRA.    

Offline grandduchessella

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #22 on: September 06, 2005, 06:28:54 PM »
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It could be said that the tragedies carried on into recent times as Alix's nephew, Lord Mountbatten, was assassinated by the IRA.    


Along with his grandson. Didn't a grandchild or great-granchild die of cancer in recent years?
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bookworm857158367

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #23 on: September 06, 2005, 09:17:36 PM »
Quote

Along with his grandson. Didn't a grandchild or great-granchild die of cancer in recent years?



A great-grandchild named the Hon. Leonora Knatchbull, who died at the age of 5 in October 1991. Her father is Norton Knatchbull and her grandmother was Lord Mountbatten's elder daughter Patricia. Her older brother and sister, incidentally, are named Nicholas and Alexandra. It was quite a sad story.

Some families do seem to be cursed with more than their share of early and/or violent death. Look at the Kennedy family tree too.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by bookworm857158367 »

Prince_Christopher

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #24 on: September 06, 2005, 09:51:33 PM »
And along with Lord Mountbatten, the early death of his older brother, George, of cancer.

Although she wasn't a member of the Hesse family, wasn't Lord Brabourne's mother also killed in the attack?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Prince_Christopher »

Offline Rosamund

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #25 on: September 07, 2005, 04:32:31 PM »
Yes, Lady Brabourne, Senior, was also murdered by the IRA.  

If I am remembering correctly from Marlene's book, Lady Patricia Mountbatten had a stillborn son in the 1950's as well as suffering the loss of Nicholas (a twin) in 1979.

Tragedies have occurred among the descendants of Sophie of Greece as well, including the death of her grandson Christopher of Yugoslavia.  'Queen Victoria's Descendants' by Marlene Eilers Koenig has information about the lesser-known family members.

Caleb

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #26 on: September 19, 2005, 09:09:48 PM »
It could have been just a coincidence in the house of Hesse. Supposedly in Chinese history it was prophicied that either, at the hands of the Manchu, a Yehe cheif, dying in a tower set ablaze by the Manchus, or on a marble plaque, it was said that it became known to the Manchu's either by word of mouth, or by plaque that the Manchus would fall because of a Yehe woman. The Manchus didnt risk it so they didnt take Yehe women into the imperial harem, but in 1853 a woman, part Yehe, part Nala (known as Yehonala) was admitted into the harem. This woman would be known as Empress Dowager Cixi & three years after her death in 1908, in 1911 the Manchu dynasty collapsed. I personally dont think that it was a curse, it was just political unrest, bankruptcy & imperialism that caused the collapse of the Chinese Empire. Besides personally I think that this was also used an excuse to blame problems with China on the Empress Dowager. In a way, the Manchus signed their own death warrant by ignoring the wishes of the Chinese people. I, being a Christian, say that these emperors shouldnt have been committing polyagamy anyways

bluetoria

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #27 on: September 20, 2005, 10:44:20 AM »
How interesting, Caleb! Thank you for that.

There is always the possibility too of a 'curse' becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy. Once people believe they are cursed they open their eyes to every possible tragedy and consider it 'fate' and then perhaps, in some cases, they even bring misfortune onto themselves by their attitude of pessimism and expecting the worst. (I am not saying that this was the case in Hesse...just that it can and does happen.)  

Naslednik Norvezhskiy

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #28 on: October 16, 2010, 12:58:58 AM »
The Hessian Curse of the Romanovs:
All Romanovs who married Princesses of Hesse (Paul I, Alexander II, Serge Alexandrovich and Nicholas II) died at the hands of assassins!
« Last Edit: October 16, 2010, 01:02:32 AM by Фёдор Петрович »

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: The Curse of Hesse
« Reply #29 on: October 18, 2010, 10:15:08 AM »
'Perhaps because they were royals people decided it must be a curse like you said, bluetoria, but on the other hand their share of tragedies was uncommon to say the least. Just take look at empress Alexandra's life: she lost two siblings and her mother when she was 6 years old, she was hated by her husband's family, she was hated by most of her subjects, she gave birth to an haemophiliac son, she was very ill, she lost her throne, and finally she was executed with her husband and children. Now if you also take into account the tragedies of Ernie, Ella, Irene, etc. it's too much to say it's just a coincidence! I don't know if there was a curse, but they were too tragic to say it was a mere coincidence.'

I think we have to bear in mind that in the 19th century it was the rule rather than the exception for individuals to lose at least one sibling in childhood, and the loss of a parent was all too common. My maternal grandmother, born in 1891, was the only survivor of four (two died in a scarlet fever epidemic and a third as an infant). An old friend told me that when his father was 11, in 1886, the entire family of six went down with scarlet fever (a disease which has now just about disappeared) and the two youngest died. My maternal grandfather, born in 1885, lost his mother at the age of four (from a stillbirth). My paternal grandmother, also born in 1885, was one of ten, two of whom died in childhood, and another in childbirth as a young adult. My paternal grandfather, born in 1878, lost his father at 16 and one of his four sisters as an infant.

Ann