Author Topic: Anne Boleyn  (Read 280700 times)

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Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #165 on: August 16, 2007, 03:24:09 PM »
Quick reference of David Starkey's "Six Wives: The Queens of Henry VIII" on page 160, Chapter 29. "On the Shelf"
Catherine was now on the shelf--in the sense that she was stuck in that limbo reserves for wives whose husbands do not much care about them one way or another. She became uglier and duller and more devoted to learning and religion. Meanwhile, Henry took mistresses, spent time with the boys and even occasionally, immersed himself in the serious business of government.

In the above paragraph, mistresses is in bold. This is plural. This is before he met Mistress Anne.

Oh yes, Henry had mistresses, of course he did, but compared to say, Francis I, it was child's play. We are talking you can count them on one hand, which is nothing for a king. Most of his mistresses were either long-term (Bessie Blount, Mary Boleyn) or he married them...

Offline FaithWhiteRose

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #166 on: August 16, 2007, 03:26:42 PM »
Quick reference of David Starkey's "Six Wives: The Queens of Henry VIII" on page 160, Chapter 29. "On the Shelf"
Catherine was now on the shelf--in the sense that she was stuck in that limbo reserves for wives whose husbands do not much care about them one way or another. She became uglier and duller and more devoted to learning and religion. Meanwhile, Henry took mistresses, spent time with the boys and even occasionally, immersed himself in the serious business of government.

In the above paragraph, mistresses is in bold. This is plural. This is before he met Mistress Anne.

Of course Henry had many mistresses, but that does not mean he engaged in very sexual activities with everyone of them if you know what I mean. His first mistress was Elizabeth Stafford, and he used his friend William Compton as his shield so no one could find out (they did eventually though). The most famous of his mistresses are Bessie Blount, whom he had a son with, and Mary Boleyn.

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #167 on: August 16, 2007, 03:29:59 PM »
His first mistress was Elizabeth Stafford

I don't think things even went as far as ES becoming his mistress. He was "discovered" when he tried to approach her, there was a scandal and she was sent away from court. I think his first real mistress was Bessie Blount... Remember that for quite a few years Henry was faithful to Catherine of A...

Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #168 on: August 16, 2007, 03:31:32 PM »
Of course Henry had many mistresses

I really don't think it was "many". It was a handful really, and by the standards of the day he was pretty undersexed... He had more wives than mistresses.

Offline Kimberly

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #169 on: August 16, 2007, 03:40:00 PM »
OK , its a bit O/T but what the heck.
1) David Starkey, Six Wives;
P615. "Henry had developed a severe ulceration on the calf of his left leg.Not syphilitic as some have supposed.
2) Mistresses; he was positively chaste compared to some. Bessie Blount
                                                                                 Lady Elizabeth Fitzwalter??
                                                                                 Mary Boleyn
                                                                                 Madge Shelton??
His soiled reputation springs from his multiple marriages.

                                                                                 
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Offline Helen_Azar

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #170 on: August 16, 2007, 03:50:55 PM »
David Starkey, Six Wives;
P615. .. ... he was positively chaste compared to some.

Wow, Starkey used almost identical words to describe Henry as I did  ;D.

Offline Kimberly

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #171 on: August 16, 2007, 03:55:27 PM »
Ooops sorry the syphilis bit was Starkey. The rest was my shocking typing skills, but you get the gist.
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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #172 on: August 16, 2007, 04:57:59 PM »
OK , its a bit O/T but what the heck.
1) David Starkey, Six Wives;
P615. "Henry had developed a severe ulceration on the calf of his left leg.Not syphilitic as some have supposed.                                                                           
I already knew that. Catherine Parr frequently massaged his calf to make him feel better.
I shall have to get back to you on the STD question. I am at work and haven't the resources to do the topic justice.

Offline FaithWhiteRose

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #173 on: August 16, 2007, 07:58:07 PM »
His first mistress was Elizabeth Stafford
Remember that for quite a few years Henry was faithful to Catherine of A...

How many years, exactly?

Offline Silja

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #174 on: August 19, 2007, 03:31:25 PM »
As for Anne I don't think her treatment of Mary was a problem. Mary had been declared a bastard and refused to come to heel. Her father was King and she openly caused trouble not only in his lifetime but also after his death. She was a dreadful monarch.   

From Henry VIII's point of view also Anne "caused trouble" after becoming queen, not only by nagging all the time, but also by not giving him a son and increasingly becoming a threat to potential new alliances with the empire. I think Henry's point of view is hardly an objective criterion in judging either Mary's or Anne's behaviour in this particular context.
Anne could indeed be a very arrogant person, and her treatment of Mary was pretty shameful. But such behaviour was not unusual at the Tudor court where faction fight and intrigue were the most common things.   

Offline dmitri

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #175 on: August 19, 2007, 06:32:27 PM »
Anne Boleyn's main problem was not giving birth to a son who survived. Henry divorced Catherine of Aragon because she could give him no living son. Jane Seymour gave Henry a son but died. Anne of Cleves was not sexually interesting for Henry and Catherine Howard and Catherine Parr did not fall pregnant to Henry although Catherine Parr did have a child after Henry died by another man. How different things would have been for Catherine of Aragon had she the benefit of modern medicine. Most of her children would have survived today. How different history would have been as well.

Offline FaithWhiteRose

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #176 on: August 20, 2007, 01:29:15 PM »
dmitri, we do have a 'what if' thread entitled 'Kathrine and Anne', where we discussed exactly what your talking about.

Offline lady

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #177 on: September 09, 2007, 07:19:14 AM »
One of my save pics of my fave Queen

Offline dmitri

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #178 on: September 09, 2007, 09:14:47 AM »
I do think in the long run England won out as she ended up with Elizabeth I as her Queen. No doubt Anne Boleyn would have been very proud of her daughter had she lived to see her become Queen.

Offline FaithWhiteRose

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Re: Anne Boleyn
« Reply #179 on: September 21, 2007, 02:57:47 PM »
It's extremely sad that Anne didn't see her daughter as Queen... has anyone noticed that the most famous love stories end in bloody deaths? Examples: Paris and Helen, Antony and Cleopatra, Anne and Henry, Romeo and Juliet etc...