Author Topic: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS  (Read 77177 times)

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Offline Vive_HIH_Aleksey

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #150 on: July 13, 2004, 01:23:48 PM »
I was VERY upset with the way they portrayed Aleksey in N&A. It wasn't fair to him. Suicide? The kid was bored and defiant, and too religious to even think of suicide IMHO.

The best Rasputin is and always will be Alan Rickman. I'm sure he'd be happy to reprise his role if they were to make a better N&A.

Yes, a lot of things are beign remade. A Christmas Story, Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory too, with Johnny Depp as Wonka.

The casting ideas are awesome. There are a few actors who I can think of who would be good Alekseys.

the boy from Master and Commander
the boy who played Alex from The Mummy Returns

Haley Joel Osmont is AMAZING, however he is a year and plus older than Aleksey :(

Someone suggested Elijah Wood? I hate to say it, because he is such a gifted actor, but a 25 year old man playing a 13-14 year old kid?
Hatred – this is a disgusting feeling. Yes, there is sport gambling, there is a striving to win. But to hate someone – this is awful! I think, that first of all you have to learn to respect your rival. -- Evgeni Plushenko

Offline Vive_HIH_Aleksey

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #151 on: July 13, 2004, 01:26:39 PM »
Oh, I can see Orlando Bloom playing Dmitri though, he is the romantic type, haha.
Hatred – this is a disgusting feeling. Yes, there is sport gambling, there is a striving to win. But to hate someone – this is awful! I think, that first of all you have to learn to respect your rival. -- Evgeni Plushenko

Janet_W.

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #152 on: July 13, 2004, 01:59:01 PM »
As I've probably mentioned in previous messages  :P , for me the 1971 film was the gateway to everything else. So, I admit to having a sentimental attachment! But I do think the people working on the film did their very best, considering the need to make it theatrically viable in terms of length, having to shoot elsewhere than Russia, etc.

Taking the film apart piece by piece . . . yes, there are things to dispute. Having Stolypin alive in 1913 is perhaps the most obvious "what the heck?!" moment, for anyone who is aware of dates. I also used to dispute the implication that Alexei was born during a wintery time. But, after viewing the film not so long ago, it seems a jump forward in time of at least two or three months is implied, from Alexei's birth to the snow scenes. (Plus, I remember being in Moscow in August and seeing people lining up at a store to buy fur hats!) So, that scene depicting N & A waving goodbye to OTMA as they go out to a party (which I recall was a b-day celebration for the Dowager Empress; anyone have her b-day date?) was meant to indicate a "fast forward" situation.

A number of scenes which did not show up in most of the theatrical versions did make it to at least a few of the televised airings and are part of the current DVD.  I have a few problems with some of them, but I understand, I think, what the screenwriters were aiming at. When you've got "x" number of minutes to convey a number of ideas, situations are compressed, elaborated, combined, and sometimes, yes, even created.  In a film representing a particular historical period, however, such license can be disturbing to those who are well-read in that area.

The scene that seems to have disburbed the most people--and I myself admit to being rather disarmed by it!--is the one of the girls in captivity being spied on by a soldier, and then Tatiana steps forward and briefly reveals herself to him.  When I saw that scene my immediate reaction was, "The screenwriter picked the wronnnnng daughter!" And I think most  of us who have read up on OTMA would say that Marie would have been the most likely to do such a thing . . . tho' I'm not saying any of the girls would have done so! But, in writing that scene, the screenwriter did convey that (1) the situation could be tense between the soldiers and OTMA  and (2) the girls suffered from, among other things, not being able to explore the very natural feelings that they surely must have felt.  (Read Anne Frank's diary--the unexpurgated version which includes info her father cut from the original published version--and you'll find she writes of sexual yearnings.)

The scene, also during their captivity,  in which Alexei and Nicholas have a rather contentious discussion? Well, we know that during that period Nicholas began to draw a few conclusions about mistakes he had made, and we also know that he was trying as much as possible to understand and get along with his captors, even as Alexandra remained aloof and rather haughty. Gilliard says that Alexei took the news of his father's abdication in a thoughtful manner, but I wouldn't doubt that later, with plenty of time to think about things and question--and isn't that what adolescents do?--Alexei might have challenged even his beloved Papa. At any rate, the scene did give the screenwriter an opportunity to show that Nicholas had gained some perspective.

Another scene which was usually chopped out of the commercial version shows Alexei having a nighmare and the entire family joining him, while Nicholas calmly explains that yes, the Archduke was assassinated, but all over Europe royal children are sleeping peacefully in their beds. (My own paraphrase, of course!) I very much like this scene because it illustrates (1) the Tsar's charm and parenting skills, and (2) the strong possibility that Nicholas really did believe that he and his family were safe. (Despite the fact that several of his relatives had fallen victim to terrorism, I would imagine that Nicholas--for self-preservation--could be in denial, just as much as any of us!)

Anyway, this is not meant to be a scene-by-scene dissection of the film, but more of an appreciation for what led so many of us to the study of the last Tsar, as well as a "caveat" that it is a dramatization, and not a documentary, and therefore may sometimes take artistic license.   :)

Robert_Hall

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #153 on: July 13, 2004, 02:29:50 PM »
Marie [Dagmar] was born 26 Nov. 1847, so it would have been a winter scene.
Cheers

Janet_W.

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #154 on: July 13, 2004, 02:43:13 PM »
Thanks, Robert!  :D

anna

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #155 on: July 13, 2004, 03:11:33 PM »
Janet,

You've said it all, what more can I say. But..... don't know why this film ( for me also the beginning) still does something with me. I must have seen the DVD a 100 times by now. Of course when I was twelve I looked at it with different eyes, didn't know anything of the real story. Now 33 years later I know better. Hollywood must known better :D
Still watching the last scene I hold my breath and I can feel my heart pounding, watching that dreadful clock and waiting for that door to open. Sometimes I stop the
film to prevent me watching that scene.

And Yes I'll never forgive Jane Fonda >:(

Anna

Annie

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #156 on: July 13, 2004, 03:59:37 PM »
Quote
Marie [Dagmar] was born 26 Nov. 1847, so it would have been a winter scene.
Cheers


They used the Mama's birthday thing as an excuse for the party, but don't forget, they had Alexei as a tiny baby who had not lost his bellybutton yet. Having had children myself, I can tell you the bellybutton scab falls off at like 2 weeks or less. The whole way they did that Alexei bleeding from the navel thing, they incorportated the mother's birthday, the blessing of the soldiers, and finally the 'baby's better!' the day of Bloody Sunday (Jan. 1905!) all while Alexei, born Aug. 12, 1904, had just lost his bellybutton? (you can clearly see the bloody bellybutton in the movie, and in real life that is when they first discovered the disease.)  All that should have happened no later than September :P Yet they stretch it out through events in November to January? Of course, the average person would not notice, or care like me. :-/

All these nitpicky things being said, I LIKE the movie and watch it at least once a month! :D I just think I could have written a better screenplay;)

Janet_W.

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #157 on: July 13, 2004, 04:00:57 PM »
Y'know, I don't think I've ever seen that last scene all the way through? I always close or avert my eyes, or stop the video tape or power off the DVD. The ticking clock (it is ticking, isn't it? Or is that my blood pulsing?) brings the whole thing home.  For several years afterward I would have nightmares about sitting there with them.  

But re: the Best Actress Oscar, I don't really blame Jane. Vanessa Redgrave didn't win for Mary, Queen of Scots, or Genivieve Bujold for Anne of the Thousand Days, or Judy Dench for Mrs. Brown , etc.  . . tho' J. Dench did win for Shakespeare in Love, and Katharine Hepburn as Eleanor of Aquataine (sp?!) did tie with Barbra Steisand. But usually depictions of female royalty garner nominations only!

anna

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #158 on: July 13, 2004, 04:36:01 PM »
well in mine opinion they could better gave that oscar to J.Dench for "Mrs Brown" Didn't think much of her role as Q Elisabeth I. Glenda Jackson did a far more better job  but that was a tv-serie.

The actor Timothy West ( did/does great shakespeare playes like Janet Suzman) who played the part of Dr. Botkin, is married to the actress Prunella Scales- famous for her role in" Fawlty towers". She just wonderful in her one-woman act of Queen Victoria. Anyone seen it??

Anna

Janet_W.

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #159 on: July 13, 2004, 05:22:40 PM »
Well, Judi (with an "i", I think, rather than the way I spelled it previously) could play the phone book and I'd love it . . . she's only in three or four scenes of Shakespeare in Love, but she plays them to the hilt, with a wonderful sort of dry wit and a certain amount of world-weary cynacism that I imagine the older Elizabeth Tudor had!  

Glenda Jackson, of course, plays a magnificent Elizabeth.

I had forgotten that Timothy West--who besides Dr. Botkin played Alix's uncle, King Edward VII, in the mini-series Edward the King--is married to Prunella Scales! It would be fascinating to see her Victoria, but I imagine you're talking London theater?

I'd like to put in a good word for Michael Jayston. Tho' his eyes aren't the same color as those of Nicholas, he conveyed the same warmth and kindliness as we've all read about. I also thought he embodied the right tone and personality, and was within the right age range. The actor who played Nicholas in the HBO Rasputin production--golly, can't remember his name at the moment--well, he's a wonderful actor and was very good in the role, but he was a little too old for Nicholas, as was the actress who played Alexandra too young for her role. In fact, instead of the four year difference that Alexandra and Nicholas had, it was more like Nicholas with his child bride! (Ian McKellan, that's the guy!  ::)   Soon or later things "click" in . . . )

Offline Vive_HIH_Aleksey

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #160 on: July 14, 2004, 04:20:13 AM »
Yes, Sir Ian McKellen LOL.

Timothy West also played King Francis in Ever After with Dougray Scott and Drew Barrymore. He's a great actor in that, I love his lines.

"You, son, are restricted to the grounds."
Prince Henry: "Are you putting ME under house arrest?"
"Do not mock me, boy, for I am in a foul disposition! And by God you will do as I say-
"Or what? You'd ship me to the Americas like some criminal? All for the sake of your stupid contract."
"YOU ARE THE CROWN-PRINCE OF FRANCE!"
"AND IT IS MY LIFE!"
Queen: "Francis, sit down before you have a stroke. Really, the two of you. Sweetheart, you were born to privelage, and with that comes- specific obligations.
"Forgive me, mother, but, marriage to a complete stranger never made anyone in this room very happy!"
King: "You will marry Gabriella by the next full moon or I will strike at you in any way I can!"
Prince: *sigh* What will it be, father? Hot oil or the rack?
"I will simply... deny you the crown, and live... forever!
"Good! Agreed! I DON'T WANT IT." (leaves)
"He's your son!"

haha couldn't help it!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Vive_HIH_Aleksey »
Hatred – this is a disgusting feeling. Yes, there is sport gambling, there is a striving to win. But to hate someone – this is awful! I think, that first of all you have to learn to respect your rival. -- Evgeni Plushenko

anna

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #161 on: July 14, 2004, 04:42:36 AM »
Janet, I think you mean the actress Greta Scacchi. Maybe nice to know, Ms Suzman directed her on stage in a comedy "The Guardsman".

Yes Ian Mckellan looked a bit too old playing Nicholas. Definitely I still think Michael Jayston has the best looks, and ooooh what a voice. As head of a call-centre I have something with voices. I get the shiver when I hear some british actors speak.
Most of the cast in the N&A  film were of British origin. They all started on stage - Tom Baker ( Dr. Who) --The National Theatre. J.Suzman-RSC. Ian Holm, T.West and of course the great Laurence Olivier. Most had met before in theatre, must have been a jolly nice bunch on the filmset.

Anna

Offline Vive_HIH_Aleksey

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #162 on: July 14, 2004, 05:01:32 AM »
Ian Holm?! OMG I LOVE him! Wasn't he the original Frodo in the BBC radio show of Lord of the Rings or something?

He was such a wonderful, charming Bilbo. I cried so much at the end of Return of the King. I'd love to see him reprise the role in The Hobbit.
Hatred – this is a disgusting feeling. Yes, there is sport gambling, there is a striving to win. But to hate someone – this is awful! I think, that first of all you have to learn to respect your rival. -- Evgeni Plushenko

Annie

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #163 on: July 14, 2004, 08:00:13 AM »
Didn't Jayston and Suzman play MacBeth and Lady MacBeth in something? I know I saw this on PBS many years ago, it was her for sure, I think it was him too.

anna

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Re: Rough List of Romanovs on DVDs and VHS
« Reply #164 on: July 14, 2004, 09:24:39 AM »
Janet Suzman did play Lady Macbeth, Eric Porter was her co-actor as Macbeth, and not Michael Jayston.This was on tv the  Play of the month in 1970. Ms. Suzman is famous for her role as Cleopatra on stage and later tv in 1972, directed by her (at that time)husband Trevor Nunn.

Michael Jayston was with the RSC in 1965, together with Ian Holm. They did Henry V. Ian - HenryV and Michael - Duke of Exeter.

Anna