Spanish Bourbon Infantas

[CountessKate]

The dress looks like 1790's style to me, but I could be wrong. Perhaps CountessKate knows if the dress and hairstyle are from the 1790's.

I would have to say that the dress and hair in the portrait looks rather more like one from the 1760s or at the latest, the early 1770s - the stiff pointed bodice, the high hair are similar to portraits of this period rather than to the 1790s.  If one looks at a portrait of Maria Amalia's exact contemporary, Maria Christina of Bourbon Two-Sicilies, the style is very different.  This is the latter, portrayed in 1790 by Vigee Le Brun:



Even allowing for Vigee Le Brun's informal style, the shape and structure of the gown and the hairstyle is quite different from the alleged Maria Amalia.  If one looks at at a more formal picture, however, of Carolina Maria Teresa of Parma, wife of Maximilian of Saxony, painted c. 1792 by Anton Graff, again the clothing and hairstyle is very different from the girl in the portrait under consideration:



And finally, looking at a more formal Vigee Le Brun portrait of Maria Christina’s oldest sister the Empress Maria Theresa, again painted in 1790, one has to say that the portrait of their supposed cousin Maria Amalia does not convince.  Maria Luisa was very much in the mode and I can’t see her putting her children into fashions of 20 years before. 

[Bourgogne]

I'm don't even sure the portrait on geneall.net is really her. As you say, MA is said to habe been unattractive and this girl is cute, and I think this dress and hairstyle are not very compatible with 1790 or even later (because this girl seems to be a least 11 y.o. and if it's Maria-Amalie that would make 1790...)

The dress looks like 1790's style to me, but I could be wrong. Perhaps CountessKate knows if the dress and hairstyle are from the 1790's.

I would have to say that the dress and hair in the portrait looks rather more like one from the 1760s or at the latest, the early 1770s - the stiff pointed bodice, the high hair are similar to portraits of this period rather than to the 1790s.  If one looks at a portrait of Maria Amalia's exact contemporary, Maria Christina of Bourbon Two-Sicilies, the style is very different.  This is the latter, portrayed in 1790 by Vigee Le Brun:

That's exactly what I wanted to say when I wrote that Maria-Amelia's little picture wasn't really compatible with the fashion of the 1790's, for young girls.

I was precisely thinking to this portrait of Maria-Christina of Sicilies by Mme Vigée-Lebrun, and also to another exact contemporary, Madame Royale (Marie-Thérèse of France, Louis XVI's daughter) painted by Mme Vigée-Lebrun, by Wertmuller and by Dumont between 1785 and 1789. Everywhere we can see this same type of dress (more or less a "gaulle", the trend started by Marie-Antoinette), no corset but a high mousseline waistband, and of course the hair without powder and arranged in low soft curls...

So, I have strong doubts about the little picture of geneall.net... by the way I've noticed that there are sometimes some mistakes in the identifications of this site - like everywhere else, it's true.

I think that the girl next to Infante Antonio in Goya's family portrait is Maria Amalia. Although she was dead, she was painted with the rest of the family as a way of stating that they still remembered her. Besides, it was common to have portraits of deceased royals made for their family. For instance, there were at least 3 portraits of her grandmother, Louise Elisabeth of France, which were painted after her death. Why? Because her family wanted to have portraits of their beloved late relative.

That's true. For example, in the famous "Louis XIV's family" by Jean Nocret, we can see Anne of Austria and Henrietta-Maria of France, and several children, who all were already dead when the picture was made. There is also many portraits of Louise-Elisabeth and her sister Henriette of France, who are also postumous, and so on...

I think that Maria-Amelia is indeed the woman on Goya's painting.

First because she's very close to Antonio, really like a husband and his wife.

And secondly because if it was Carlotta-Joaquina, why her husband wouldn't be there too? Maria-Louisa is in the picture with her husband Louis of Parma, so Carlotta-Joaquina should be with her husband the future Joao VI...

[trentk80]

I would have to say that the dress and hair in the portrait looks rather more like one from the 1760s or at the latest, the early 1770s - the stiff pointed bodice, the high hair are similar to portraits of this period rather than to the 1790s.

Thanks for the information, CountessKate. However, it seems that the wide hoops, high hair and stiff pointed bodice were still used at the Spanish court in the late 18th century, as shown in this portrait of Infanta Carlota Joaquina from 1785:

http://www.museodelprado.es/coleccion/galeria-on-line/galeria-on-line/obra/carlota-joaquina-infanta-de-espana-reina-de-portugal/

Is it possible that the style survived a bit longer in Spain?

And secondly because if it was Carlotta-Joaquina, why her husband wouldn't be there too? Maria-Louisa is in the picture with her husband Louis of Parma, so Carlotta-Joaquina should be with her husband the future Joao VI...

According to some authors, Carlota Joaquina is the girl who turns her face away in Goya's family portrait. This was meant to represent that she was away in Portugal.

[CountessKate]

However, it seems that the wide hoops, high hair and stiff pointed bodice were still used at the Spanish court in the late 18th century, as shown in this portrait of Infanta Carlota Joaquina from 1785

I agree there was clearly a survival in very formal court fashion for hoops and stiff bodices, but the hair style of the painting of Carlota Joaquina was in the style of the period and does not match the 'Maria Amalia' portrait.  If the latter is an informal portrait - which seems likely as she does not seem to be wearing hoops, and her dress and hair are very plain - then it appears contemporary with the 1760s or early '70s.  In an informal portrait one would expect her to look like her fashionable cousins in Italy and Austria and France, but in a formal portrait it is likely she would have all the trappings of the court princess, with fashionable hair and lots of trimmings and lace along with a stiff bodice and hoops.  Of course, I don't know enough about the portraiture of the court, and this could have been something knocked off by a local artist of no great significance for a family member for a keepsake, like a cheap photo - the results may not be exactly first class.  But as the correspondence between Maria Theresa and Marie Antoinette demonstrates, portraiture was a very important aspect of royal families' presentations of themselves, and the Spanish royal family were no exception, and used to the best quality.

[Infante John]

In books I consulted. The young princess is described as a shy, homely, short and clumsy. His handsome cousin Louis of Parma, a thousand times better to marry Marie Louise, though she was not beautiful, if it was cheerful, lively and intelligent. The king saw that would be very difficult to get another advantageous marriage, they decided to marry her to her uncle Antonio Pascual, rude and stupid. preferred this, before his daughter ends up being a spinster.

[CountessKate]

I've always liked the charming portraits by Giuseppe Bonito of the daughters of Carlos III:



Maria Isabel (1743-1749)



Maria Josefa (1744-1801)



Maria Luisa (1745-1792)

[YaBB_Jose]

Maria Luisa (1745-1792)

I am interested in Infanta Maria Luisa of whom I know basically nothing .

Did she play any significant role on the austrian court or did she limited to the usual role of breeding children to her husband and emperor ?

Did she have any special gifts ?

[trentk80]

I am interested in Infanta Maria Luisa of whom I know basically nothing .

Did she play any significant role on the austrian court or did she limited to the usual role of breeding children to her husband and emperor ?

Did she have any special gifts ?

You can read something about Maria Luisa (or Maria Ludovica) here:

http://www.habsburger.net/en/chapter/be-fruitful-and-multiply

[Eric_Lowe]

She did have a lot of babies...