Old Believers

[Dashkova]

This topic was suggested since the Great Schism was such a dramatic, and for many, traumatic, event of the 17th century.

Discussions might include the "three vs two" fingers methods of crossing oneself, how this is interpreted in art and icons, why Nikon was so insistent, and what it meant to be part of an Old Believer community.

These communities still exist today in Russia.

[Louise]

I have only ever read about Old Believers in Bruce Lincoln's book on the Romanov's. What other books are out there, that I can check out?

Where the Old Believers still persecuted throughout the reigns of other Romanovs? It seems to sound alot like the split in the Church during Henry VIII's reign.

Any information/history lesson would be welcomed.

Louise

[LisaDavidson]

The Old Believers date from the 17th century and at one time comprised about 10% of the population of Russia. I believe Nicholas II was responsible for ending much of the repression of the OB's.

They were probably wiped out or close to it under the Bolsheviks.

Sorry, I don't remember more than this.

[Dashkova]

From my limited understanding, over the years Old Believers were simply left alone, thought of as kind of weird by some, respected by others for their piety.  Somewhat similar to how many Americans view Amish:  quaint, a bit odd, but obviously religious.  My own Russian family members look upon these people as just very devout and serious about their faith, and that they *live* their faith.

I'm not totally sure about how they were dealt with during the Soviet era.  One thing that always bugs me is how many people in Western countries have this huge belief in the "Iron Curtain" and people having to read Bibles in their basements using flashlights. Not so, unless you're talking about *protestant* faiths.  Russian Orthodoxy was not encouraged (atheism was) but it *was* very much tolerated, at least in some parts of the country. Therefore, the "ultra Orthodox" (Old Believers) probably were not bothered too much.  After all, it was the Soviet Union that encouraged the culture, language and beliefs of various ethnicities, perhaps Old Believers were included in this.  But again, I am not 100 percent sure about this.

[rskkiya]

I know that some OB emegrated to Alaska in the 1840s back when it was still a part of Russia...and there were groups of Old Believers still going "strong" in remoter sections of Siberia during the early 20th century...On my first visit to the local Russian Orthodox church -- I was informed that while there were some OB in the area  but that they would never visit that church.

R.

[Mike]

The Old Believers were merely tolerated by the Soviet regime, and only to a smallest degree: they weren't declared illegal as many other Christian and non-Christian confessions. In Moscow they were allowed to keep a sort of community center at the Rogozhskoye cemetery and to print prayer books. Outside Moscow they maintained low-profile prayer houses. They fared slightly better in non-Slavic republics of the former USSR: Estonia, Lithuania, Moldavia, Georgia, Kirgizia, where the links between local authorities and the official Orthodox church were weaker and the native population sympathized with hard-working, sober and devouted Old Believer "dissenters".

There are many web resources on them - just search Google or Yahoo for "Russian Old Believers".

[Dimitrian]

Hey wat s up so wat is this thing bout the old believers. just want to find out cause im one of them an live in ak

[ChristineM]

For anyone wishing to experience a flavour of the 'Old Believers' and the aftermath of the schism in the Russian Orthodox Church, I cannot recommend highly enough the opera 'Khovanshchina' by Modest Mussorgsky.  

It is long - four and a half hours - and some scenes are a bit harrowing.   I think it may be possible to get a video copy of the Mariinsky Theatre's production of the opera.  

Of course nothing replaces the live event, but unforunately it is not often staged outside Russia because everything about it is of mammoth proportions.   It requires a considerable attention span, but there are at least five intervals.   Should the opportunity ever avail itself, I would urge anyone with an interest in the subject who loves music not to miss this.

tsaria  

[pookiepie]

i have just found a book on my home shelf about this. it's called Lost in the Taiga by Vasily Peskov. it's about a family of old believers living in siberia totally cut off from the rest of the world. i just started it but it looks great. what the author wants to know is how they managed to survive in such a climate, aren't they lonely, curious, etc... Even their language is different.