Biggest questions I want answered

[Finelly]

Part of the reason many people just didn't believe that AA was FS was because FS was a "peasant and factory worker" and no way could such a person have acted like a noble person.

Well, first of all, FS was not a peasant.  Her family was not poor and owned a fair amount of land.  She didn't live out in the country, isolated from gentry, but rather had plenty of access to people of different classes.  To behave in a genteel manner is not reserved for the upper classes, and I have no doubt that many "peasants" could and did come across in a cultured way.  The comments by Xenia and others about her demeanor simply reveal the imperial snobbery that existed at the time.

As for being a "factory worker", she didn't work at the factory for very long.  During WWI, many emigres had to resort to manual or industrial labor, and I daresay there were many people of upper classes working around her.  (I wonder if anyone has investigated that aspect of her life at all?)  She could have learned a lot at that time in her life about how the "other people" act.

AA/FS had plenty of opportunity to conceal any behavioral errors with her illnesses and depression.  She didn't have to talk if she didn't want to (or couldn't, for whatever reasons).  She didn't have to get out of bed if she was ill (or couldn't behave appropriately).  She could run off and cry or have a tantrum if she sensed she was trapped or about to be caught. In other words, she didn't have to act the part consistently, 24/7.  

And by being bedridden or unable to cope, she had plenty of opportunity to watch her visitors and learn about both them and their expectations of a GD.  

Now, what I find very interesting is that her tubercular arm caused her to often go into a feverish spell where she would become delirious.  This happened while she was staying with HR and also at the sanitarium when she was attended by doctors.  Either they were very naive, or she managed, despite not being clear in her mind, to not let go of the role she was playing, not reveal her true self.  Was this because she truly believed it by then, or because she was so strongly on guard that even delirium would not cause her to lose control totally?

[Inquiring_Mind]

One of the issues here addressed was that AA/FS's family came to her and after conversation, decided to let her go with her "new career".

This makes me wonder about human nature. You go to see a sister that may or may not have been killed by a serial killer.....and you deny her? Because your life is so dismal she is better off?

You talk to her and she is claiming to be a grand duchess and you leave her there?

You don't look into your sister's eyes and see a woman who is ill and needs you like she has never needed you before? You worry someone may come after money they may never recover? What money?

Even the most hard hearted of us would try to help someone we grew up with get help?

Or not.

Whoever AA was, no one wanted to claim her. An that was the true tragedy.

[Annie]

One of the issues here addressed was that AA/FS's family came to her and after conversation, decided to let her go with her "new career".

This makes me wonder about human nature. You go to see a sister that may or may not have been killed by a serial killer.....and you deny her? Because your life is so dismal she is better off?

You talk to her and she is claiming to be a grand duchess and you leave her there?

You don't look into your sister's eyes and see a woman who is ill and needs you like she has never needed you before? You worry someone may come after money they may never recover? What money?

Even the most hard hearted of us would try to help someone we grew up with get help?

Or not.

Whoever AA was, no one wanted to claim her. An that was the true tragedy.

Um, may I raise my hand here? I speak from PERSONAL  experience as someone whose siblings TOTALLY and COMPLETELY turned their backs on me at my time of deepest pain and trouble. I am not the only person I know who has had this problem. It happens. Money or your sister, it's going to be money.

But in AA's case, it was to her advantage not to be exposed. She could have gotten in trouble for the false claim, so they did her a big favor too. Besides, it was obvious by that point she did not WANT to be Franziska anymore.

[Finelly]

What if........the family didn't disavow her because of money.  What if .......they really didn't recognize her?

How many years after her disappearance did AA meet up with Felix?  And after that how many years before she met him and the others again?

During that period of time, she:  lost a lot of weight (look at the first hospital photos - she's healthy looking - look at other ones, she's very thin), had some teeth pulled, suffered thru tuberculosis of the bone (the pain alone will change features), gotten older, and adopted a new personality.

To be sure, the initial presentation will be similar (so Felix recognized her).  But spend some time looking at her, and ....does she really look like his sister?  Now add the fact that she shows absolutely no sign of recognizing him.....that's strange, makes him wonder....and speaks a different language....even weirder....and carries herself differently.

Might have happened that way.

[Inquiring_Mind]

Annie,

I quess we are looking at it both from personal experience. Yes, money is a great divider. I am an orphan with an older sister. No way would I deny her! Although she is 6 yrs older and I never got to know her when we were growing up. I knew what she looked liked, I heard her voice.

Was there tons of money to be gotten from FS's family? Probably not. Would a woman mentally ill be held accountable for her actions if her family had come forward. Probably not.

Think about it...the sister has been in mental hospitals and thinks she is a grand duchess...now I want to take her home...let's call it even.

Susie

[Finelly]

Felix is alleged to have told people that his sister got "a good deal" out of her impersonation.

However, the only source we have for such a statement is his niece, who apparently asked for money in order to be interviewed......

I wonder if, at the times Felix met AA, she really anticipated ever having money.  She doesn't appear to have advocated for herself very well, leaving the arguments and lawsuits to others, and only grudgingly participated.

[Finelly]

Another thing about the money.  According to Marina Schweitzer and others, AA got a lot of money, in the form of small postal orders, from people over the years when she lived in that small village in Bavaria.  

She didn't cash most of them.  What she did cash, she apparently spent on dog food.  Hardly the sign of someone after $$$$.

[Mgmstl]

Felix is alleged to have told people that his sister got "a good deal" out of her impersonation.

However, the only source we have for such a statement is his niece, who apparently asked for money in order to be interviewed......

I wonder if, at the times Felix met AA, she really anticipated ever having money.  She doesn't appear to have advocated for herself very well, leaving the arguments and lawsuits to others, and only grudgingly participated.

Very good point on the niece Finelly.  She REFUSED to be interviewed without compensation.  

The fact remains, that we can use speculative statements such as that of the niece, we must use them carefully, and not take them too seriously.  The siblings themselves NEVER said singly or as a group in sworn testimony or an affadavit that this was their sister.  

Felix signed an affadavit that this was NOT his sister.
Why would he do that if he was so worried about being responsible for her actions if she were declared a fraud.

As for the other siblings the only time ANY of them saw AA was during the 1938 forced meeting in Hannover. Over 20 years had passed since they had seen her.

[lexi4]

Here's a theory on the family. Maybe they did recognize her, but figured it was "tough love" time. That there was nothing they could do for her but walk away and let her sort this out. Maybe her mental state was such that when she met with them they couldn't get through to her so they decided it best just to walk away. Kind of sad. But if it was obvious to her siblings than nothing they could say would convince her she was FS, is she seemed totally dilusional, then what other choice could the make but to leave her as they found her. Knowing that at least this way she would be taken care of and get the medical attention she needed. Maybe they hoped that one day, she would figure it out and come home, who knows?

[Annie]

Here's a theory on the family. Maybe they did recognize her, but figured it was "tough love" time.

I see no difference between that and turning their backs on her to avoid responsibility. They legally disavowed her. That means they REALLY didn't want to deal with her. They didn't want to pay for her, and they didn't want her to have to pay.

But again this thread is hopeless as long as the specter of her still being Anastasia or someone else keeps coming up. I really REALLY wanted to discuss this from a point of view that she IS Franziska Schanskowska. There are zillions of other 'who is she' and 'maybe whatever' threads. If this is going to turn into another debate over her identity, FA might as well close it now, I'm not interested.

[Finelly]

I'm confused, Annie.  What am I missing?  The last 5 responses haven't said anything about FS being AN.

I thought this was going well.

[lexi4]

I agree Finelly.
Annie, I was merely posting a theory for discussion and did not mean to upset you with the theory I presented. I did post from the point of view that AA was FS. Apparently I touched a nerve, which I did not mean to do.

[Annie]

I agree Finelly.
Annie, I was merely posting a theory for discussion and did not mean to upset you with the theory I presented. I did post from the point of view that AA was FS. Apparently I touched a nerve, which I did not mean to do.

No you didn't, it was something else, sorry. Anyway it is going well. Thanks to those discussing this.

[rskkiya]

I think when she jumped in the canal that night in 1920, she did not want to live anymore. She killed herself off that night. She wanted nothing to do with her life, and so when she survived, she refused to admit to her identity. She did not want them to find out who she was, her past, or tell her family. Of course, amnesia, even temporary, is possible considering her mental state.

I also wonder what really happened to her baby, and how this played into her wanting to kill herself.
 

   An open question to anyone with up to date information...
   I have read that the doctors in the asylum did note that AA was not a virgin - is this evidence out of date? Did they confirm(or was it even medically posible at that time to confirm) if she had had a baby?

Not to put too fine a point on it -- but a woman can be  a 'non-virgin' without having produced children...
The whole "baby story" might be another elaborate invention!

[AGRBear]

While you were caring for your friend, we discussed the pregant AA situation.  Evidently doctors can tell if a girl/womanwas pregant.  However, I think I was left unsure about the months needed for a doctor to see these signs.  Probably longer than two one half months and into the third the uterus changes.  Right?  Wrong?  She could have naturally aborted the child after this time or carried it to full term.  Since AA said she had a child,  can we assume it went full term?  No.  

Some of us thought the child might have been her lovers whom she lost in the war.  And the lost of both child and lover may have been more than she could indure.

I am not sure how many times she was committed before the explosion at the factory.

Nor have I seen any ref. to how long she had worked at the factory.

Anyone recall where this discussion was?

There is so much we don't know.

Having gone back and listened to AA's voice on one of the tapes,  I can not tell her accent or if she had one.  Her words, "How shall I tell you...."  isn't the kind of sentence a  German would speak in English if German was their first language.  I remember the first time I heard her say this and it took me back because I've always thought she was FS.

There was something else.   Can't remember.  I'll have to go back and read the posts again.

AGRBear